Were Trek: Q-re - Game over, INNOCENTS WIN :iamamoron:
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You're so cute, wolf.
Seriously. Betraying? Do I owe something to either of you? I've barely interacted with Brutus, hence why I specifically asked him to explain his thoughts about me. Calling someone 'mate' is how I refer to people depending on the situation and mood. Seriously, Dago, if I had to lynch anyone based solely on the quality of achieving their goals it'd be you. Either a lazy wolf or a very misled innocent. Definitely questionable choice here, but would wolf Dago vote for me with such flimsy reasoning, considering, as Soot said, there isn't that much pressure on you (nor me before your vote) either?Dago Wolfrider said:
Nor should you be, as I've repeatedly explained. I haven't, however, heard anything from you regarding what Curio has said. Who was your flippity floppity post directed at, earlier also? What is the pack you're proposing? You earlier listed me as one of your most suspicious reads along with Curio, what changed?Marowit said:
I'm up for Eternal, as my alignment chart already suggested. How does Soot read for you if you consider me innocent?Xardob said:
I can agree with the last part. That still leaves either you or Eternal as my preferred lynches for today. I'm waiting to hear more from him before changing my vote however as he did step out in my defence. This doesn't mean I can't see him as a possible wolf trying to turn the tables here though.SootShade said:
Xardob said:
lynch Moose! for use of Star Wars gifs in a Star Trek WW game imo
I don't see what the dilemma is. Moose is a traitor, Rocco continually tries to defend Moose and Dago keeps on sucking.
Eternal:
The starting point of my re-examination is this: Eternal was practically nonexistent for day 1, though one of his two posts did give me a major gut reaction. I've still not been able to substantiate the logic that I came up with to explain that feeling, but I've never been one to dismiss my gut. He showed up a lot more on day 2 however. My initial view of that big post was very positive, because a lot of it lined up quite exactly with my own reads.
There's a bunch of qualifications when it comes to that though: 1) It's not uncommon for a wolf to upgrade their play from one day to another. 2) It's especially easy to make a great post when you are basically arriving into the game late, and just observing what happened previously from the point of view of an outsider. 3) Him marking me as a strong innocent read makes me really paranoid he's trying to buddy up with me. 4) I did not actually examine most of his points in detail at the time. 5) My reads have adjusted somewhat since he made that post,
His next big post also looked pretty fine to me, though by that time I'd somewhat cooled from the excitement of Eternal making sense for once.
So yeah, I'll start with Eternal's first big post (page 37):
To be honest, I don't particularly get his read on Moose. I was suspicious of Moose early on, but the particular posts Eternal's picking out don't really strike me as egregious - though I might think otherwise if I wasn't playing last game. Particularly, I'm not sure why he's declaring with certainty here:
Rocco's 'trademark wolf post' giving him 'serious innocent vibes' is a bit funny, but I'll assume he's talking about a gut feeling for the latter part. That said, it's not that much later (at least in terms of Eternal's post) that Rocco is already giving him scum vibes instead.
I still agree with Eternal that the amount of attention Xardob was getting was weird, and the reasons given for it.
I think Eternal's maybe buying too much into Dago's being heroic and the only one try. Maybe my increased suspicion towards Dago changed my view here, but in the first place my innocent read on Dago wasn't so much because I was convinced by his posts; I wasn't, he just seemed too give too few ****s to be scum.
I still very much like Eternal's observations of the Arch3r wagon as well.
I don't know why I'm the only one not getting marked suspicious at all for jumping on the Arch3r wagon though - it doesn't come up in his LoS either, where he gives me a strong innocent read. He's right about me being reluctant to jump on it, but if I try to remove my own bias and forget about the Xardob/Arch3r wagon overlap - since that doesn't seem to be what Eternal's working with - I would not think that alone makes me less suspect. It's weird to try to explain why others should suspect me, but this gives the idea of him trying to buddy up with me more weight in my mind.
Especially when you add the fact that he's dismissing my vote on him - following a good post as he admitted - as bizarre, and still not really reacting with any suspicion towards me.
