SAUS
Veteran
I was reading this random thread here:
https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,243410.0.html
and it got me thinking. What is it that keeps me coming back / playing warband? I figured I shouldn't bump that thread, so I'll make my own list:
1) While the combat is not perfect and the enemy AI is typically bad, it allows the player to be superior to the enemy. I maybe have an easy time winning vs any equal-size enemy army, but in order to truly strive in this game, you have to be beating easily up to 5x your party size.
2) The ability to die! In typical RPGs, you just turn into a mega beefcake monster and destroy everything (or you fight something a bit hard and maybe manage to beat it). In Skyrim, I play on legendary difficulty from the start of a new game. It is fun because you must cheese things to win (optimal strategies are most fun when they are necessary). It's fun, but also really silly / unrealistic-feeling. In warband, the hardest difficulty actually feels the most normal. You simply take as much damage as your enemies, they are less dumb about combat, and they amass big armies to try to kill you. The hardest difficulty is actually just normal difficulty, and you have it easy if you don't play hard mode.
3) Character progression. Above levels and actual character improvement, you build relations with villages, lords, etc. Your army and your companions also increase in power. Without magic items and the way the character stats are set up, leveling up doesn't make you THAT much stronger than when you start out (a lot of it is gear and weapon proficiency with a few critical skills that you need a bit of). In the very late game, you might be some powerful warlord (30 STR and you have tons of renown and stuff), but you would still probably lose if your horse got taken out and 5 swadian knights charged at you. But even then, this leads to my next point:
4) Skill in combat. You don't get free auto attacks. Blocking is difficult - but with no chip damage, blocking correctly pays off. Paying attention to surroundings to protect yourself from random lancings or crashing into a tree - there's so many things that allow you to actually be better at fighting, and none of them are simply being stronger. There's even hit localization for melee attacks. Also don't forget the speed bonus mechanics which make mounted combat the best I have ever played. It's even super satisfying when you deal way more damage than necessary - the critical hits (morning star through the back of a recruit's head) are not random-based. You FEEL the critical hit and it feels good. So when you DO beat those 5 swadian knights while unmounted (maybe some goofy strategy involving a tree for cover), you feel like a BOSS!! In most RPGs, it feels like you are just not strong enough to beat something - typically in turn-based RPGs - and the only way to win is to farm up more before trying again.
5) The battles are only HALF the battle! There is a whole overworld to play in. Defeating one lord is super easy, but maybe taking out that 150-man party before taking on the rest of their army means the difference between losing your town as opposed to routing and killing a 1000-man army. There's plenty of strategy with geography - where will your territory end up if you take these castles? Maybe you should wait to take them. Etc.
6) The real-time-ness of the overworld makes it feel so much more urgent. You really do get to live care-free at the start, and then you slowly get locked into a large commitment. There's many points where I don't even know how I want to proceed because there's so many unknowns. You decide to start your own kingdom, and then 1000 enemies show up at your doorstep. This is not like a typical RPG where you decide "I am not ready for this boss" so you go and farm for 10 hours. You must deal with that army NOW or they will take your territory from you.
Despite its flaws, the reason I keep playing warband is because the highs are absolutely unmatched for a single-player game. You can win in battles that you "shouldn't" be able to win by using strategy and skill in combat. You can pick apart enemy armies with overworld strategies. You can overpower larger forces with powerful troops. Heck, you can even be sneaky and slip your way into a castle (infantry not guarding the top of the ladder closely enough) and then assassinate their troops from a safe point inside the castle! Your character level is super crucial, but it also doesn't matter much. You get that nice character progression, but most of your ability comes from strategy in the overworld, and tactics and combat skill in battles. I haven't played a single player game that tests my skills the way warband does, so it always has me crawling back, even after long breaks.
https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,243410.0.html
and it got me thinking. What is it that keeps me coming back / playing warband? I figured I shouldn't bump that thread, so I'll make my own list:
1) While the combat is not perfect and the enemy AI is typically bad, it allows the player to be superior to the enemy. I maybe have an easy time winning vs any equal-size enemy army, but in order to truly strive in this game, you have to be beating easily up to 5x your party size.
2) The ability to die! In typical RPGs, you just turn into a mega beefcake monster and destroy everything (or you fight something a bit hard and maybe manage to beat it). In Skyrim, I play on legendary difficulty from the start of a new game. It is fun because you must cheese things to win (optimal strategies are most fun when they are necessary). It's fun, but also really silly / unrealistic-feeling. In warband, the hardest difficulty actually feels the most normal. You simply take as much damage as your enemies, they are less dumb about combat, and they amass big armies to try to kill you. The hardest difficulty is actually just normal difficulty, and you have it easy if you don't play hard mode.
3) Character progression. Above levels and actual character improvement, you build relations with villages, lords, etc. Your army and your companions also increase in power. Without magic items and the way the character stats are set up, leveling up doesn't make you THAT much stronger than when you start out (a lot of it is gear and weapon proficiency with a few critical skills that you need a bit of). In the very late game, you might be some powerful warlord (30 STR and you have tons of renown and stuff), but you would still probably lose if your horse got taken out and 5 swadian knights charged at you. But even then, this leads to my next point:
4) Skill in combat. You don't get free auto attacks. Blocking is difficult - but with no chip damage, blocking correctly pays off. Paying attention to surroundings to protect yourself from random lancings or crashing into a tree - there's so many things that allow you to actually be better at fighting, and none of them are simply being stronger. There's even hit localization for melee attacks. Also don't forget the speed bonus mechanics which make mounted combat the best I have ever played. It's even super satisfying when you deal way more damage than necessary - the critical hits (morning star through the back of a recruit's head) are not random-based. You FEEL the critical hit and it feels good. So when you DO beat those 5 swadian knights while unmounted (maybe some goofy strategy involving a tree for cover), you feel like a BOSS!! In most RPGs, it feels like you are just not strong enough to beat something - typically in turn-based RPGs - and the only way to win is to farm up more before trying again.
5) The battles are only HALF the battle! There is a whole overworld to play in. Defeating one lord is super easy, but maybe taking out that 150-man party before taking on the rest of their army means the difference between losing your town as opposed to routing and killing a 1000-man army. There's plenty of strategy with geography - where will your territory end up if you take these castles? Maybe you should wait to take them. Etc.
6) The real-time-ness of the overworld makes it feel so much more urgent. You really do get to live care-free at the start, and then you slowly get locked into a large commitment. There's many points where I don't even know how I want to proceed because there's so many unknowns. You decide to start your own kingdom, and then 1000 enemies show up at your doorstep. This is not like a typical RPG where you decide "I am not ready for this boss" so you go and farm for 10 hours. You must deal with that army NOW or they will take your territory from you.
Despite its flaws, the reason I keep playing warband is because the highs are absolutely unmatched for a single-player game. You can win in battles that you "shouldn't" be able to win by using strategy and skill in combat. You can pick apart enemy armies with overworld strategies. You can overpower larger forces with powerful troops. Heck, you can even be sneaky and slip your way into a castle (infantry not guarding the top of the ladder closely enough) and then assassinate their troops from a safe point inside the castle! Your character level is super crucial, but it also doesn't matter much. You get that nice character progression, but most of your ability comes from strategy in the overworld, and tactics and combat skill in battles. I haven't played a single player game that tests my skills the way warband does, so it always has me crawling back, even after long breaks.
