Weapons, Armor and the Hit to Kill Ratio

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If the poll you made which shows a majority of players against your suggestion isn't enough, it is probably impossible to ever convince you of the basic facts of reality.

Yes a massive 25 people out of a 200,000+ playerbase have voiced their massive opposition -how could one argue against such numbers?!

Its like the Committee of Nay at Taleworlds psychology has seeped its way down here into the sewers on the forums where stragglers look for crumbs to quibble over. Im sure if TaleWorlds announced tomorrow " We havent forgotten our vision of this game and we have been working very hard on a fresh new Combat Overhaul system..." those 25 people would jump for joy.

Pretty funny to see such staunch opposition to a mere idea in a suggestions forum tbh.
 
Look, the situations I have exposed are situations that are already being taken into consideration.
The game "already takes into account 6 hurtboxes" for each model (including the hitboxes of bullets, weapons etc.).
Going from 6 hurtboxes to 10 is a cost issue like this:
1) computational.
solution: they can be done by choosing to have 500 vs 500 battles instead of 1000 vs 1000.
You can't just waive that concern to just shrinking battles by half. I don't know the intricacies but going from 6 hit boxes on a single NPC to 10 is not just a straight '4' differential to balance elsewhere; it's exponentially affected. So even if (big if) they somehow implement your proposed system, I can maybe see this possible in 10v10 situations maybe before the battles get too convoluted with the background calculations.

2) remodeling of the armor catalog.
There is work to be done, but not that it is "complicated", there is only work on what is changed.
In short, to give you an example: if the upper limb is divided into 3 parts "arm, elbow, forearm", then the equipment that will first protect the entire upper limb must be reformulated into:
arm protector and forearm protector (leaving the elbow uncovered).
Obviously you have to take the old model of equipment of the upper limb and separate the parts relating to the arm and forearm and make them SEPARATE MODELS. (Which on blender and I suppose also with their graphic engine is done in 2 seconds).
The various parameters must be assigned to these (armor value, weight .. etc .. and which hurtbox should be covered).
End of work.
Apply it on the various pieces of the armor catalog.
I think you're mixing what we mean on the 'complicated' part; conceptually, what you are proposing is very 'basic' (as it's really only explaining to us how RL works). It's implementing it while maintaining the full-scale battles, and on whatever budget/asset TW assigned to this, that we're trying to say makes it near impossible. You're asking them to redo their models/animation completely into further parts, then remodel all the equipment to match, then reassign numbers and damage values to them; this isn't even accounting for your other proposal with different 'exposed' body parts to line up with the 'aesthetic' of the armor (ie face shield, elbow joints, etc...).

Not even going to get into what you replied to @Ask or @five bucks as that is even more ridiculous.

Changing numbers is what we really only need; up the armor and change the penetration/scaling formula of the damage/weapons against it (ie blunt 100%??). There's enough formula/calculations in the game where it only needs changing those values around to get a more realistic representation of medieval combat.
 
But both the developers and the fan base insist on looking for quick solutions that don't work.
Aside from your entire reply which honestly is just tiring to go through anymore, this point keeps sticking out to me. How do you know your system is better and that others won't work? Do you have a proof of concept somewhere? Did you copy the system from another game that is similar to Bannerlord and makes it work? Or is it just your theorycrafting?
 
