What we have in Bannerlord pre-release dev diaries but not in game by now

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Yep, more like forumites never move on, or spend entire paragraphs talking about little things. I like that TW is more quiet than loud. People in these forums got too much time on their hands.
 
Seriously again with the semantics? Ok -here we go -whomever they designate to convey information to the community -have them answer. Ok? Good.
Semantics are important. I explained to you why. If you wanna dismiss the fact that there are low-IQ people out there that don't pick up sentences properly and blame others randomly, sure, go ahead. Continue saying Devs.
And again, you cannot claim that they tricked you into buying because they said something in the past and clearly said many times that these things can change and might not be in the final build. Do you feel like disappointed? Sure, feel that. You feel like they are not creditable and won't buy the game again? Sure, go ahead. I don't care. I'm not saying you shouldn't feel like that. But I don't feel in that way - and I'm personally disappointed af when I hear they wanted to keep things simple since that's quite irrational because they are not making a mobile game. But hey, it's their game. If you don't buy, they can go out of business next time - and if they are risking their existence for earning a few more people, who am I to disagree? I wouldn't buy and case closed for me. It's a product after all.

I'm dismissing what you said in last few sentences because if you read what I said a few posts before, you will see that I'm also asking for TW to communicate with playerbase.
 
Semantics are important. I explained to you why. If you wanna dismiss the fact that there are low-IQ people out there that don't pick up sentences properly and blame others randomly, sure, go ahead. Continue saying Devs.

Well its actually you who is confining and redefining the term "Dev" as you see fit.

"A game developer can range from one person who undertakes all tasks[3] to a large business with employee responsibilities split between individual disciplines, such as programming, design, art, testing, etc. Most game development companies have video game publisher financial and usually marketing support.[4] Self-funded developers are known as independent or indie developers and usually make indie games." ~Wiki

So a Dev can really be just about anyone in Game Development - your fear of low IQ numbskull revolt is unfounded and histrionic.

As to the rest of your post your just saying the same thing over and over -yes i know they can change their plans, yes i know its their product, yes i know they dont legally owe us any of this.

Learn what good faith business relationship is and we'll talk. As the whole point of the 1st page and the longstanding disappointment on these and other forums with the thin-ness of the games -it would only take a conscious choice of good faith for the Game Development team to respond. These are the Official Bannerlord public forums so they are absolutely the place to voice this frustration. If you dont like it -sorry but tough bananas
 
If there 100 dev blogs we have all followed and they are used in a sense as publicity to drive interest in the game and they are all dropped -then someone damed sure needs to answer be it Devs with a follow up blog or community manager.
+1

The steam page says “While we do not have a set date for a full release at this moment in time, we expect that the game will be in early access for around a year. Our focus is on ensuring that the game is fun and enjoyable rather than imposing a deadline that might have a negative impact on the final product.”
I guess around a year could mean an extra 3-4 months or 6 or whatever TW wants. TW has stated in the past that they wanted the game to come out in 2016, 2018, etc. I suspect they are opposed to giving dates because every time the give an estimated date people latch on to it and say "but TW promised". Don't get me wrong I'm not defending TW I'm just saying they're ambiguous by nature because even they don't know how long it will take them.
I think people need to realize 2 things: 1) TW is never going to deliver every feature they discussed 2) TW will finish things when they damn well please. Once people on these forums realize this they'll be a lot happier. All the complaining and moaning isn't going to change TW. I suspect we'll get a full release in 6 months to 1.5 years but it will never be what people really want. TW could avoid or at least lessen a lot of these issues if they weren't so hesitant to communicate but they won't for whatever reasons. They are their own worst enemy.

I agree. If they engaged more clearly and openly, at least people could adjust their expectations and both the fans (the buyers) and the developers could work together to get a middle ground for the game that we all want and deserve (as much as possible)
I understand what you mean, I'm just saying it's not the developers who should explain that to you. It's community managers. Even they don't need to explain anything tho - to be fair. Bannerlord sold quite well with all the doubt clouds over its head. Everyone laughed when they said it will be out of EA after one year but still, the game sold well. So the public really doesn't think as deep as you think. If they say "That's it. Here, rebellions, and we are out of EA" - only core players will get outraged. Rest already have no idea what this game is all about.


