Which leveling system do you prefer Warband or Bannerlord?

[VincentNZ]

This is not at all about limits or removing the sandbox experience. You could argue that the new system is more immersive, more RPG and more sandbox, as it is all about choice. You decide what and how you want to play. Trader, Ruler, Mercenary, this is all possible, just not all at once, or only with significant dedication. You can still play a jack-of-all-trades, just not a master of everything.
The game is also flexible enough, that you can switch priorities early or in a mid-game, especially when the tweaks will role in, which is bound to come.
.
Now they would go a long way, if the starting attribute of 2 would not basically be 0 and if you could freely distribute attributes right from the start. So that the early limits are not at 5, but 25 or so. Generally the lowest caps, if they have to be, should be 50 or 75 in my book, as this will give you sufficient skill in each discipline, while also still being true to your chosen profession and ultimate freedom.
Would also get rid of the min/maxer builds and the need for power-leveling and cheesing the system.

 

[Wolfsblut]

I am paranoid too about the anti sandbox hold your hand features like caps, I haven't liked this direction from the start. This game feels more and more like a linear RPG. Limited number of shops, limited number of companions, this design is constantly interfering with the player's free will. I am not getting that vibe of complete freedom that Warband offered. I feel rushed.

Thats indeed my only real gripe about the game design.
I got that **** in enough AAA titles, i don't need more of that crap.

It is beyond my why someone had the idea to move away from the core of M&B and, more important, why
Armagan let them.
And i am not talking about new systems per se, new systems are ofc nessecary for a new game (if i like them or not).

 

[giltirn]

Definitely support removal of hard caps. Keep the focus system if you like but it should be possible to progress all skills given enough time and effort.

 

[giltirn]

This is not at all about limits or removing the sandbox experience. You could argue that the new system is more immersive, more RPG and more sandbox, as it is all about choice. You decide what and how you want to play. Trader, Ruler, Mercenary, this is all possible, just not all at once, or only with significant dedication. You can still play a jack-of-all-trades, just not a master of everything.
The game is also flexible enough, that you can switch priorities early or in a mid-game, especially when the tweaks will role in, which is bound to come.

But we already decide how we want to play as that is how we choose to devote our time in the game. My character is great at trade but sucks at 2h, because I trade a lot and don't use 2h weapons. I don't need to click a button in order to make that decision. But maybe one day I decide I want to improve my 2h ability; why should I then be bound by a fictional decision made 10s of hours previously? I should just be able to pick up a 2h and start swinging it about to gain experience.

 

[Jhaerik]

But we already decide how we want to play as that is how we choose to devote our time in the game. My character is great at trade but sucks at 2h, because I trade a lot and don't use 2h weapons. I don't need to click a button in order to make that decision. But maybe one day I decide I want to improve my 2h ability; why should I then be bound by a fictional decision made 10s of hours previously? I should just be able to pick up a 2h and start swinging it about to gain experience.

The system is literally a mash up of Vampire the Masquerade and the Elder Scrolls and it doesn't do it as well as either.
The worst part is I don't see the replay value. I've made 3 characters each with around 10-20 hours and they feel identical. The zero weapon skill trader feels no different with a bow or sword than my archer, and no different with a polearm than my "knight." You could FEEL the difference in Warband. Bannerlord is more just the illusion of choice. All that really seems to matter is having 25 leadership for the free troop xp.

 

[stevehoos]

The system is literally a mash up of Vampire the Masquerade and the Elder Scrolls and it doesn't do it as well as either.

There are things I like about the game, but I agree with this.

 

[bodhi]

Definitely support removal of hard caps. Keep the focus system if you like but it should be possible to progress all skills given enough time and effort.

That would be unrealistic. They have included age mechanics, so you only have a "life-time" to master skills. No one in real life could master every area of life - which is why humans specialize in our societies. You have companions to fill-in you deficiencies. This mirrors real life. What you want is a fantasy skill system like Skyrim with a god-tier character at end-game.

If you want to unlock all skills, I'm sure a modder will do that for you. Just not in the base game.

God I hope the devs do not grant your wish!

 

[stevehoos]

That would be unrealistic. They have included age mechanics, so you only have a "life-time" to master skills. No one in realife could master every area of life - which is why humans specialize in our societies. You have companions to fill-in you deficiencies. This mirrors real life. What you want is a fantasy skill system like Skyrim with a god-tier character at end-game.

God I hope the devs do not grant your wish!

Do you want a hold your hand linear scripted Character, or free will to do what you want.? The option to do what you want means you don't have to have a God Character at the end game, you do whatever you want and play the game how you see fit. Do you see the difference?