Aside from your entire reply which honestly is just tiring to go through anymore, this point keeps sticking out to me. How do you know your system is better and that others won't work? Do you have a proof of concept somewhere? Did you copy the system from another game that is similar to Bannerlord and makes it work? Or is it just your theorycrafting?
I don't know if it's a test but an attempt to apply what I've been writing for years is being applied in some other game whose context is very different.
If we take horizon forbidden west, the system of localized damage and protected hurtboxes has been expanded compared to the first game in the series.
Obviously in that game the armor system is used against your character who uses the bow and therefore has to aim either at the uncovered parts or to disassemble / destroy the protections and then hit the hurboxes.
The system has also been partially extended to humanoid enemies (you can see that they like it because it makes the gameplay deeper) just to MAKE THE FIGHT AGAINST HUMAN DEEPEST.
But I don't give a damn about that game, since hand-to-hand combat isn't directional and that armor system is only enhanced by the use of the bow.
In mount and blade it would be highly valued and not only would it make the hand-to-hand combat more technical (in the sense that the spam of inaccurate attacks by the opponent is discouraged as much as your rigid protections cover your body) but it would make the armor both realistic, and, above all, a lever for solving many balance problems between units (especially the ratio between units with ranged weapons and footed units without shields).
Furthermore, by adopting the system, you could take advantage of opportunities such as removing the delay of the attacks after releasing the key.
In addition, the blocking system of attacks could be made more precise with regard to lunges.

Specifically: the blocking system for horizontal and vertical attacks could also remain as it is.
For the lunges, on the other hand, I would suggest a more coherent system.
After all the spears only do 2 types of attack, and both are visually lunges although the game considers them as "attack from above and lunge".
In general, you could use "the animation of the block direction change", ie when, for example,you are blocking attacks from the right (holding down the right button and mouse to the right)and then switches to blocking attacks on the left (moving the mouse to the left and quickly releasing and pressing the right button again). The character's guard switches from defending the right side to defending the left one, but the ANIMATION it performs causes the weapon to still remain in guard position(vertically) during that animation.
By taking advantage of the weapon hitbox during that animation, you can make sure that if the defender's weapon hitbox makes contact with the attacker's weapon hitbox, the lunge is "blocked".
Otherwise the attack hits.
The same concept can be applied to the transition from high to low guard and vice versa.
In this case the lunges of the spears ARE NO LONGER DIRECTIONAL ATTACKS and therefore cannot be blocked by keeping the guard raised up or down, but only during the movement of the guard from one direction to another or in any case when the hitboxes of the weapons collide.

In this way a warrior armed only with a sword and without an armor with rigid protections, will find himself in difficulty against a warrior armed with a spear, because his thrusts could hit him anywhere and defend himself is possible but not easy.
Conversely, if the same warrior wears armor with protected hurtbixes (covered hurtbixes), the number of uncovered hurtboxes is very limited and therefore the spearman will have to "aim well with thrusts" in those few uncovered areas.
Uncovered areas that are not defensible in a simple way as before, because the animation to block the lunges implies that they must be INTERCEPTED.
If a warrior with a spear performs a feint simulating a lunge to the left shoulder and the defender moves his guard to the left to intercept him, then he uncovers his right shoulder, which will be immediately targeted and, if little covered, risks being hit with the lunge that follows after the fake one.

In general with THIS SYSTEM it is however possible to return to the old one.
If the various armors have hurtboxes that in the new system must remain uncovered, the developer may find it useful an option to check when desired that assigns the cover of the hurtboxes that in the new system were considered uncovered to the relative types of armor slots that in the old system covered them. . In this way you change between the old system and the new system.The only difference, not a small one, is that you would have a much wider catalog of armor parts (since only the upper limb, which is composed of the arm, elbow and forearm , would include at least 2 protections, for the arm and forearm, instead of 1 and in the case of returning to the old system the elbow would be covered either by the arm or forearm protection, at the developer's choice).

In this way a warrior armed only with a sword and without an armor with rigid protections, will find himself in difficulty against a warrior armed with a spear, because his thrusts could hit him anywhere and defend himself is possible but not easy.
Conversely, if the same warrior wears armor with protected hurtbixes (covered hurtbixes), the number of uncovered hurtboxes is very limited and therefore the spearman will have to "aim well with thrusts" in those few uncovered areas.
Uncovered areas that are not defensible in a simple way as before, because the animation to block the lunges implies that they must be INTERCEPTED.
If a warrior with a spear performs a feint simulating a lunge to the left shoulder and the defender moves his guard to the left to intercept him, then he uncovers his right shoulder, which will be immediately targeted and, if little covered, risks being hit with the lunge that follows after the fake one.

