Who's going back to Warband?

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been playing Mount and Blade since I think .404 release.... I think that was it. There was only 4-5 city/villages total in game and the Dark Knights terrorized the lands! However I am definitely not to pleased with the Fire and Sword release even though it was not developed by TalesWorld it still bares there name therefore they will be seen as responsible to those who do buy it and hate it and can hurt future sales for them.

I'll probably end up playing a bit more just to go through everything I can. With less then few hours I have 74 troops but I am playing on Normal Difficulty and thankfully I am cause like someone else has posted the AI can have some wicked accuracy from across the map with those muskets.

Taking away the ability to create your own nation is a big blow cause this game is made for such whether Talesworld intended it to be or not. I would hope Talesworld is working on that feature and enhancing that with more options for the player such as Recruit Generals cause not all of us want to grind missions for a Lord to like us and join us and I don't know why Warband doesn't allow us to recruit a Lord but regular mount and blade does, creating your own style troops that upgrade to your design, more better diplomacy, and battle formations.  I know there are mods out here for this but just seems for FaS it was not a concern.

But really Warband is far better then FaS however thankfully it is priced at $15 and not $50 like some other BS games out there.

 
SKnight said:
been playing Mount and Blade since I think .404 release.... I think that was it. There was only 4-5 city/villages total in game and the Dark Knights terrorized the lands! However I am definitely not to pleased with the Fire and Sword release even though it was not developed by TalesWorld it still bares there name therefore they will be seen as responsible to those who do buy it and hate it and can hurt future sales for them.

I'll probably end up playing a bit more just to go through everything I can. With less then few hours I have 74 troops but I am playing on Normal Difficulty and thankfully I am cause like someone else has posted the AI can have some wicked accuracy from across the map with those muskets.

Taking away the ability to create your own nation is a big blow cause this game is made for such whether Talesworld intended it to be or not. I would hope Talesworld is working on that feature and enhancing that with more options for the player such as Recruit Generals cause not all of us want to grind missions for a Lord to like us and join us and I don't know why Warband doesn't allow us to recruit a Lord but regular mount and blade does, creating your own style troops that upgrade to your design, more better diplomacy, and battle formations.  I know there are mods out here for this but just seems for FaS it was not a concern.

But really Warband is far better then FaS however thankfully it is priced at $15 and not $50 like some other BS games out there.

Great post, I simply don't understand why the WFaS devs decided to throw basic features out of the window. I hope they'll release updates and support this expandamod properly.

Where's constable Hareck when you need him?  :razz:
 
vyyye said:
Frosty. said:
Going back? I'm playing both, since they are different and I think thats what people forget, that games are different.
It's not like it's an entirely new game. It's Warband with some new features, some features removed and guns (badly in my opinion) implemented.

Why badly implemented?
 
1 hour is not a good enough time to assess Fire & Sword for me, because I need some time to test out the new buildings that can be built.

I have always been more interested in nurturing and growth rather than war. I remember in M&B1, instead of following my Leader in war and glory for castles and towns, I ignored his call and just wanted to help my first village. And war was a huge hindrance to my peace-loving sheenanigans. Crazy I know.

That's all I care about, growth, nurturing, and making people happy. Peace > War.

Though I have seen and heard some things which I feel should be addressed. Why use M&B1's outdated formula for determining who gets land, when the democratic approach in Warband is better? The codes are already there, why revert to an inferior formula?
 
