[Werewolf] SMAC: Unity [Game ends!]
- 主题发起人 MaHuD
- 开始时间
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Xardob 说:You're afraid of the trashing I'd give you if you came straight at me, so you're settling on someone else.
And if I'm innocent, and I think you're a wolf -- not only a wolf, but the most experienced and therefore likely to be the most dangerous wolf in the pack -- would it make sense for me to declare you my #1 suspect, my preferred lynch, spend all day casually remarking how you are the most scummy, and yet make no effort to actually try to get you lynched and instead settle for what I guess is your lurker-wolf packmate, leaving you, aka the biggest threat, to potentially kill me overnight before I can try to lynch you on Day 2?
Nope, someone mentioned bullying me to get my vote to move.
That's not happening. I've pointed at a couple of folks I would lynch today and mentioned a third.
A good number of the votes that are likely to happen on me are people I've accused of being scum. Have at it, I welcome death if I cannot get my village to follow me.
Inactive/scattered village versus powerful wolves, I'd rather watch the wolves wreck you guys than beg and plead for my right to lynch a villager over myself. What a spineless player you must think I am, Xardog.
Lynch me, wolf.
That's not happening. I've pointed at a couple of folks I would lynch today and mentioned a third.
A good number of the votes that are likely to happen on me are people I've accused of being scum. Have at it, I welcome death if I cannot get my village to follow me.
Inactive/scattered village versus powerful wolves, I'd rather watch the wolves wreck you guys than beg and plead for my right to lynch a villager over myself. What a spineless player you must think I am, Xardog.
Lynch me, wolf.
That is the sum total of the rest of my contributions Day One. I've done far more than necessary here today to show you why Max is probably the most obvious wolf in the game.
That's not gonna be enough, wolves have the activity and votes to do what they need to do to survive. Wake up or stay asleep, wabbits.
That's not gonna be enough, wolves have the activity and votes to do what they need to do to survive. Wake up or stay asleep, wabbits.
Throwing down a vote with no explanation and leaving, especially when it just takes one more vote lynch, is quite careless, don't you think?
Nope. I made a careful decision to place a vote now. I felt I was ready to put it down. Personally, I think its unlikely that wolves will vote for Soot for obvious reasons, and if they will vote they won't be willing to hammer him and will have already put down a vote. By that I mean I think Soot is a wolf. If he is innocent, then I'll reevaluate the situation. But I think that is unlikely (as in, less than 30% for a random percentage I just made up).
And unless I'm mistaken, it actually takes 2 more. Currently we have Adahamster, Llandina, Frizzface, and myself. If Mahud is correct, Pizza took his vote off.
And unless I'm mistaken, it actually takes 2 more. Currently we have Adahamster, Llandina, Frizzface, and myself. If Mahud is correct, Pizza took his vote off.
Vieira 说:
That's how I counted 'em earlier too.
Phonemelter 说:
Hypothetically speaking, would it have been careless if he'd thrown a vote down on Eli or Pizza with no explanation, at a stage when Eli/Pizza had 4 votes, or is it only careless because you don't like his choice of vote?
Vieira 说:
And those obvious reasons are... ? What makes you think the wolves won't throw their hands up into the air and say "Oh well, I don't want to switch to vote Soot, but I will to avoid a no-lynch." Wolves in the past have not been afraid to hammer down votes, and a lot of the time one will be already on the wagon pushing for people to join them, refusing to switch to any other target - what makes you think none of that will be going on this game?
@Llandy:
It would be careless in any situation. However, Vieira gave no indication that he was going to be voting for Soot from his recent posts, so it struck me as odd, just like Frisian's vote out of the blue.
Oh, and it thought it was 5 to lynch, not 6. Still living in the past with last game.
Vote: Kronic
**** it - going against my principles to not let lurkers ruin another game.
**** it - going against my principles to not let lurkers ruin another game.
Phonemelter 说:
You see so little that's wrong with Soot's play that you'd throw away your own principles to lynch somebody other than him? Even how I just pointed out that despite Soot's apparently great desire for an Adaham lynch, and Adaham being his #1 for some reasons, he's done basically nothing to further his own goal of lynching his #1 suspect?