In general with THIS SYSTEM it is however possible to return to the old one.
If the various armors have hurtboxes that in the new system must remain uncovered, the developer may find it useful an option to check when desired that assigns the cover of the hurtboxes that in the new system were considered uncovered to the relative types of armor slots that in the old system covered them. . In this way you change between the old system and the new system.The only difference, not a small one, is that you would have a much wider catalog of armor parts (since only the upper limb, which is composed of the arm, elbow and forearm , would include at least 2 protections, for the arm and forearm, instead of 1 and in the case of returning to the old system the elbow would be covered either by the arm or forearm protection, at the developer's choice).
 
@darksoulshin -have you ever attempted any modeling/animation/ fire geometry and the AI - type coding? Because thats what your looking at here - and then the Config to get it all in action. Its been done before in other games (adding a whole new fire geom kit) but its never a small feat. Similar -theres always a crowd of naysayers saying it cant/shouldnt be done. You can promote all the argument you want via text -but sometimes you gotta start offering up some proof of concept as well.
 
Yes a massive 25 people out of a 200,000+ playerbase have voiced their massive opposition -how could one argue against such numbers?!

Pretty funny to see such staunch opposition to a mere idea in a suggestions forum tbh.
Obviously it's a small sample size. Point is that this forum usually views any suggestion with a "sure, why not" attitude, because it costs them nothing to support it. So when even the usually receptive forum is telling you your idea would be...

* too much work

* of minimal actual benefit (therefore a waste of time when there are so many problems in the game that need fixing more and already aren't getting fixed)

* bad for performance

It's time to take notice.
solution: they can be done by choosing to halve the battle size
@darksoulshin I don't ****ing want to halve the battle size! Big battles are one of the selling points of this game.

Actually think critically about your suggestion - giving up 500 troops in a battle, and wasting heaps of development time that would be better used elsewhere, so you can get slightly more detailed combat that you will barely ever notice? It isn't worth it.
If we take horizon forbidden west, the system of localized damage and protected hurtboxes has been expanded compared to the first game in the series
And it caused problems. https://www.msn.com/en-us/entertain...-are-causing-headaches-for-players/ar-AAW0YpY

Horizon forbidden west also doesn't have 500v500 AI troops fighting at once.

Anyway, not gonna waste more time replying to these wacky ideas because the chance of Taleworlds putting in the large amounts of unnecessary work for them is incredibly low.
 
just giving humans a .5 damage modifier made my game much more fun
using arMore and armor does something 2, made troops useful

screw all that complex stuff, just a working placeholder will be fine
the current placeholder is making unarmoured 1-3-hit-kills armoured 1-3-hit-kills
 
Obviously it's a small sample size. Point is that this forum usually views any suggestion with a "sure, why not" attitude, because it costs them nothing to support it. So when even the usually receptive forum is telling you your idea would be...

That can be for a variety of reasons such as people just not liking the guy or the way he presents his ideas. The sample size is 25 people out of a potential 5,000,000 sold -thats like 0.0001% or in other terms totally insignificant -absolutely nothing of statistical substance can be drawn from that whatsoever.

I don't ****ing want to halve the battle size! Big battles are one of the selling points of this game.

That was just him guessing to ease fears but there is zero real information here. The Tank Armor system of Arma used to be so bad, a 9mm Handgun could eventually disable one if shot enough. First came along a mod team to introduce a complete armor system, including penetrable and non penetrable compartments and angles, a **** ton of hit boxes and all kinds of levels of High Math. Did it lower the amount of tanks one could use -maybe initially, until further optimized and now has been incorporated and even better 'd by the Developers themselves once they saw the superiority of the system. That was officially released Post release of the game itself. And just as well -had its naysayers early on worried about "the hit to the CPU". Nobody says that now.