I note that Crassius did not feature particularly prominently in Eternal's big post. Eternal marked him suspicious for having Xardob as his first suspect early on. The key thing seems to be how he jumped on the Arch3r wagon - I still agree that's by far the scummiest part of Crassius's play, so that's fair. Then this:
Anyway, that's all the mention that Crassius got before being marked as 'BLATANT WOLF' in Eternal's LoS, and got a vote as well.
Eternal's LoS conclusions I was totally on board with - still am largely - but the fact that Brutus didn't seem to get viewed any more favorably in light of his incident with Xardob is still quite weird. I don't actually recall if Eternal ever answered my question about this, but we'll see as we go forward. The other problem is that, with a more in-depth reading of his previous post, he marked me with such a strong innocent read, is now even more unnerving to me.
His next notable post is the big one on page 43:
Calling out Crassius for joining the Arch3r wagon, started by Moose who was his primary suspect, is still very astute by Eternal.
Again Eternal's really praising Dago overmuch. Yeah, could easily be trying to buddy up again, with another innocent.
After that post, it's pretty much silence until this:
So, in conclusion, he's showing too much certainty with both his scum and, especially, his innocent reads. Kinda like my day 1 argument regarding Moose, I feel like he's trying to act out the usual stubborn confidence that he shows as an innocent. And even if I'm particular paranoid about being pocketed, this really feels like I'm getting too much trust from his direction. Whilst he's said a lot of the right things, there's really nothing there that indicates innocence strongly, especially considering how easy it is to come across as reasonable when you've not really been involved in the game.
So yeah, I'm good to lynch him. Not that I'm needed for that, looks like.
The starting point of my re-examination is this: Eternal was practically nonexistent for day 1, though one of his two posts did give me a major gut reaction. I've still not been able to substantiate the logic that I came up with to explain that feeling, but I've never been one to dismiss my gut. He showed up a lot more on day 2 however. My initial view of that big post was very positive, because a lot of it lined up quite exactly with my own reads.
There's a bunch of qualifications when it comes to that though: 1) It's not uncommon for a wolf to upgrade their play from one day to another. 2) It's especially easy to make a great post when you are basically arriving into the game late, and just observing what happened previously from the point of view of an outsider. 3) Him marking me as a strong innocent read makes me really paranoid he's trying to buddy up with me. 4) I did not actually examine most of his points in detail at the time. 5) My reads have adjusted somewhat since he made that post,
His next big post also looked pretty fine to me, though by that time I'd somewhat cooled from the excitement of Eternal making sense for once.
So yeah, I'll start with Eternal's first big post (page 37):
To be honest, I don't particularly get his read on Moose. I was suspicious of Moose early on, but the particular posts Eternal's picking out don't really strike me as egregious - though I might think otherwise if I wasn't playing last game. Particularly, I'm not sure why he's declaring with certainty here:
Marowit said:
Rocco's 'trademark wolf post' giving him 'serious innocent vibes' is a bit funny, but I'll assume he's talking about a gut feeling for the latter part. That said, it's not that much later (at least in terms of Eternal's post) that Rocco is already giving him scum vibes instead.
I still agree with Eternal that the amount of attention Xardob was getting was weird, and the reasons given for it.
I think Eternal's maybe buying too much into Dago's being heroic and the only one try. Maybe my increased suspicion towards Dago changed my view here, but in the first place my innocent read on Dago wasn't so much because I was convinced by his posts; I wasn't, he just seemed too give too few ****s to be scum.
I still very much like Eternal's observations of the Arch3r wagon as well.
I don't know why I'm the only one not getting marked suspicious at all for jumping on the Arch3r wagon though - it doesn't come up in his LoS either, where he gives me a strong innocent read. He's right about me being reluctant to jump on it, but if I try to remove my own bias and forget about the Xardob/Arch3r wagon overlap - since that doesn't seem to be what Eternal's working with - I would not think that alone makes me less suspect. It's weird to try to explain why others should suspect me, but this gives the idea of him trying to buddy up with me more weight in my mind.