I have played Fire and Sword for 1.5 hours and I will be going back to Warband. I mention the time to give defenders of the game a chance to explain, if they exist, some of the later elements that might make it redeemable. I find it, and believe me I wanted this game to be good, of less overall quality than some of the free Warband mods you can download. I compare Fire and Sword to say, Teatrc's 'The Eagle and the Radiant Cross' mod for Warband, and with the exception of 'terrain texture quality', Teatrc's is far superior.  I'll explain why:
:neutral: Battle continuation: This is a huge flaw. In a game where firearms are the norm, having to feed your army to the auto-calculation monster every time some random brigand gets a lucky hit in, even if your force far outnumbers and out-classes theirs, is horrible. It also restricts the player's ability to 'watch' the battle as they only way to ensure victory is to stay out of the line of fire. Teatrc has battle continuation.
:neutral: Diplomacy: I could be wrong about this, but so far the game does not seem to incorporate any of the elements of the basic 'diplomacy mod' which is staple of any version of Warband that wants to be taken seriously. Diplomatic interaction seems to be limited to war and peace. There are no Non-Aggression Pacts or Defensive Alliances. I guarantee that such political elements not only existed during this time, but were fundamental components of the era. Teatrc has Diplomacy.

(By now many of you are probably saying ‘go and play Teatrcs mod then’. I plan to, but my point is that a professionally designed mode that costs 30 bucks on steam should, I think, contain more than a free mod made by someone who is not professional. The identification of games that do not hold to this truth increases the integrity of the market).

:neutral: The Campaign Map: The map is historically accurate with regards to most town placements (I compared it to a 17th Century map from the University of Queensland) but the terrain is horribly simple. It is flat and undetailed. This may be true of the region to a certain extent, but the terrain was more varied than is depicted. It is just, essentially, a flat canvas. Not only that but the ‘edges’ of the map look incomplete and jagged, as though a time-pressed Modder made it. Disappointing.

:neutral: Textures and models: The textures are ‘different’. They look smoother and more refined than Warband, but this probably has more to do with the character models being less ‘blocky’. The campaign map texturing is good, but it is also plain and a little boring (my opinion only I know). I found it generally to have an unreal feel, as though I were fighting fine-pressed and gleaming brigands rather than dirty villains. Also, many of the looters are wearing this odd (and not historically accurate) coat with a red braid along the chest which makes them look not unlike men in business suits, at least at first glance. The blood textures are far too vague to be appreciated, and have definitely not advanced from Warband. Lastly, the smoke effects are extremely weak. Almost every musket mod I have ever played from Warband has had better and more realistic smoke effects.

:neutral: Sounds: Sounds are Okay.

In short, this game is nothing more, at the moment at least, than an inferior mod for Warband. For something that has to be paid for, this game is extremely disappointing. Just for the record, I am going to continue playing it for a few more hours, just to give it some more time to become fun or at the very least comparable to mods made by amateurs between jobs. Overall score 4/10 and that is being generous and acknowledging the fact that I am a Warband fan. For context, I would give native Warband 7/10 when it was new and untried. Eagle and the Radiant Cross 8/10, an excellent mod. And my personal favourite, Brytenwalda 9/10. Going back to Warband? Hell yes. 
 
HopeSlayer said:
warband for sure... can't get f&s working.. avangate service is nonexistant.. I want my money back I can't even download.
I hope by this point you've found the download. It's been staring you in the face on Taleworlds' website. Oh, and "can't get working" =/= "can't download".
 
Sushiman said:
bluebogle said:
Gaunt said:
As people said earlier, this isn't meant to replace warband, it's just another game. But anyway, I am really enjoying it.

It's advertised as a stand alone expansion. That doesn't sound like "another game."

What else does "stand-alone expansion" sound like, then?

It sounds like it should "expand" on the previous model.
 
Sushiman said:
Well it has, namely with the addition of firearms and a story.

Sorry, I can get firearms and story ... and oh soooo much more from user made mods that look more professional and are better designed...and are free! That is not just an opinion, it is a simple reflection of graphical quality, options and playability.  I just had a friend over (also a big fan of warband) and after playing it for another half an hour we were laughing at how pathetic this is compared to what is out there in the modding community. The textures in the inventory screen alone look like the old brick-textures you used to get on old 386 games. That being said, being 'pathetic' compared to warband is still pretty good compared to other games out there, as the whole concept is great. Was this the first Mount & Blade game I played, I would have been impressed. Sadly, it is not my first experience, and it constitutes an incredible step backwards in the genre. 
 
yeah im going back to warband but i hope mods dont port to WFAS now...is there a reason for that to happen? i mean hagemony for example is for warband is there any reason to change to WFAS any new features mods could use? mod tools or ...?
 