Looks more like a popularity contest here if nothing else -and while you have some decent ideas as well Five bucks -your ideas have about the same chance of actually making into the official game as his in the end.
 
That can be for a variety of reasons such as people just not liking the guy or the way he presents his ideas. The sample size is 25 people out of a potential 5,000,000 sold -thats like 0.0001% or in other terms totally insignificant -absolutely nothing of statistical substance can be drawn from that whatsoever.
Sure, maybe it could. But judging by the actual replies that everyone keeps making including in this thread, I'm going to make the logical assumption that people think the idea is a massive waste of time and resources that would damage performance for barely any improvement to gameplay. I'm not sure why you keep talking about statistical substance when I've already addressed that.
That was just him guessing to ease fears but there is zero real information here. The Tank Armor system of Arma used to be so bad, a 9mm Handgun could eventually disable one if shot enough. First came along a mod team to introduce a complete armor system, including penetrable and non penetrable compartments and angles, a **** ton of hit boxes and all kinds of levels of High Math. Did it lower the amount of tanks one could use -maybe initially, until further optimized and now has been incorporated and even better 'd by the Developers themselves once they saw the superiority of the system. That was officially released Post release of the game itself. And just as well -had its naysayers early on worried about "the hit to the CPU". Nobody says that now.
Tell me, in Arma do they have 500v500 tank battles? Or even 100v100? If not, then it's not comparable to this situation.

Bannerlord already barely gets good performance as it is. The reality of the situation is that anything which increases the performance load significantly for a minimal gameplay benefit is not a good idea.
Looks more like a popularity contest here if nothing else -and while you have some decent ideas as well Five bucks -your ideas have about the same chance of actually making into the official game as his in the end.
The thing is, they're not even my ideas. My posts are almost all just suggesting content which was in Warband or content which was in previous demos of Bannerlord.

Unlike DSS's suggestion, there is definitely enthusiasm for those features in the community; they would increase the fun of the game noticeably, they would not impact performance, and modders like Bloc have shown that they can be done in a week, while changing the entire hitbox system and AI could take a hell of a lot of time.

I'll fully admit there is a chance Bannerlord will be a bad sequel which doesn't follow up on some of the promises it made. But there is also a realistic chance they will go the other direction, which is why I'm still bothering to post.

On the other hand, there's no realistic chance of Taleworlds completely replacing the existing AI and hitboxes at this stage of development for basically no improvement in the fun value of the game and a hit to performance. Not when they could just change the values like everyone is asking for (including in this thread) and get functionally the same result without the same downsides. Now let's stop discussing that nonsense.
 
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'm not sure why you keep talking about statistical substance when I've already addressed that.
Because you keep using it to formulate your perceived "general opinion". Its irrelevant.

Tell me, in Arma do they have 500v500 tank battles? Or even 100v100? If not, then it's not comparable to this situation.

Guess you dont get it out much -Arma has shown battles of over 2000 AI fighting. The game even computes in real time absolutely every bullet fired even if in an unseen battles 10 kmhs away. And yes, upgrades like a full new armor system will temporarily challenge performance -as will many meaningful upgrades of that nature. All to be resolved.

anything which increases the performance load significantly for a minimal gameplay benefit is not a good idea.
The idea of a much more intensive hitbox system as well as an AI designed to have to compensate for it over todays simplified fighting system is a very good idea to me.

The thing is, they're not even my ideas. My posts are almost all just suggesting content which was in Warband or content which was in previous demos of Bannerlord.

Unlike DSS's suggestion, there is definitely enthusiasm for those features in the community; they would increase the fun of the game noticeably, they would not impact performance, and modders like Bloc have shown that they can be done in a week, while changing the entire hitbox system and AI could take a hell of a lot of time.