I disagree. I choose to see Native game content over any mod. Once the game finished or getting at near finish state, mods can do their thing. But this shouldn't affect the development cycle/releases.
I dont see how they add a few more things and call it OK were out of EA. I hope not anyway. Also, presumably when they exit EA, they also continue to add content whereas an ENDED EA = 'stabilitiy' to a degree (I dont see how you exit EA, until all features are implemented, and then you just do some patch w
The time it takes to release stuff doesn't really bother me, sure waiting sucks, but development isn't like math formulas.

What really bothers me is when we get an "explanation" that states a feature is not going to be implemented because it would make the game complex or harder, this is really an insult to our intelligence on the levels of Diablo 4's "We are going to change item stats to just attack and defense so the players can understand that an item is an upgrade". What are we? Zoo monkeys that go by all day throwing **** at people and being amused by the chaos we created?

How many times have we seen mexxico say something like "yeah, I will suggest this/try to change this but don't get your hopes up because it may be decided against"? This village management and possibility of upgrading to castles were his idea, he even said so, but someone decided to scrap it. But hey, at least we have someone on our corner trying to improve the game.

It starts with the small things, like troops not staying in formation while moving and clans not having their own color scheme and it piles up along the way so we get this snowball of frustration that picked up all the bad decisions made so far and becomes this huge feeling that the end product won't be good or that it won't be half of what it could be.

Sure this can change with each patch, and improvements were made, but even some of the stuff that was delivered is too shallow. Take rebellions, for example, they spiced up the campaign, it feels more alive, but there were good possibilities that were left unexplored, like independent clans staying as city-states after they succeeded and maybe even banding together to form a new faction, quests to incite rebellions and sub cultures that could look like Warband factions if a town rebelled against its own culture.



They do, mexxico said he was going to look at the party AI mod to give us more control over clan parties. They implemented the settlement icons thingy and there could be more that other people may have noticed.

The "Consider my Kingdom" would be a must have for me in future updates. What it does is allow clans to choose your kingdom when they want to defect, there is a version that they bring over a fief they have and one they don't, if they implement this I would prefer that they don't, unless it causes a war with the faction they were in, like a rebellion of sorts.

+1 consider my kingdom (although these types of things should seem obvious IMO, if AI gets it, player to an extent should get it)
+1 on independent city states (or minors that take cities), thats a great idea too. I dont think theres enoough minor clans **** disturbing, they should be nibbling at the biggest kingdoms who wage wars across the map (to draw them back).

I did not said I am happy with game overall, I try to be happy otherwise being always upset / worried reduces your effectiveness. Game has more potential of course and I accept game has missing features and cannot use its potential fully. I also said I prefer older design which has better village management (if that selection was chosed game could be a 95+% rating game but it was a risky design and need more / better workpower to implement. Also that design was mine why I prefer a new design? But one day that design is scrapped (we did this giving up / changing idea thing lots of time during early-mid development) and we moved on with new design. What can you do in this scenario as a dev? I have no control over these main decisions. So if you cannot change these main decisions (skeleton of game) what you can do is trying to make selected design as good as possible. Actually you can clearly see sometimes I am complaining about something like you but trying to improve game in given limits.

About console thing it is not my decision too but have to do some optimization and spend 1-2 weeks at January because it is also wanted and it is reasonable too. This game will be released at also consoles one day. Again underlying I prefer spending time on improving game until PC version is nearly finished. You should understand we are only doing what is decided mostly.

Thats too bad - it seems a bit odd that the designs were changing so often on a fly like that ... Is this still the case, or has this situation gotten better since there is (presumably) more stability about the resources (lots of BL copies sold) to put to work?

