Why there is not camel riding unit in any troop tree

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NachoDawg said:
I wonder what happens after battle if a cavalry unit loses their mount. Will you have an unmounted knight joining with the infantry until you give them a new horse? hmm.
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I don't think that for upgrading troops we'll need a particular type of horse or camel :smile:, for me it would be easier to do so with a simple horse.

The same I think should be, and as I presume is, in situation when troop loses their mount. Mount should be reinforced with the first in queue horse or camel that is present in inventory. Looking for special kind of mount after the battle when you are on enemy territory will effect that in no time your mounted Vlandian heavy cavalry squad ends up like a band of pikemen using lances as pikes.

Going back to Piconi's opinion, I hope that there are some minor or special troop trees because, as we could see on gameplays, the have to be cataphracts somewhere.
 
The real question is; will we have armoured camelry?

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Currently, only the Jawwal Camel Rider and the Jawwal Bedouin have camels. Normal camels and war camels, with the war camels having higher stats.
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Dejan said:
Currently, only the Jawwal Camel Rider and the Jawwal Bedouin have camels. Normal camels and war camels, with the war camels having higher stats.
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You missed Ghulam. Also, in case you are not aware, this thread was created before the early access release.
 
I wonder how true it was that horses unused to and unexposed to camels were afraid of them? Could lead to some interesting match-ups if Aserai camel cavalry faces off against Vlandian knights or another northern cavalry army and that kind of mechanic was added.

Because honestly, without that kind of mechanic it's not worth using camels as cavalry. They're not as fast, not quite as strong and not as good at charging into the enemy. A warhorse was superior to a warcamel in battle (is warcamel a word? lol) and a camel was superior to a horse for baggage and logistics in the hotter desert climates.
 
Ted Striker said:
I wonder how true it was that horses unused to and unexposed to camels were afraid of them? Could lead to some interesting match-ups if Aserai camel cavalry faces off against Vlandian knights or another northern cavalry army and that kind of mechanic was added.

Because honestly, without that kind of mechanic it's not worth using camels as cavalry. They're not as fast, not quite as strong and not as good at charging into the enemy. A warhorse was superior to a warcamel in battle (is warcamel a word? lol) and a camel was superior to a horse for baggage and logistics in the hotter desert climates.
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Historically, scaring horses wasn't the main reason that camels were used in warfare. It also doesn't mean that horses would always be scared of camels; it's mostly about the horse getting used to see a camel and be familiar with its smell.

The battle of Thymbra (Persians x Lydians) is probably the one and only origin where the "myth" came from. Herodotus mentioned that the camels were unloaded and put in the frontline in order to scare the Lydian horses, since Lydian cavalry was fierce and feared by their opponents; Darius army started to move towards the Lydian army, and eventually their horses went into disarray. The Lydians realized what was going on and decided to jump off their horses and fight on foot...a fierce battle followed, but the Lydians pulled back to the city.


Their main use was actually logistical...pack animal/mobility/patrol/survival in the desert. They also could be deployed as a strategic mount for infantry, which doesn't make them a cavalry per se, but it gave a distinct logistical advantage to fight other troops on foot. Usually, the soldiers would dismount and fight instead of charging against other cavalry, even though there were instances where they have been used as skirmisher mounted archers by Parthians.
 
That + horses can be trained through exposure to be OK with camels just like they can be trained to be OK alongside anything loud or different... eg. running carriages in modern cities alongside trams, cars, trains....

You'd be surprised how comfortable some are in chaotic situations - like trundling along while motorbikes weave between them or overloaded busses pushing up against them... Some horses will always be skittish... But they wouldn't make good war horses and I imagine they would have been weeded out just like we weed out horses with the wrong temperament now... Otherwise it is unfamiliarity that creates fear.

I'd love a few more camel units... but camel riding for the player is only a novel activity. They're too vulnerable without real armour. I do like to collect them tho. And prior to the new battle system, I used to run a body guard of captured Ghulam and Jawwal. Ghulam would be absolute tanks with armoured camels. I'd love to be able to buy camels, maybe from the deep desert towns or suchlike.
 
I love how camels can be consumed to upgrade troops. It's be so funny if it would actually spawn a normal troop on a camel or war camel if you did that. I guess if you were really motivated (I kind of am...) you could end up with a full load of khans guard on war camels if it worked that way. But of course it doesn't, the camel gets foot bound and forced into the horse armor and becomes whatever the troops uses.
 
Carmel is more useful for transport goods in dry desert more than horse do while horse is better in war more than carmel, I think horse is one most animal that used for war till technology changed (I think it's take world war 2 then most or everyone stop using horse after world war 2 (Yes there is horse in world war 2 but very rare and more for transportation rather than fighting) Horse is almost used for war for thousands years, as it's most popular and most use more than any other beast, till technology changed, (I think currently beast most used for war are dog, mostly german shepherd still used today for war and police, dog is more for hunt down, search or locked person down more than fighting, I think)

Don't get me wrong, it's would be funny to ride elephant and shoot arrow in this game, but downside it's slow and not sure able to run away army that easy. I prefer horse, it's easy and fastest to get in and get out. Carmel is slower but useful in dry air, I guess like in desert but not for fighting. If trading, carmel is cheaper, last longer than horse but slow. If fighting? I prefer horse over camel or elephant any day due speed and reasonable power over normal one) Of course we talk about middle age, Not tech age.

I had war carmel, best way to save is put in your civil clothing, that way, troop upgrade won't use that. My battle clothing mostly of time horse or foot walk.
 
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Every faction should have bandit hunters that can be bought and created.

This would be the major time you’d see Camelry out in the desert.

In larger engagements past antiquity, they were almost solely used as skirmish mounts, throwing Javelins. Sassanids do have some records of using armor camel riders as rear guard, but it wasn’t noted as particularly effective at that stage (though this applies to 50% if not more of things you see in historical and history inspired games, so that shouldn’t be a disqualifying factor).

One of the devs responded to me a while back that it was a bug that pack camels, camels, and war camels weren’t being produced at Aserai Horse towns and it was something they were fixing. Seems to still be an ongoing or non-priority issue.

It’s a shame they feel that “all lines should end at rank 5” in Bannerlord as Camelry would be the exact unit that would seem to top at at rank 4, but plenty of players would like to use them for aesthetics and play against them more often. They are certainly under represented for a game that is supposed to be an amalgamation of the time period from post antiquity to pre-crusades.
 
So I found the ghulam he is a beautiful specimen of heavy camel cav except I think there is an issue with him he has a complete set of tier 6 gear and a tier 1 camel it just seems like he was supposed to receive an armored war camel. Branching from their the persian empire throughout its life (consider the aserai are clearly Persian from before the sultanate of rum), held a division of camel riders about 20,000 Cyrus the great removed 2000 of the camels from his baggage train and led them into battle when outnumbered 6 to one against horses. Reports state that he had armed 2 men to each camel and the smell of camels makes horses uneasy and unwilling to cooperate on top of this camels are much more maneuverable in desert plains. In the game I notice troops on camel sit higher up than horse mounted troops. I'd love to see a passive boost to camel cav or negative to horse either moral to horse cav in the dessert against camels or a negative to riding skill or maybe even a two unit camel cav swordsman archer. Sorry for rambling
 
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