Played the original Mount and Blade since .6XX something. Played well over 100+ hours on the original. Also have owned Warband from the get-go, with well over 200 hours in SP alone, not including more than 2x that in multiplayer. I have now sunk in 17 hours in WF&S and well... it is just goddamn awful. It is far below the standards I have come to expect from Taleworlds. My understanding of expansions, since, you know, like the good old days of Diablo 2+etc--regardless of genre, were that the expansions expanded on what already had been set in place in the prior game. As normal sane person, thought progression went like this since it was advertised as an expansion. "M&B is good ----> Warband expanded on M&B and made it better ----> WF&S should expand on Warband and make it better" << This is what I thought I was getting anyway. Oh boy, was I mistaken.

Instead I paid for a scripted firearms mod and its a poorly done one at that.

Pro's
-I like the 3 musketeers-esque era.
-I like the muskets and simple firearms.
-I like the silly hats.
-Troop equipment is customizable and upgradable.

Con's
-Nation building is removed.
-Gender change is removed.
-Marriage is removed.
-Variety of horses, melee weapons, and armors have all been horribly crippled.
-Invisible walls in towns. (Towns are not actually bigger. Its just an illusion.... )
-Balance issues with regards to AI and firearm use.****
-Flat world map.
-Flat and redundant castles to seige.
-Lack of varied terrain to fight on. (No swamps? mountains? deserts? all of which Poland alone has...)
-Can no longer stay in the battle when dead and watch the fight proceed.
-Cannot upgrade units/no unit tree.
-On the world map, some bridges are under terrain/water. (Extremely sloppy/lazy work imo.)
-Castles and towns are indistinguishable from each other.
-Tournaments gone (okay, I understand for historical accuracy.. pistol duels or fencing anyone?)

There are others but those have stuck out in my head the most.

****Now im no stranger to using tactics, even in Warband where it wasnt necessary. But the level of accuracy in the hands of the AI is just absurd at times. Getting headshotted happens on a regular basis, regardless of what im doing on the battlefield, other than hiding behind a hill and unable to see combat. Its also quite annoying to see flanking dragoons which you know were used against musket lines QUITE OFTEN in history... to get butchered at least 2:1. +60 dragoons and myself flanking about 70 faction musketeers so that my infantry could move in close while my musketeers harassed from the hills. battle outcome: 63 faction troops killed +7 wounded. My team. 77 dead. 14 wounded. All 4 of my NPC characters wounded. My courser died early in the fight i spent most of the battle trying to avoid musket fire rather unsuccessfully at times.

I'll give it a few more hours today to explore some things. But so far WF&S has been nothing but a huge disappointment. This "expand-alone" had been more of a "shrink-alone".. and at this rate its going to be a "left to die-alone" for me.
 
Yeah.... so.... I've played the game now.... for a few hours.... aaand.... I've read the entire thread.. and uh...... there are some likes and.. some dislikes.. of this, "new", game.

I'll just go ahead and throw you my personal opinion of Fire & Sword.
281546u.jpg

Better luck next time :neutral:
 
As the poll showed made before F&S was released, a lot, (most in the poll), bought it for the single player game, as I did.
Like Atrummixer posted above me, I am just very dissapointed. The version 1.38 led me to believe we were getting a new version of the Warband core, but I now feel this is a modified M&B without the advantages gained with Warband. I expected a lot more than is evident in this release, and a far more polished finish.
There are many far better Mods, in my opinion, so I will go back to playing them, and considering the pleasure I have had from both M&B and the Warband expansion, Taleworlds and Co are welcome to my £10.  :cool:
 
1 - create a "oehh" mod in mount and blade
2 - release it in some place
3 -port it in warband engine
4 - remove features of warband engine
5 - release it as new worldwide game
6 - ???
7- PROFIT!
 
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