That design was basic of game. It changed lots of time ago and remaining game build over a totally different design. So it is impossible to return something like this now. So we will try to make current design better now. By the way until a design is implemented anyone cannot know which one is better. So maybe our current design is right choice I cannot be sure. I am just saying I prefer older one. Maybe if we ask everyone which one you prefer result can be 90% older design but this also do not prove anything. Because voters did not played both versions we are only guessing what can happen. To be sure which is better only way is playing both designs. Anyway lets give up being pessimist and try to make current design better.

Is it possible to get players access to that older design..? For curiosity sake.


Project Lead, Head Developer isn't responsible with public communication either. Problem is, there are some people who are directing their insults and rage against to Devs directly. These cases are even more serious for some other companies ( see this for Cyberpunk Case ) What mexxico and other devs are doing is quite remarkable actually. They literally have no reason to be there. Even for bug reports. They already have a system where they get bug reports from Community Support guys. You don't have to know corpo structure - that's why I'm trying to correct what you said to avoid any nutbrain to understand it as if it's devs responsibility to communicate and get outraged ( again to be clear, I'm not talking about you )

Eh not quite. Because it's not like they promised all these and then just came up with he current game. They made Dev Blogs about these features, yes, but they also announced that they dropped some of them. So it's the user's responsibility to check what he is buying. In theory, if they are fulfilling what they are promising on Steam page, then they are fulfilling what they promised.
For missing features that are not announced to be `dropped` but still in Dev Blogs, you have right to ask where they are. And answer will probably be "We are working on it". But for upgrade thingy, for example, they literally said that's discarded before EA.

Pretty sure the rage against Generic dev is because we had no idea who to throw our rage at, no1 to be accountable because of lack of communication (which is bad in general).
Also agree, mexxico and others have really stepped up in this journey, and its making everything better
 
A game developer can range from one person who undertakes all tasks[3] to a large business with employee responsibilities split between individual disciplines, such as programming, design, art, testing, etc.
I don't see PR person or Community Representative/manager among those disciplines, Wiki guy. And even in your wiki it's not saying "A game developer should come out and explain things they do" - good faith or not, it's a product and they sell what they show. I'm trying to correct what you said to avoid others to randomly rage against at devs but apparently, that's what you are aiming for. Otherwise, you would chill by now.
Learn what good faith business relationship is and we'll talk.
I think I'll pass. There is nothing to talk with you since you clearly misreading what I'm saying to come on top. Go ahead, do whatever you want, I'm not Moderator, I don't care. But about this weird comment "These are the Official Bannerlord public forums so they are absolutely the place to voice this frustration. If you don't like it ".... Get a coffee or tea or something, lean back, go to my profile and read my other posts. If you are still not getting it, sorry but though bananas

I dont see how they add a few more things and call it OK were out of EA. I hope not anyway. Also, presumably when they exit EA, they also continue to add content whereas an ENDED EA = 'stabilitiy' to a degree (I dont see how you exit EA, until all features are implemented, and then you just do some patch
Not saying they should, saying they can. And in that circumstance, all you can do is hating the company and not buying their product ever again. You can state your frustration, yes, but getting salty about individuals won't get you anywhere. This was what I was trying to tell him although he missed that point. Devs also don't get extra bucks when a game sells better.
Pretty sure the rage against Generic dev is because we had no idea who to throw our rage at, no1 to be accountable because of lack of communication (which is bad in general).
Also agree, mexxico and others have really stepped up in this journey, and its making everything better
I'm aware of the fact that there is a communication issue. And it was like this since from the beginning. They tried to change that but still, there are huge gaps. But people shouldn't go rage against devs. And if someone keeps insisting on calling out devs for explanation or gets raged at devs, then it's his problem and mental capacity. Because even the dev himself literally said "I don't make these decisions"

I'm done with this - it's also derailing the topic. If you wanna say something, DM me.


