Were Horses this slow back then?

[NovaTitan]

They seem to merely trot at a brisk pace instead of a full gallop. It's quite apparent in all the horses that they are almost skipping along rather than running. I'd love a stamina system for horses, but horses have lots of stamina and could be ridden for hours until death if necessary.

Besides, I already love the stamina system put in place where the horse noticeably and rightfully so weakens as it takes damage.

 

[Scarf Ace]

Are you sure you're playing the same mod? Horses feel an arseload faster than in native to me.

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

Vikingr horses are marginally slower than Native horses.

 

[Phalanx300]

Horses in native feel to fast really. This feels more realistic.

 

[NovaTitan]

Are you sure you're playing the same mod? Horses feel an arseload faster than in native to me.

You are not a good judge of speed then.

 

[NovaTitan]

Horses in native feel to fast really. This feels more realistic.

Actually, the horses in native are more realistic in terms of modern horses. Perhaps, the horses were weaker during the viking era.

 

[Mammoet]

Are you sure you're playing the same mod? Horses feel an arseload faster than in native to me.

You are not a good judge of speed then.

Wellllll......... people are a lot slower in here so relativly horses are much faster here

 

[Temuzu]

Horses ought to be a load faster. That is, if this mod aims for realism. A horse at full speed would be, Id say 1.5 times as fast as the horses currently are while in full gallop.

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

Horses ought to be a load faster. That is, if this mod aims for realism. A horse at full speed would be, Id say 1.5 times as fast as the horses currently are while in full gallop.

Against the decreased movement speed of footmen? Mhmh! I think horse-speeds are at the right level for the time being.

 

[NovaTitan]

Are you sure you're playing the same mod? Horses feel an arseload faster than in native to me.

You are not a good judge of speed then.

Wellllll......... people are a lot slower in here so relativly horses are much faster here

That was not what I was arguing against. I was arguing that horses speed is definitely lower than native. If there is historical basis on increasing the infantry's speed, I'm all for it. I thought this mod was for historical realism and so I posed the question.

 

[Æthelwulf]

Historical realism aye but in the constraints of the rather poor Warband engine. To compensate for the shoddy mechanics infantry have been slowed, speeding up cavalry will only make them even more formidable than they currently are.

 

[NovaTitan]

Horses ought to be a load faster. That is, if this mod aims for realism. A horse at full speed would be, Id say 1.5 times as fast as the horses currently are while in full gallop.

Against the decreased movement speed of footmen? Mhmh! I think horse-speeds are at the right level for the time being.

Are the footmen decreased for historical reasons? The sprint of light infantry (javelinmen alongside cavalry for macedonians) during ancient times were far faster than that of native. Of course, those were runners, not necessarily the main line.

I feel the general vision of this mod was to slow down everything and not for historical reasons either. Feels a bit awkward playing with feeble vikings and lame horses. Perhaps, these people back then were so malnourished that everybody couldn't run (just jog) with linen on. I also don't understand the design decision to markedly slow down sword swings. A modern-day layman could easily swing a 3-5lb sword with ease and swiftness, though skill is unaccounted for. I would wager that vikings and normans were experts with these and could easily swing just as fast as a modern human. Definitely not the bowmen or peasantry, but for the main line, I'd think it wouldn't be a surprise.

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

If you understood how constrained we are by the engine you wouldn't be making these inane posts.

I was arguing that horses speed is definitely lower than native.

What are you arguing? We all know that they are slower than Native.

Besides, I already love the stamina system put in place where the horse noticeably and rightfully so weakens as it takes damage.

There is no stamina system. The horse takes damage, he becomes lame, no system there.

I'd love a stamina system for horses, but horses have lots of stamina and could be ridden for hours until death if necessary.

Whut?

I feel the general vision of this mod was to slow down everything and not for historical reasons either.

Correctamundo. Rathos and myself ****ing detest Native... We are nasty people who nerf everything that we hate in Native.

 

[Stark88]

I do a lot of re-enactment and I can say that the speeds they have coded in the mod are relative to reality. No matter what people think modern man is in no way SUPERIOR to those of the medieval era in a physical way. While yes, it does seem that they move quite slow whilst wearing linen but running with a sword is no easy task, nor with a giant wood and iron shield strapped to your forearm, especially when the majority of it is uphill. Ever had to fight up hill in a shield wall? It's not fun and is damn right frustrating sometimes. Speaking from personal experience here, these men did this day in day out, they were a lot more adept at anything we can do now, we are just simply not built for it by means of inconstant manual labour and a far superior quality of life. I'm a pretty big lad, I've done re-enactments for around 7 years now (Roman, Saxon and recently Pike block) and I can tell you after ten minutes of swinging that 5 lb sword around and holding that 8lb shield up you are pretty damn tired, no matter how fit you are. Adrenaline plays a big part of what we can and cannot achieve but adrenaline only takes you so far.