If you ever wanted to draw an analogy to my own "scratching pole" technique on Adaham in Mengelberg, this is it.
The obvious reasons are that I think he is a wolf.
Reasons I've mentioned in the past. Llandy brings up some good points too (though a few I remember not wholly agreeing with). Soots play hasn't been entirely Wolfy, but there has been enough in conjunction with my gut read led me to dump the vote there. My other reasons are stated in the post you quoted.
Which i think you misread - or I didn't state clearly. In thr last part of the quote I said I felt that if wolves were going to vote a wolf Soot, they would have done so already ie. Already on the wagon. I mean, its also possible they could put down the 5th, penultimate, vote. That's more likely than the hammer vote, I think, because it allows a wolf to put the blame on the final voter if the lynchee turns out blue. In any case, if Soot does get lynched and turns out red, I'll be taking a long hard look at the voting patterns today.
Wolves could hammer a packmate, but in a game this small I'm not sure the wolves would take the risk. I certainly know wolves can hammer packmates (Sorry whoever it was I hammered that one game I came in as a replacement, I think it was Soots, before getting replaced myself) but I don't think its something they'd consider doing on Day 1 unless they felt their packmate was dead weight.
Speaking of packmates - I'm going to go out on a limb (or limb by limb, I guess) and say Soot, Frisian and Xardob. If Soot shows up wolf. Which I believe he is. There's not much in the packmate theory though, its mostly gut. I'll explain what little I have either tomorrow or on the Wall.
Reasons I've mentioned in the past. Llandy brings up some good points too (though a few I remember not wholly agreeing with). Soots play hasn't been entirely Wolfy, but there has been enough in conjunction with my gut read led me to dump the vote there. My other reasons are stated in the post you quoted.
Which i think you misread - or I didn't state clearly. In thr last part of the quote I said I felt that if wolves were going to vote a wolf Soot, they would have done so already ie. Already on the wagon. I mean, its also possible they could put down the 5th, penultimate, vote. That's more likely than the hammer vote, I think, because it allows a wolf to put the blame on the final voter if the lynchee turns out blue. In any case, if Soot does get lynched and turns out red, I'll be taking a long hard look at the voting patterns today.
Wolves could hammer a packmate, but in a game this small I'm not sure the wolves would take the risk. I certainly know wolves can hammer packmates (Sorry whoever it was I hammered that one game I came in as a replacement, I think it was Soots, before getting replaced myself) but I don't think its something they'd consider doing on Day 1 unless they felt their packmate was dead weight.
Speaking of packmates - I'm going to go out on a limb (or limb by limb, I guess) and say Soot, Frisian and Xardob. If Soot shows up wolf. Which I believe he is. There's not much in the packmate theory though, its mostly gut. I'll explain what little I have either tomorrow or on the Wall.
@Llandy:
You do realize that probably nobody aside from Soot and I would vote for Adaham, right? Why should he put effort into trying to lynch someone that is not very likely going to get lynched? I do not think Soot is scummy, so I am not going to vote for him. From guessing his roles the past few games with pretty high accuracy (unless I am mistaken), I am confident in my ability to read him this game too because he is playing more or less along the lines of what I would expect him to as an innocent. Granted he does have suspicions similar to my own, so maybe I am biased because of that, but this does not look like a scummy Soot to me.
I still maintain that you have been using him as more of a "scratching pole" this game. True, you have "investigated" other suspects, but 90% of the time you have either been arguing about him or pointing out various things to Pizza while being seemingly totally neutral on him.
You do realize that probably nobody aside from Soot and I would vote for Adaham, right? Why should he put effort into trying to lynch someone that is not very likely going to get lynched? I do not think Soot is scummy, so I am not going to vote for him. From guessing his roles the past few games with pretty high accuracy (unless I am mistaken), I am confident in my ability to read him this game too because he is playing more or less along the lines of what I would expect him to as an innocent. Granted he does have suspicions similar to my own, so maybe I am biased because of that, but this does not look like a scummy Soot to me.