And It might be too much perhaps but I think it would be better to get player-base's opinion about new features that have been under planning before development. I'm not sure if there are any plans for future that hasn't been disclosed with players but if there are any, revealing them in Forum can increase the effectiveness of the idea because there are a lot of creative and realistic people in this forum that can suggest more improvements on base-ideas. This is more like a general suggestion on features though, perhaps it should require @Dejan 's involvement if it sounds feasible. Because I'm sure a lot of people, including me, is wondering which tricks TW has on its pocket for this game. I'm talking about new features - not bug fixes or sheep textures ( I kinda consider snowballing fix as a bug fix too even though it's visibly harder than many of other bugs )
I'm summoning( :smile: ) @Dejan to this thread, for this suggestion ( although might not be a good idea ) and also for the OP's research, explaining which of them are will be missing till the end of the time and which of them are still under development.
 
I don't see PR person or Community Representative/manager among those disciplines, Wiki guy. And even in your wiki it's not saying "A game developer should come out and explain things they do" - good faith or not, it's a product and they sell what they show. I'm trying to correct what you said to avoid others to randomly rage against at devs but apparently, that's what you are aiming for. Otherwise, you would chill by now.

I think I'll pass. There is nothing to talk with you since you clearly misreading what I'm saying to come on top. Go ahead, do whatever you want, I'm not Moderator, I don't care. But about this weird comment "These are the Official Bannerlord public forums so they are absolutely the place to voice this frustration. If you don't like it ".... Get a coffee or tea or something, lean back, go to my profile and read my other posts. If you are still not getting it, sorry but though bananas


Not saying they should, saying they can. And in that circumstance, all you can do is hating the company and not buying their product ever again. You can state your frustration, yes, but getting salty about individuals won't get you anywhere. This was what I was trying to tell him although he missed that point. Devs also don't get extra bucks when a game sells better.

I'm aware of the fact that there is a communication issue. And it was like this since from the beginning. They tried to change that but still, there are huge gaps. But people shouldn't go rage against devs. And if someone keeps insisting on calling out devs for explanation or gets raged at devs, then it's his problem and mental capacity. Because even the dev himself literally said "I don't make these decisions"

I'm done with this - it's also derailing the topic. If you wanna say something, DM me.



I'm summoning( :smile: ) @Dejan to this thread, for this suggestion ( although might not be a good idea ) and also for the OP's research, explaining which of them are will be missing till the end of the time and which of them are still under development.
I think you answer the point perfectly, we dont care to throw rage at the devs, we care to throw it at the management who stop the devs from implementing great features (supposedly great / wanted whatever..)

Im pretty sure were on the same page, but maybe the communication isnt coming thru clearly.

Also youre right. OP OP
 
I just wish @armagan would return to the forums and let us know what his vision of the game is currently (hasn't posted since EA released). I always appreciated his explanations of decisions during the closed beta for MP.

Yes we have what the plans are for what they are currently working on and we got some more hints during gamescon, but we havent heard from the decision maker himself about what his current vision is of a complete bannerlord. I don't expect him to respond to suggestion posts or anything like that (he has a company to run and life to live), but a small update about how things are going every month or two would be great. Sure 9 months has passed of silence but its never too late to start (especially with them coming up on their supposed release).
 
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I just wish @armagan would return to the forums and let us know what his vision of the game is currently (hasn't posted since EA released). Yes we have what the plans are for what they are currently working on and we got some more hints during gamescon, but we havent heard from the decision maker himself about what his current vision is of a complete bannerlord. I don't expect him to respond to suggestion posts or anything like that (he has a company to run and life to live), but a small update about how things are going every month or two would be great. Sure 9 months has passed of silence but its never too late to start (especially with them coming up on their supposed release).

How dare you ping the top dawg!? He dont need to answer the likes of YOU!!!!

:lol:

J/k j/k of course. Im gonna bow out the above conversation as we all know those thing always devolve into more of a battle of egos than the actual point we ae defending after about 3 exchanges.