Also just opinions are only of a small dot of the overall spectrum of Bannerlord fans. And again just as (not) likely to get implemented at the official capacity. Its only your opinion and those of a few others that have created an echo chamber making it feel more likely and highly favored -its not.
On the other hand, there's no realistic chance of Taleworlds completely replacing the existing AI and hitboxes at this stage of development for basically no improvement in the fun value of the game and a hit to performance
Here i would agree -but again, statistically the same chance your ideas have so really they are all moot. Also the reason i suggested this guy start creating Proof of Concept because just text examples of that complexity are going nowhere.
Now let's stop discussing that nonsense.

Well then, leave the guy free to express his ideas. He has the same right as you do.
 
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Because you keep using it to formulate your perceived "general opinion"
As my prior response said, that is not the case.
Guess you dont get it out much -Arma has shown battles of over 2000 AI fighting.
"AI" as in troops, or as in tanks? Do they have 500v500 tank battles with their highly detailed tank hit detection? I looked up Arma tank battles and they seem to be 15v15.
And yes, upgrades like a full new armor system will temporarily challenge performance -as will many meaningful upgrades of that nature. All to be resolved.
Optimisation is not something magical where you just work for long enough and every problem can be resolved. Computers can only handle so many calculations at a time, the more complexity you pile onto them, the worse performance will get, and optimization can only simplify the number and complexity of calculations so far before it becomes a question of the physical limitations of hardware.
The idea of a much more intensive hitbox system as well as an AI designed to have to compensate for it over todays simplified fighting system is a very good idea to me.
I'm sure it's a good idea to you. In an ideal world it would look like a nice idea to me too. But that's because you're ignoring crucial information:
* The actual benefit would be almost not noticeable
* It would require a lot of work in a game where there are too many things that require work more urgently than something that would give an unnoticeable benefit
* It would hurt performance too, for something that would not be noticeable
Also just opnions of a small dot of the overall spectrum of Bannerlord fans. And again just as (not) likely to get implemented at the official capacity. Its only your opinion and those of a few others that have created an echo chamber making it feel more likely and highly favored -its not.
Actually no, I've also seen widespread enthusiasm/demands for Warband's features and the crime features outside these forums.
Here i would agree -but again, statistically the same chance your ideas have so really they are all moot
"Statistically" what? Can you rephrase this sentence?
Well then, leave the guy free to express his ideas. He has the same right as you do.
And it's in my interests to point out that it'll waste development time and make performance worse for barely any benefit.

Just try and look at it objectively for a second. Multiple significant downsides, for one very small upside that will barely be noticed. In what way is that a good deal?
 
"AI" as in troops, or as in tanks? Do they have 500v500 tank battles with their highly detailed tank hit detection? I looked up Arma tank battles and they seem to be 15v15.

Ive coded for the series for 20 years -i think id know more than your lil google spite search. Matter fact im code testing for a new tank pathfinding system using terrain vector graphics algorithms -even in that hearty bit of code ive got over 30 tanks and could use far far more.
Optimisation is not something magical where you just work for long enough and every problem can be resolved. Computers can only handle so many calculations at a time, the more complexity you pile onto them, the worse performance will get, and optimization can only simplify the number and complexity of calculations so far before it becomes a question of the physical limitations of hardware.

Your preaching to the choir and ive already addressed that. Absolutely EVERY upgrade in a system as robust as damage etc will effect optimization to an extent. Thats life. First comes the concept, than the proof of concept, than the trial model, the model and finally optimization of that model. Please dont preach to me about computations as you clearly dont understand how all major upgrades operate.

* The actual benefit would be almost not noticeable

Your surmising an unknown. If AI were given a heavier more intricate attack and defense instruction alongside a more detailed hitbox system -THAT would be very noticeable. Curious -how did you feel about the new AI battle system Treebeard modded into PoP as well as Last Days Mod -too big too complex?? Was it not worth it?

Actually no, I've also seen widespread enthusiasm/demands for Warband's features and the crime features outside these forums.
Just stop dude. Keep singing for your own parade -tell you what -let me know when Armagon implements them and ill give ya a cookie. Until then -its just noise that you like.

tatistically" what? Can you rephrase this sentence?
As in 0%. Your chance of getting your ideas into the base game.

