Which faction was more important in the Coalition Wars? Austria or Spain?
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uhm gokiller i saw your edited post that the british payed the austrians, don´t know its true, but never heard at that, austria always had a card in his backhand. There were hungarians and czech who all could reorganize a new army.
because of that guerilla discussion... never heard about Andreas Hofer?
because of that guerilla discussion... never heard about Andreas Hofer?
lyndon
Master Knight
Without any doubt, Austria was more important. It was involved in 5 out of 6 Coalitions against the French. Kaiser Franz II was the last emperor of the Holy Roman Empire (he became later Franz I Emperor of Austria to avoid Napoleon taking the title Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire). Fürst Schwarzenberg was the High Commander of the allied forces in the Battle of Leipzig (Völkerschlacht bei Leipzig).
Yeah, but was in Spain were started the first revolutions against Napoleon, and were started the french empire deterioration, if all our spanish patriots had not been up in arms and fought in uprisings like the 2 of may, probably Napoleon would have been victorius 
Leberecht Reinhold
Master Knight
Eddard8Reg 说:Yeah, but was in Spain were started the first revolutions against Napoleon, and were started the french empire deterioration, if all our spanish patriots had not been up in arms and fought in uprisings like the 2 of may, probably Napoleon would have been victorius
Yeah, and if Austria did the same, Napoleon would have been victorious too, whats the point there?
Austrias army was much bigger and much more advanced. They fought through most of the war and was one of the main threats of France (if not the main).
Hekko
Master Knight
I am not trying to lessen the importance of Spain, and the sink of resources it proved to be for the french, nevertheless, comparing it to the Austrian efforts and the effects Austria had upon the way the war played out is rather unfair on the Austrians, since Austria actually had a field army. Furthermore the spaniards recieved alot of help from the British. While the British indeed helped everyone out the help they gave to the Spain was on a different scale.
Hubris, if anything, was the largest reason Napoleon lost.
How well Austrians and Spaniards fought on an individual level is an alltogether different matter, but as nations it's obvious.
Hubris, if anything, was the largest reason Napoleon lost.
How well Austrians and Spaniards fought on an individual level is an alltogether different matter, but as nations it's obvious.
The Magnificent Bastard
Veteran
I completely agree with Hekko, it's no contest. Guerilla war only gets you so far.
Warluster
Recruit
The two are incomparable. In terms of military might and economic power, Austria was always the nation which rose from under the boot of Napoleon, ready to have another swing. Despite losing massively and dramatically at Marengo, Ulm and Austerlitz the Austrians were able to revive and face the French equally only years later. They could match the Emperor on terms of military might, territorial size and just general power. They were truly his only Continental equal.
But, it is is correct to say the influential role the Austrians maintained was matched by the Spanish. The Spanish, though, were just as important in terms of guerrila warfare and economic quagmire. They drained Napoleon of money and men (with at least 200 000 soldiers guarding Iberia during the Pennisular War in 1809) which could be spent resisting a Coalition offensive in both Germany and Italy, which he still won.
In fact, the two relate directly to each other. The Spanish, fake allies of the French Emperor, occupied a large percentage of his wealth and power. This allowed the Austrians more air to breath in Central Europe, and most likely meant that it delayed the disastrous battles of the wars. The guerrila warfare of Spain would not have lasted without the huge Austria, the constant threat on France's border countless times which meant that he always, always, had to re-deploy troops back to Germany.
For Mount&Musket though, this mod is primarily played in terms of line battles. This is two armies facing each other equally, a feat the Spanish could never produce during the Napoleonic Wars, though the bravery and courage of the common man was just as effective. The Austrians though, would always produce a hundred thousand strong legion in hopeless attempts to stem the French tide. That is why they should be the next nation, because in terms of military contribution they contributed the most.
Of course the Spanish did field many large armies, and once we've got Austria done (and thus the major players) I would say do Spain next, then the Ottomans/Swedes/Dutch/Portuguese/Danish...
But, it is is correct to say the influential role the Austrians maintained was matched by the Spanish. The Spanish, though, were just as important in terms of guerrila warfare and economic quagmire. They drained Napoleon of money and men (with at least 200 000 soldiers guarding Iberia during the Pennisular War in 1809) which could be spent resisting a Coalition offensive in both Germany and Italy, which he still won.
In fact, the two relate directly to each other. The Spanish, fake allies of the French Emperor, occupied a large percentage of his wealth and power. This allowed the Austrians more air to breath in Central Europe, and most likely meant that it delayed the disastrous battles of the wars. The guerrila warfare of Spain would not have lasted without the huge Austria, the constant threat on France's border countless times which meant that he always, always, had to re-deploy troops back to Germany.
For Mount&Musket though, this mod is primarily played in terms of line battles. This is two armies facing each other equally, a feat the Spanish could never produce during the Napoleonic Wars, though the bravery and courage of the common man was just as effective. The Austrians though, would always produce a hundred thousand strong legion in hopeless attempts to stem the French tide. That is why they should be the next nation, because in terms of military contribution they contributed the most.
Of course the Spanish did field many large armies, and once we've got Austria done (and thus the major players) I would say do Spain next, then the Ottomans/Swedes/Dutch/Portuguese/Danish...
Stevon
Knight at Arms
Well put Warluster, couldn't have said it better myself.
IMHO, the Austrians would be the logical next choice, as their overall involvement in the Napoleonic wars was far greater than that of Spain (5 out of 6 of the Wars of the Coalition!), especially in the sense of the pitched battles, which are undoubtedly the focus of this mod. None of the engagements between French and Spanish forces in the Peninsular War even came close to scale of such famous battles aswell as Warluster said) Marengo, Ulm and Austerlitz, as well as Aspern-Essling and Wagram!
Not trying to bash Spain here, and I would indeed like to see them after Austria, but I just think its unfair to pick Spain over Austria.
IMHO, the Austrians would be the logical next choice, as their overall involvement in the Napoleonic wars was far greater than that of Spain (5 out of 6 of the Wars of the Coalition!), especially in the sense of the pitched battles, which are undoubtedly the focus of this mod. None of the engagements between French and Spanish forces in the Peninsular War even came close to scale of such famous battles as
well as Warluster said) Marengo, Ulm and Austerlitz, as well as Aspern-Essling and Wagram!Not trying to bash Spain here, and I would indeed like to see them after Austria, but I just think its unfair to pick Spain over Austria.
i think they should add a spanish and a portugese guerilla unit as skirmishers to the British...
but Austria should be the next faction
but Austria should be the next faction
http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,155971.0.html
then please vote for Austria
then please vote for Austria
The Magnificent Bastard
Veteran
Already have
Just a little side note/correction about the claims by some people that Austria took part in 5 of 6 Coalition Wars:
Austria actually took part in six Coalition Wars, not five, and the total number was seven. The only one were they didn't take part was the War of the Fourth Coalition, which mostly took part in Prussia and Poland, main coalition combatants being Prussia, Russia, Saxony and Sweden - Britain giving support but not really taking part in the battles.
As for the Seventh Coalition, I don't understand why everyone seems to forget it, seeing as what is probably the most famous battle of the entire period was part of this war...
Austria actually took part in six Coalition Wars, not five, and the total number was seven. The only one were they didn't take part was the War of the Fourth Coalition, which mostly took part in Prussia and Poland, main coalition combatants being Prussia, Russia, Saxony and Sweden - Britain giving support but not really taking part in the battles.
As for the Seventh Coalition, I don't understand why everyone seems to forget it, seeing as what is probably the most famous battle of the entire period was part of this war...
I did indeed forget the 7th one Beaver, you're right 