As a general point if you think about -the entire forum is generally a request for a response or at least attention from one of the game developers so it shouldn't come at any surprise that they'll sometimes get called upon especially if it is a mass request by the entirety or vast majority of the community and longtime fanbase. We dont need intermediaries trying to "defend the devs" as they arent being attacked but merely requested. Sure there are a rare few cases of "Dev Bashing" ive seen here but they are a small minority with what i would say the vast majority -even so-called haters (you know who you are) are pretty complimentary and even defensive of the Devs that do show up here and work with us -they are appreciated.

This Original Post is so well presented and i know for at least me -kind of a catharsis in "why do i feel so let down but cant articulate it". Since Bannerlord was announced as a future title- those of us waiting week in and week out for any news on development those dev blogs were our lifeline or sneak peek into how we will be paid off after a many years long wait. The features they were stating would be in game at the time were portraying a pretty feature rich strategy game -yet that is far removed from what we actually received. Couple this with what i believe Callum stated "we are adding a sprinkle of strategy game" -imypling that the game we thought we were getting has been massively scaled down in that aspect. Couple all of that with Mexxicos talk of needed to get back to the Console element and we all know about PC games moving towards accessibility -well now we've got ourselves a conundrum. And clarification from those directly responsible for these decisions would be most appreciated
 
Thanks OP for compiling the list. I am glad others really hope the existing project/village/fief management system is improved. I think regardless of the old design, there should definitely be some upgradeability/customization of villages or significant improvement of project management at settlements. I am happy for this to be via castles/town if that is only what is possible. I have a lot of hours in warband and it really feels like a massive step down to me that players receive castles and no longer individual fiefs, and the fiefs that we do receive are not upgradable. I think early-game warband was much more enjoyable because of this aspect, becoming a minor lord (or in the case of Bannerlord, a minor clan), and defending your fief, upgrading + improving relations with it. In my opinion it really gave a lot of scale to the world of Calradia, you work your way up and get one measly fief and a lot of your gameplay centered around it in early-midgame warband. Given that Bannerlord has some sort of dynasty system going and more development on that, I think it would be great if this area of the game will be significantly worked on, otherwise the sandbox will not have longevity and the dynasty system for clans will be pretty pointless.
 
villages should at the very minimum have some construction options like they had in warband even if just for some small bonus for this and that or to increase the time for raiding that village so that allied parties can hopefully catch it on time to defend it.
 
villages should at the very minimum have some construction options like they had in warband even if just for some small bonus for this and that or to increase the time for raiding that village so that allied parties can hopefully catch it on time to defend it.
I agree, maybe this can be done through castles or castle project interface?
 
Thanks OP for compiling the list. I am glad others really hope the existing project/village/fief management system is improved. I think regardless of the old design, there should definitely be some upgradeability/customization of villages or significant improvement of project management at settlements. I am happy for this to be via castles/town if that is only what is possible. I have a lot of hours in warband and it really feels like a massive step down to me that players receive castles and no longer individual fiefs, and the fiefs that we do receive are not upgradable. I think early-game warband was much more enjoyable because of this aspect, becoming a minor lord (or in the case of Bannerlord, a minor clan), and defending your fief, upgrading + improving relations with it. In my opinion it really gave a lot of scale to the world of Calradia, you work your way up and get one measly fief and a lot of your gameplay centered around it in early-midgame warband. Given that Bannerlord has some sort of dynasty system going and more development on that, I think it would be great if this area of the game will be significantly worked on, otherwise the sandbox will not have longevity and the dynasty system for clans will be pretty pointless.
+1,

upgrading villages should make your town / castle better, so there is a sort of double game to upgrading I.E. to recruit good troops in castles (eventually, or if just in village) then need specific building.

To open X workshop, need thing.
or whatver, stuff like that could be goood.............................

perhaps costs for upgrade also (not just adding money to reserves).

In this way, villages when raided may pose a big issue, therefore a bigger deal to risk defending or something (i dunno just typethinking)...

I just wish @armagan would return to the forums and let us know what his vision of the game is currently (hasn't posted since EA released). I always appreciated his explanations of decisions during the closed beta for MP.