Especially when you add the fact that he's dismissing my vote on him - following a good post as he admitted - as bizarre, and still not really reacting with any suspicion towards me.
I note that Crassius did not feature particularly prominently in Eternal's big post. Eternal marked him suspicious for having Xardob as his first suspect early on. The key thing seems to be how he jumped on the Arch3r wagon - I still agree that's by far the scummiest part of Crassius's play, so that's fair. Then this:
Which I recall has been discussed by Eternal and Crassius as some sort of a misunderstanding on the former's part? I guess I'll get to that as I keep going.
Anyway, that's all the mention that Crassius got before being marked as 'BLATANT WOLF' in Eternal's LoS, and got a vote as well.
Eternal's LoS conclusions I was totally on board with - still am largely - but the fact that Brutus didn't seem to get viewed any more favorably in light of his incident with Xardob is still quite weird. I don't actually recall if Eternal ever answered my question about this, but we'll see as we go forward. The other problem is that, with a more in-depth reading of his previous post, he marked me with such a strong innocent read, is now even more unnerving to me.
His next notable post is the big one on page 43:
Calling out Crassius for joining the Arch3r wagon, started by Moose who was his primary suspect, is still very astute by Eternal.
Again Eternal's really praising Dago overmuch. Yeah, could easily be trying to buddy up again, with another innocent.
This part is also quite solid. But it's also not difficult for a wolf to explain this reasoning either. You can be very helpful about discussing general game theory without it saying anything about your role. This would also apply to a notable part of Eternal's other good contributions.Marowit said:
Ehh... Dunno, seems like a bit overreaching to show this much bravado, when taking into consideration the rather minimal volume of his case on Crassius, even if the point regarding Crassius's part on the Arch3r wagon still stands.Marowit said:
I guess that explains why I don't recall an answer regarding my earlier inquiry on related to this. Not this answer really reassures me either.Marowit said:
After that post, it's pretty much silence until this:
Well, I guess he wouldn't be so blatant about defending a packie? But as I've noted, it feels like he might be trying to pocket innocents left and right. And yeah, I guess at this point I'm starting to read him as scum.Marowit said:
So, in conclusion, he's showing too much certainty with both his scum and, especially, his innocent reads. Kinda like my day 1 argument regarding Moose, I feel like he's trying to act out the usual stubborn confidence that he shows as an innocent. And even if I'm particular paranoid about being pocketed, this really feels like I'm getting too much trust from his direction. Whilst he's said a lot of the right things, there's really nothing there that indicates innocence strongly, especially considering how easy it is to come across as reasonable when you've not really been involved in the game.
So yeah, I'm good to lynch him. Not that I'm needed for that, looks like.
So, are you stating Marowit is innocent or are you talking about yourself? Just to be sure.
? Why shouldn't you be needed? ?
The latter.
Because Jock's on board as well. What do you think about it, btw?
I will say, such an quick wagon does make me uneasy, compared to how the one on Jock progressed. That said, with Moose, Rocco and Xardob doing it, not like I can see a particular scum influence here.
Because Jock's on board as well. What do you think about it, btw?
I will say, such an quick wagon does make me uneasy, compared to how the one on Jock progressed. That said, with Moose, Rocco and Xardob doing it, not like I can see a particular scum influence here.
SootShade said:
My bet: you know that Marowit is innocent. Jock is voting him to save his life and disappear in the bandwagon. Still think that Rocco is just an idiot Romeo or Juliet, Xardob don't know, Moose! maybe the evil Romeo or Juliet, yet unlikely.
Jock said:
Not me. Are there already four votes on him?
If y'all take this away from me...
Marowit said:
Aww, thanks buddy!
Busy work days...kinda outta the loop, especially since I'm missing like tens of pages at a time. But from what I gathered, you guys are close to coming to a decision, so here's my terribly simplified votecount update:
Votecount:
Eternal (4)
Something else (5): everybody else
---
Sorry, time's really short. I probably shouldn't be hosting right now, but it is what it is...
Votecount:
Eternal (4)
Something else (5): everybody else
---
Sorry, time's really short. I probably shouldn't be hosting right now, but it is what it is...