And it's in my interests to point out that it'll waste development time and make performance worse for barely any benefit.

Sure voice your opinion - i choose to rather support ideas small and large, his is loftier but so the f what?
In what way is that a good deal?

Already stated. More robust combat system to improve this very base one is a good deal in my view.
 
Ive coded for the series for 20 years -i think id know more than your lil google spite search. Matter fact im code testing for a new tank pathfinding system using terrain vector graphics algorithms -even in that hearty bit of code ive got over 30 tanks and could use far far more.
The question/argument was that 30 tanks is not the same thing as even 200, let alone 1000. Is that a correct statement?

Can you actually give evidence of 1000 tanks running in Arma with that sophisticated hitbox system *and* good performance or are you just going to say "I know better than you" as your proof?
Your preaching to the choir and ive already addressed that. Absolutely EVERY upgrade in a system as robust as damage etc will effect optimization to an extent. Thats life. First comes the concept, than the proof of concept, than the trial model, the model and finally optimization of that model.
What you're saying is correct but not addressing my argument at all. My point was that you cannot completely optimise out the physical limitations of hardware. It is obvious from Bannerlord's development that things are already being pushed close to their limits to have 500v500 actors each individually using a sophisticated combat and damage system, and coordinating formation tactics too.

To add another burden to the AI and damage calculations that would literally be multiplied by 1000 is going to have a major impact and you can't just explain that away by saying "every upgrade will effect optimisation to an extent". Of course it will. That does not counter the argument that this will affect performance TOO MUCH.
Your surmising an unknown. If AI were given a heavier more intricate attack and defense instruction alongside a more detailed hitbox system -THAT would be very noticeable.
You say I'm surmising an unknown, then you make a definitive statement about an unknown yourself. But anyway. Let's address these as two separate issues, as they do not have to be adopted part and parcel.

The hitbox system changing to add a bunch of tiny (in his own words) hitboxes on the groin, armpit, side of the head etc. would barely be noticeable, in exchange for a significant performance hit. You're never actually going to target accurately enough in this game to hit someone on a tiny armpit hitbox with scope-less ranged weapons unless they're standing still at a close distance, you're rarely going to hit a tiny armpit hitbox with melee except maybe in a tournament 1v1 because battles have too much going on to focus on that and your opponent's arms and legs will usually be in the way. Therefore the hitbox changes are not worth doing at all.

The AI is a separate issue: I'm in favour of the AI being made slightly better at blocking. But going all out and giving them a super sophisticated combat system? It would indeed be even more noticeable. But once you multiply that AI upgrade by 1000, the performance hit is going to be ENORMOUS. Therefore, only small upgrades are viable.
Curious -how did you feel about the new AI battle system Treebeard modded into PoP as well as Last Days Mod -too big too complex?? Was it not worth it?
If you're going to introduce this into the argument as evidence of your position, can you post video of it or explain how much changed?
As in 0%. Your chance of getting your ideas into the base game.
This 0% figure is based on nothing at all. I have already clearly outlined the differences between adding something which would barely impact performance, would noticeably make the game more fun, was actually indicated by TW to be in the game, and can easily be added; vs. something which would significantly impact performance, was never indicated by TW to be in the game, would not noticeably make the game more fun and would require difficulty to add.
Already stated. More robust combat system to improve this very base one is a good deal in my view.
If it was just a question of "more robust combat system" I would support it too. The point of the question which you cut out is that there's two big downsides to adding these tiny hitboxes - big performance impact and lots of work required - and only one small upside - you can do more damage if you hit someone's armpit, which even skilled players will rarely be able to exploit in practice, let alone the majority of players.

There's no point in continuing this discussion unless you're willing to address the key point of each argument, rather than editing out the key point and just replying to the parts that are easy to answer.
 
