Why were the siege battles fixed by a modder and not by TaleWorlds?

What could be the reason?

  • TaleWorlds completely remake the siege battles?

    Votes: 13 52.0%
  • TaleWorlds is holding back the fixes for a new mechanic?

    Votes: 12 48.0%

  • Total voters
    25

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Bunduk

Veteran
M&BWBNWVC
I just can't believe how a single modder has solved the Siege problem so perfectly and TaleWorlds with 100 employees still hasn't managed it after 1 and a half years. What could be the reason?


 

bestmods168

Sergeant
You should start a series: Lukar's Believe It or Not.
Don't forget that there are office politics for any company. There are things an employee is allowed and not allowed to do.
That's why I probably won't be allowed to work any most companies. I'd be like, "F_uk the boss!" Secretly implements the fix.
 

Antaeus

Sergeant at Arms
I just can't believe how a single modder has solved the Siege problem so perfectly and TaleWorlds with 100 employees still hasn't managed it after 1 and a half years. What could be the reason?

To answer the OP's question...

We don't know. But can hazard a number of reasonable guesses:

1. Modders aren't concerned about knock-on effects that the changes they might make have on other aspects of the game. Devs are, so have to take a more holistic approach to changes.
2. For devs, Efficient changes that might be necessary might be tied up in other aspects of the game that are either not complete, or unresolved.
3. For devs, It's possible that there may be planned changes to large chunks of code that might impact on siege behaviour, rendering solving individual issues in current sections of code a waste of time if larger rewrites are scheduled.
4. It may be considered lower priority than other issues, therefore down the to-do list.
5. There may have been some unforeseen issues with required fixes that have left the issue on the back-burner.
6. It may be tied up in other behavioural mechanics that are still unresolved

But the one thing we know for sure, is that there is a reason - because we don't know what that reason is, we can speculate. How we speculate depends on our personality. Some will joke about it, some will cry about it, some will be aghast as to why, some will rationalise. But all is just speculation.
 

CrazyElf

Sergeant
To answer the OP's question...

We don't know. But can hazard a number of reasonable guesses:

4. It may be considered lower priority than other issues, therefore down the to-do list.

I can't see 4 as being a defensible position at all.

Taleworlds devs have said before that they are aware that this is a problem in the past and frankly, even if that were not true, sieges are one of the most important parts of the game.


As many as a third of all battles can be sieges. Siege towers not working is a game breaking mechanic.

The rest I can see as possible. For now though, I think that alongside Realistic Battle Mod, the mod IMO is so good that it should be absorbed into the game. Sure - it should be tested for compatibility, but there's nothing better right now.

Sure, it may be a temporary fix, but what has been accomplished has been far better than anything else that has been released. At the very least, it should be used as a temporary fix until the proper Taleworlds fix eventually comes out, which could be months away.
 
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Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
Because the issue with siege battles was more than just siege towers not working.
 

CrazyElf

Sergeant
Because the issue with siege battles was more than just siege towers not working.

It was not the only problem, but it was one of the most glaring ones and there have been tons of threads trying to draw attention to it.
 

MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
We don't know. But can hazard a number of reasonable guesses:

1. Modders aren't concerned about knock-on effects that the changes they might make have on other aspects of the game. Devs are, so have to take a more holistic approach to changes.
2. For devs, Efficient changes that might be necessary might be tied up in other aspects of the game that are either not complete, or unresolved.
3. For devs, It's possible that there may be planned changes to large chunks of code that might impact on siege behaviour, rendering solving individual issues in current sections of code a waste of time if larger rewrites are scheduled.
4. It may be considered lower priority than other issues, therefore down the to-do list.
5. There may have been some unforeseen issues with required fixes that have left the issue on the back-burner.
6. It may be tied up in other behavioural mechanics that are still unresolved
While these are reasonable guesses, that doesn't mean they are justified.
One of the TW priorities should be offering temporary fixes to improve player experience during the EA (and hopefully retain them until the DLCs), but they consistently disregarded simple to do QoL fixes and tweaks because they were not in their immediate plans. It's like they don't care about frustrated players and only care about their next immediate task, which is set by someone who doesn't read feedback and doesn't play the game.

They do offer hotfixes immediately after they break something, so that part is good. But if something is broken for a long time, there's no sense of urgency to fix it.
 

Antaeus

Sergeant at Arms
While these are reasonable guesses, that doesn't mean they are justified.
One of the TW priorities should be offering temporary fixes to improve player experience during the EA (and hopefully retain them until the DLCs).

I'm not sure I agree. I can tell you as part of a development team, that temporary patch up jobs should be avoided at all costs, because you often never get given the opportunity to go back and fix things up properly and the patch job becomes permanent - as does any flow on issues. You're left with inefficient code, and that might inadvertently contribute to problems for other people who might have a hard time untangling your patch up.

I think that because this is such a widely reported issue, that is taking an extended period of time to fix, it is reasonable of us to inquire as to what the status is. But I'd prefer to wait so that it is solved properly, rather than in a way that is likely to lead to other issues down the track.
 

Bannerdog

Recruit
Because an unpaid modder has the luxury of working on anything they please, and can obsessively focus all of their energies, at any hour of day and night they please, into doing one thing until they are successful. Taleworlds devs are, because of how development time is usually allocated and budgeted and strictly micromanaged, are under very specific orders of what they can work on. Clearly their Dev leads did not consider this a topic worth putting dedicated time into, hence why it has gone unfixed for so long.

Plenty of similarly stupid examples of long-standing bugs or glitches that were fixed by modders can be found in games like Total War Warhammer.

Yes it sucks that their management don't prioritise game-breaking things like this, but that's the reality of the situation. Also bear in mind that this mod is not a "perfect fix", it is a temporary workaround that is not in line with Taleworlds implementation (it removes things that confuse the AI in order to work) hence why they would not have done the same thing.
 

Thrangor88

Recruit
The mod only changes the siege tower, but not the ladders ... so not the overall behavior of the AI. I think tales is trying to change the AI and not a particular object, apart from the mod doesn't change their behavior on scales it seems, so you only have half of the scales that are used. So a good mod, not a good dev patch^^
 

mikeboix

Master Knight
WBNWWF&SM&BVC
We will never know the reason because Taleworlds doesn't ****ing care to explain to us.
They just don't care anymore.
 

JimmyCakes

Regular
It comes down to leadership and will power. If no one at the top cares but they are controlling about who does what then it slows the whole development process down.
 
One of the issues with TW (and this one is not debatable in my opinion) is that they dont fix game breaking stuff the is immediatly visible to anyone who playes the game for few minutes or hours. Designers / managers are simply absolutely out of touch with playerbase. Siege tower fix not being top priority for a product that is publicily sold to consumers when you advertise sieges a lot in the webstore is bordering on sabotage.
 

KingEroc1st

Veteran
for a game so adequately named "MOUNT AND BLADE: BANNERLORD"
it sure has not put any priority in mounted combat, and banners.
i go into an arena and see people on horseback swinging at the air because the ai has no idea where they are and where the enemies are... it's so sad...
horses come to a complete stop the moment they touch another horse...
modders put up functioning banner mods since April 2020... and continue to update (now they can be equipped on back instead of taking up the shield slot)
 
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