Yes we have what the plans are for what they are currently working on and we got some more hints during gamescon, but we havent heard from the decision maker himself about what his current vision is of a complete bannerlord. I don't expect him to respond to suggestion posts or anything like that (he has a company to run and life to live), but a small update about how things are going every month or two would be great. Sure 9 months has passed of silence but its never too late to start (especially with them coming up on their supposed release).

+1 on the armagan
 
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It's funny that between this game and Cyberpunk 2077, I either pre ordered or made a 1st day purchase based on the promises of features for the games. And I can't remember any other time I've been greatly disappointed by what a game under-delivered.

What saddens me the most is that I had so much belief and confidence in these companies, based on their past experience.
 
not meant, they said we "want" to. Callum recently said, "we were and are never good at giving dates anyway", them giving a date means literally nothing
You should have read the rest of my post before "correcting" me because I'm entirely aware of all that and stated in my post that yes, it is likely they will push it back.
 
It's funny that between this game and Cyberpunk 2077, I either pre ordered or made a 1st day purchase based on the promises of features for the games. And I can't remember any other time I've been greatly disappointed by what a game under-delivered.

What saddens me the most is that I had so much belief and confidence in these companies, based on their past experience.
Pretty much the same, I was so excited to play both games and both were a huge dissapointment, and not only that but both companies slapped us in the face with these attitudes, this is really exhausting honestly, even more when I'm spending money I find very hard to earn. In an industry full of half baked games and cashgrabs one could at least trust these people right? Not anymore, Callum won't even tell me why they don't put servers on my region lmao, worth every penny ?
 
You should have read the rest of my post before "correcting" me because I'm entirely aware of all that and stated in my post that yes, it is likely they will push it back.
No that's a correcting. There is a difference between saying "they meant to finish it in 1 year" and "they said they want to finish it in 1 year" if the EA was meant to last a year and it took longer, that would be a bad thing. But if you say they wanted to finish it in 1 year but they couldn't, that's a normal thing.
 
i remember an old video about bannerlords will have a replay options to watch your battles, just like total war some years ago, but i cant found that video anymore
 
Pretty much the same, I was so excited to play both games and both were a huge dissapointment, and not only that but both companies slapped us in the face with these attitudes, this is really exhausting honestly, even more when I'm spending money I find very hard to earn. In an industry full of half baked games and cashgrabs one could at least trust these people right? Not anymore, Callum won't even tell me why they don't put servers on my region lmao, worth every penny ?
OCE region feels your pain Sadge, Bannerlord has been out since March 2020 and we still have not been able to participate in matchmaking that they are spending all their time developing on MP side.
 
And It might be too much perhaps but I think it would be better to get player-base's opinion about new features that have been under planning before development. I'm not sure if there are any plans for future that hasn't been disclosed with players but if there are any, revealing them in Forum can increase the effectiveness of the idea because there are a lot of creative and realistic people in this forum that can suggest more improvements on base-ideas. This is more like a general suggestion on features though, perhaps it should require @Dejan 's involvement if it sounds feasible.
The design can change quickly and drastically before we release the feature as part of Beta and we don't want to build false expectations or otherwise mislead players about it. At the same time, there is typically only a very small window between a prototype that has addressed the major challenges that may lead to such drastic changes and our actual release of it to the beta branch. That is to say, that we do seek to get content into the players' hands as soon as possible so that we may see and respond to their thoughts (part of the reason why we have a beta branch).

Once released, the feedback and suggestions that players provide for a feature are relayed to the developers and designers (both by developers directly browsing through it as well as through more structured suggestion meetings). That form of feedback is a result of direct in-game experience and we believe it to be the most effective with our design and implementation process. We also haven't had a case where feedback wasn't included because it wasn't received prior to the feature going to the Beta branch - obviously, this doesn't concern design decisions made long before we went into early access.

Having said that, we do encourage community members to engage with and share their thoughts on our statements for SP and MP. Similarly, we very much appreciate feedback threads in the appropriate sections or suggestion threads in the designated areas where users share their own ideas. I can assure you that these areas are being checked and that relevant feedback is being reviewed.
 
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