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A very high skill level and/or high relative speed will reduce the HTK by 1 or 2. Thus enabling an instant death with a couched lance, while standing still and thrusting the lance will take about 4-5 hits to kill the agent.
Just to add on, if you buy a Long Glaive the high base power and speed bonus from mounted speed will absolutely let you 1hk Elite Cataphracts and heavy armored Lords with just 0-18(default cap) Polearm skill.

Just fix armors
Yes please, however a Cap on bonus speed damage would be good too, otherwise it would take very high reduction to stop you from getting 1hko while riding a horse and somebody bumps you foot with thier plowing hoe. It should be capped and not go up forever depending on speed and only work with some weapons.

I'm also okay with adding more HP to high tier troops and more HP perks or a skill too. I very much dislike everyone having 100+ HP. I much prefer the warband with 40 hp looters and such, with only beefy troops having 85 and such. So adding more HP is kinda trying to achieve this effect.

I'm not 100% sure but didn't they already say they weren't gonna change the damage calculations?
Last I heard, they're "always working on it" but no guarantee if they're version of balance is what we're asking for.

:facepalm: My god I really dispair when I read things like this. I mean have to ask myself why do they even have a test build? Why not try buffing the numbers and seeing how well players like or dislike it? I guess this is too much for someone at Taleworlds to figure out. They gotta get their priorities straight because figuring out who gets what offices in the new building are more important. :iamamoron:
I always blame their scuffed MP design. Like I think they somehow have the idea that everything dying in 2-3 hits is exciting and E-sports and... I don't know, but I don't think they look at like a long, grindy, protracted RPG with management and strategy elements where the player puts time and effort into turning resources into power. I know that game testers usually test things in a acute way where they're only looking at a certain part of the game at once, so they may have no idea what it's like to start a campaign and build it up and spending 500 hours actually taking the map. Or how it feels to fight the same army every other day forever.
 
That does not counter the argument that this will affect performance TOO MUCH.
You have no idea how much it will effect performance as operations like that don’t stop once they implement the feature - thats the beginning, then the optimization begins. How well and efficient is it coded , is the engine running efficiently on multiple threads or land locked on one processor like Arma - these are all the types of questions I’ve relayed to you that you’ve ignored. Do you realize how new models get added to existing game, optimization to prevent FPS is always kept forefront.

So how is it you know in your seemingly limited programming experience how drastically this upgrade would degrade performance post optimization? Are you Melvin the mind reader?
 
You have no idea how much it will effect performance as operations like that don’t stop once they implement the feature - thats the beginning, then the optimization begins. How well and efficient is it coded , is the engine running efficiently on multiple threads or land locked on one processor like Arma - these are all the types of questions I’ve relayed to you that you’ve ignored. Do you realize how new models get added to existing game, optimization to prevent FPS is always kept forefront.

So how is it you know in your seemingly limited programming experience how drastically this upgrade would degrade performance post optimization? Are you Melvin the mind reader?

I'm no programmer. All experience I have with programming comes from modding warband (superficially) and programming a game in c# in unity (and failing).

Though if there is one thing I learned from that is that it is more than usefull to keep things as simple as possible. Both because the more complicated you make your systems the more difficult they are to implement and also the more prone they are to have bugs. A simple system is also extremely more easy to find bugs and locate them. In some cases the complexity of a system prevents one to even comprehend whats wrong with it when a problem arises.

For these reasons you want to ask yourself the following question: Is the amount of work and risk I have to put into a complex system worth it in terms of gameplay?

Now before you answer that question keep these things in mind:
-It took TW the better part of two years to fix siege ladders and towers
-TW's standard answer to every system proposed no matter how important to gameplay and how easy to implement it is is: "tOo cOmPLicAtED"
-If anybody is willing to implement your system it will be a modder not TW
-M&B is not Chivalry or Mordhau it isn't only about fighting but also about roleplaying and sandbox strategy. Fighting is just one (be it important) aspect of the game
-resources put into overcomplicating combat could be spent better in other aspects of the game to much greater effect
-complicating a system such as yours has knock on effects on the rest of the game. You want a bazillion hitboxes with different armor values? Well somebody has to go through all armors and set these. Then somebody has to playtest wether these values are allright and good luck with that since there is a multitude of different situations in which the armor would need to be tested in.