 

[Jhaerik]

That would be unrealistic. They have included age mechanics, so you only have a "life-time" to master skills. No one in real life could master every area of life - which is why humans specialize in our societies. You have companions to fill-in you deficiencies. This mirrors real life. What you want is a fantasy skill system like Skyrim with a god-tier character at end-game.

If you want to unlock all skills, I'm sure a modder will do that for you. Just not in the base game.

God I hope the devs do not grant your wish!

God character? LOL
Have you seen to actual bonuses you get from those skill increases? There is more difference in a level 1 and level 2 WoW character than a Bannerlord level 1 and a max skill "super" character.

 

[durbal]

By the numbers, OP is wrong since you can learn skills beyond the learning limit (look at my learning limit and learning rate below). It doesn't take much effort to see this. Let's not spread misinformation -- especially during EA.

 

[VincentNZ]

But we already decide how we want to play as that is how we choose to devote our time in the game. My character is great at trade but sucks at 2h, because I trade a lot and don't use 2h weapons. I don't need to click a button in order to make that decision. But maybe one day I decide I want to improve my 2h ability; why should I then be bound by a fictional decision made 10s of hours previously? I should just be able to pick up a 2h and start swinging it about to gain experience.

You do not really decide in WB, you just play and then decide what you want to be good at. Here you decide what you want to be and will be good at only these things. As said, the system allows for flexibility and changes of focus. Right now it needs tweaking and more careful planning, though. However you can easily reach the skill of 25-50 on a lot of skills, even without focus which makes you efficient.
Additionally the game is rather gear-centric, I do not agree with that, but you can offset your character's shortcomings with armour and weapons.
.
Now as said, the system is far from perfect. Especially attributes are useless in the current form. I still think that leveling one-handed should increase your vigour, so that leveling the other melee weapons is easier. This makes sense, and should be the case.
Also some tasks and quests should give XP or straight skill upgrades for solving them. Escorting a caravan should give trade and riding XP. Family Feud, charm and so forth.
This would make sure that after 10 hours or so, your character will 100% reflect your playstyle and that you can still choose to divert from your path further down the line. For everything else, there should indeed be companions.

 

[bodhi]

God character? LOL
Have you seen to actual bonuses you get from those skill increases? There is more difference in a level 1 and level 2 WoW character than a Bannerlord level 1 and a max skill "super" character.

Well, this is more a matter of balance. But I think the system they have is essentially right for this game: skill focus and points as a limited resource throughout a character's "life", you decide what you want "to be" during your life and you focus on that. Sure, you should be able to do other things, but you should never be able to master all things....not even close. I'm sure they will get the balance right.

 

[Nathanael De Mons]

I'm pretty sure you can learn past the learning limit and its.just slow.

can confirm this, my steward skill was "locked" to 110 but it leveled to 113 until i could put another focus point into it.

 

[Jhaerik]

By the numbers, OP is wrong since you can learn skills beyond the learning limit (look at my learning limit and learning rate below). It doesn't take much effort to see this. Let's not spread misinformation -- especially during EA.

You can't go very far beyond that cap, and it would take hundreds of hours of play to push out more than 1 or 2 more levels this way, so the point stands.

 

[BlackRainZ]

Levels definitely go beyond 24. How hard it is to get there, I don't know.

 

[RoguePolybius]

Sort of on topic but not but,is anyone else not recieving attribute points at every 3rd level? got one at level 3 havent had one since and im level 12!

 

[Wolfsblut]

You can't go very far beyond that cap, and it would take hundreds of hours of play to push out more than 1 or 2 more levels this way, so the point stands.

Well, if the base gain rate wouldn't be so low that you could puke into the mane of your horse, 30-50% penalty for going over the cap would be completly fine.
So at least that is a balance issue as it seems.

They have included age mechanics ...

Sad but true.

 

[Timmortal]

Well they have stated that the whole system is not done yet, so its quite logical that its "broken" i dont understand the point of this post, its as if you think this is the intended end of the system, when its only partially done.

 

[Daigensui]

Even disregarding how slow levelling up skills get I'd say the bigger problem here is that the Skill Point requirement for every level *also* grows.

 

[Age of Empires ¶ Densetsu]

Well they have stated that the whole system is not done yet, so its quite logical that its "broken" i dont understand the point of this post, its as if you think this is the intended end of the system, when its only partially done.

They’ve only had, oh, 10 years to develop a system that works. There are one-man development teams that can make functioning levelling systems in 1/100th of the time.

I feel bad for the developers, they clearly had to crunch in the last year to make something barely functional due to whatever horrific management problems the company has. 10 years!