That said, horses back then would have not typically been faster. The counts and such would be riding destriers, a horse bred for combat, no speed. They were huge, hulking creatures designed through selective breeding to hold a man's weight and that of any armour and arms for extended periods of times. They were not built for speed. So, the horses in the mod are about right considering that the only horse breeds we have now a days are working breeds and those bred for racing. Destriers, palfreys and charges (and their respective sub-breeds) are all but bred out for their lack of need.

The speeds in this mod seem appropriate for the setting it is portraying, by my reckoning at least. I'm not saying I'm an expert, but from having personal experience in wearing the kind of kit they wore and partaking in (somewhat) the actions these men did and riding horses for a good portion of my life, the dev's have got it working well. Nothing needs tweaking.

Except maybe disallowing Pymous a crossbow.


Hope that helps to shed some light on the situation.

 

[NovaTitan]

If you understood how constrained we are by the engine you wouldn't be making these inane posts.

Pardon my ignorance, I am not knowledgeable in programming or this engine either. Devs aren't willing to open up the code fully either, so I understand how limited modders have with WB.

I was arguing that horses speed is definitely lower than native.

What are you arguing? We all know that they are slower than Native.

Are you sure you're playing the same mod? Horses feel an arseload faster than in native to me.

Besides, I already love the stamina system put in place where the horse noticeably and rightfully so weakens as it takes damage.

There is no stamina system. The horse takes damage, he becomes lame, no system there.

Yeah, it's not akin to FPS sprinting or anything like RO. Does the horse slow down based on how much health it has left? I'm not sure as I haven't tested it. If it does, then that's a workaround stamina system.

I'd love a stamina system for horses, but horses have lots of stamina and could be ridden for hours until death if necessary.

Whut?

For sprinting and speeding up. Like in real life. I didn't word it that well.

I feel the general vision of this mod was to slow down everything and not for historical reasons either.

Correctamundo. Rathos and myself ******** detest Native... We are nasty people who nerf everything that we hate in Native.

Stop getting so bloody offended. It was an honest question. I'm not trolling these forums.

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

This chap does not know me well enough, it seems!

Late night + Eiríkur = RAR! I am a more amiable person during the day. 

 

[NovaTitan]

I do a lot of re-enactment and I can say that the speeds they have coded in the mod are relative to reality. No matter what people think modern man is in no way SUPERIOR to those of the medieval era in a physical way. While yes, it does seem that they move quite slow whilst wearing linen but running with a sword is no easy task, nor with a giant wood and iron shield strapped to your forearm, especially when the majority of it is uphill. Ever had to fight up hill in a shield wall? It's not fun and is damn right frustrating sometimes. Speaking from personal experience here, these men did this day in day out, they were a lot more adept at anything we can do now, we are just simply not built for it by means of inconstant manual labour and a far superior quality of life. I'm a pretty big lad, I've done re-enactments for around 7 years now (Roman, Saxon and recently Pike block) and I can tell you after ten minutes of swinging that 5 lb sword around and holding that 8lb shield up you are pretty damn tired, no matter how fit you are. Adrenaline plays a big part of what we can and cannot achieve but adrenaline only takes you so far.

That said, horses back then would have not typically been faster. The counts and such would be riding destriers, a horse bred for combat, no speed. They were huge, hulking creatures designed through selective breeding to hold a man's weight and that of any armour and arms for extended periods of times. They were not built for speed. So, the horses in the mod are about right considering that the only horse breeds we have now a days are working breeds and those bred for racing. Destriers, palfreys and charges (and their respective sub-breeds) are all but bred out for their lack of need.

The speeds in this mod seem appropriate for the setting it is portraying, by my reckoning at least. I'm not saying I'm an expert, but from having personal experience in wearing the kind of kit they wore and partaking in (somewhat) the actions these men did and riding horses for a good portion of my life, the dev's have got it working well. Nothing needs tweaking.

Except maybe disallowing Pymous a crossbow.


Hope that helps to shed some light on the situation.

Aaaah, yes it makes sense with the horses. After all, the horses we have are far different from the medieval era bar Mongolian ponies and perhaps breeds in the Middle East.

I did a bit of boxing before and you do get tired quickly when relatively unfit compared to experts and it's due to the resistance. I'm sure swinging along with 3-5lb weapon on a shield would definitely start to wear you down.

Thanks for the input. It gave me perspective for a non-reenactor.

 

[NovaTitan]

This chap does not know me well enough, it seems!

Late night + Eiríkur = RAR! I am a more amiable person during the day. 

Probably has to do with your lineage. 

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

This chap does not know me well enough, it seems!

Late night + Eiríkur = RAR! I am a more amiable person during the day. 

Probably has to do with your lineage. 

-hugs!

 

[Éadric]

I'm fine with faster horses.

But for the love of God, either way: give riders some real damage (or even death at times) and weapon-loss when their horses are killed from under them at high speed.

I think it's a bit silly that footmen can lose their weapons by horsebump, but horsemen always keep their weapon, now matter how spectacular the fall.