I still maintain that you have been using him as more of a "scratching pole" this game. True, you have "investigated" other suspects, but 90% of the time you have either been arguing about him or pointing out various things to Pizza while being seemingly totally neutral on him.
Vieira 说:
The past, which according to you "...has gotten increasingly hazy"?
So you think all the wolves are going to be on one wagon?
Honestly Llandy, I don't have the motivation right to explain every last bit of my thought process to you when you've already shown that you will only shift the accusation to something different each and every time, determined as you are to find everything I say scummy. What I will try to do, at some point, is explain why others slowly shifting votes my way with very little explanation in cover of your efforts makes them very scummy. Not referring to Vieira, btw, as I'm aware he's already made his case. Whatever your paranoid mind conjures up about me, there are way more blatantly scummy things going on in this game, and it's very frustrating people getting away with those while I try to use my already limited interest in the game in defending myself. And **** it, if you do end up getting me, at least I'll have made it blatantly clear where you need to look tomorrow, if you actually are innocent.
Vieira 说:
It was Sheep. Soot was already dead when you joined.
Phonemelter 说:
This is a Catch 22 situation.
Right now, there doesn't seem to be many people who would vote Adaham. But that is partially because Soot has not actually attempted to push a lynch there.
Many days ago, you accused me of "scratching pole" at Soot, ie having some problems with him but not really trying very hard to get him lynched. Presumably you were calling my bluff; you felt that I might have had scummy motives for what you felt as 'scratching' and you even said at the time that Soot was, to me, a "safe" target because it didn't seem like very many people were suspicious of him at the time and I wasn't putting in much effort to get him lynched.
So, I accepted your comment. Now you cannot call my bluff and say I am "scratching" at Soot. I have done everything within my power short of blackmailing players, to vote Soot. Where before there was little suspicion from the majority of players, there is now enough suspicion for a lynch to seriously happen. I'm not saying yay me, look at all the hard work I did, THIS is how you push a case on your #1 suspect...... oh wait, yes I am. It is how Pizza has pushed his case on his #1 suspect (Mag). It is how Mag has pushed his case on his #1 suspect (Pizza).
It is not how Soot has pushed a case on his #1 suspect (Adaham). This is Soot on EZlynch. Maybe even selling out his packmate in the process, because hey, why not sell out the dead weight to earn yourself some brownie points? I did it to Sheep in Mengelberg, and it worked out quite well for me.
There is no chance now of Adaham but if Soot had actually put effort into making a case against his #1 suspect, as any innocent should? Who knows.
I'm doing a remarkably good job of almost having him lynched, to say he's my 'scratching pole.' One might even think I am actually serious here!
When I was NOT arguing with Soot you said I was 'scratching pole' at him. I told you that I was trying to take a step back and not get tunnel-vision, but when you accused me of 'scratching' you left me with two choices; to either remain in my 'step back' position, trying to watch patterns emerge whilst remaining detached from them, or to fully engage and become committed to lynching my #1 suspect. I chose the latter. You can't have it both ways. You can have me observing in a more neutral way and commenting on everything, or you can have me spending most of my energy on campaigning. It seems nothing I do will actually satisfy you, so I think from now on I'll just play how I feel. And right now I feel like lynching a wolf.
As for my Pizzainquisition, I already explained this to Pizza himself many many days ago. I have no meta on Pizza. Questioning him and interacting with him is my way of trying to figure him out. I can't rely on objective observations like I can with most of you, because I have no frame of reference for him. It does seem to concern you though that I am interacting with him without bias, so I'm gonna keep doing that.
Seemingly totally neutral? Sure, I can see why you think that. I haven't shared all of my thoughts about Pizza, because reasons. Reasons which I will elaborate on if Pizza is lynched and Twilight lasts long enough for me to give those reasons. But until I have a clearer picture of Pizza, I am reserving judgement. Fools rush in.