Don't get me wrong. I like your idea and you are certainly not the first one to have it. It really isn't rocket since. Anybody who is interested in realism has thought about increasing the amount of hitboxes (me included). But it just isn't practical. And the fact that the majority of people on your poll disagree with you shows that most people understand this. It is not like people here see a complex system that makes the game more realistic and think to themselves: "man I sure don't want my game to be more detailed and realistic, where is the fun in that?" No. They think to themselves: "this would be a nightmare to implement and devour resources like a black hole devours entire stars"
 
I don't ****ing want to halve the battle size! Big battles are one of the selling points of this game
the problem here is the definition of "big battles with big numbers".
1000 vs 1000 is not a big battle with big numbers.
They are small numbers, like 500 vs 500.
Either way you don't have the numbers to generate, with the use of tactical effects that only emerge when the numbers are really large.
For me, big numbers mean 10,000 vs 10,000
Below this threshold, doing 500 vs 500 and 2000 vs 2000, is quite similar to me and is similar due to the non-appearance of data phenomena related to pressure and thrust on the front lines, etc.
and wasting heaps of development time that would be better used elsewhere, so you can get slightly more detailed combat that you will barely ever notice?
"barely even notice".
If that's not prejudice, I don't know what it is.
You would notice the changes all right.
In 1 vs 1 you would notice the abysmal difference between having an enemy with full plate armor against you and one wearing some plates.
You should aim for the first only in the few uncovered areas (neck, elbows and armpits), while against the second you would have more freedom of choice.
Since at first, with piercing and cutting weapons, you would risk not hitting him in the weak points (he defends himself of course), you would opt for a nice club.
Against the latter you would have more choice.
If instead the enemy wore a gambeson, then the amzze would be less effective although the blows would arrive everywhere, while swords and piercing blows, with the due differences between them, would be more effective than a club.
For those wearing a mix or several layers of armor, you should take a good look at it and see where it is best to hit and with what type of weapon.
Because hitting with a sword straight on the plate would imply having to hit your opponent at least 50 times before being able to knock him down, while hitting him in the open spot implies hitting him 3-4 times.

With the old system wherever you hit it, if the enemy is wearing a uniform set of armor (all of the same type), you the player are not rewarded for your aim and you are not punished for inaccurate spam of attacks.
So you would have a degree of challenge that is proportional to the quality of the enemy's protection and the challenge degree would not be related to "numbers" and "level", but to your "ability to identify weak points and hit them with good aim and correct tactics. "

But apparently you wouldn't notice these differences.
So either you don't see or you pretend you don't see.
Usually, an argument presented is answered with a counter-argument that is itself an argument, not with an arbitrary judgment.
So I wait to see the "why I would hardly notice differences" when I just explained why you "would notice the differences very well".
 
-have you ever attempted any modeling/animation/ fire geometry and the AI - type coding? Because thats what your looking at here - and then the Config to get it all in action. Its been done before in other games (adding a whole new fire geom kit) but its never a small feat. Similar -theres always a crowd of naysayers saying it cant/shouldnt be done. You can promote all the argument you want via text -but sometimes you gotta start offering up some proof of concept as well.
Unfortunately, I cannot dedicate my time to doing this because I have to dedicate it to studying other topics (which absorb my energy and time). If I had time and I wasn't already mentally tired I would embark on the study of coding, modeling and animation, which in any case I will do one day because I have an interest in this field, also for what I study.

Given that this game, more than as "a game among many" or see it as "a unique and rare case", I wanted it to express its full potential and to express it or suggested the use of mechanics that in part, in a particular way , exist in other games but are exploited in other ways.

When I make suggestions, I try to suggest operating methods that are the same as those already followed by the development studio.
By themselves they have nothing new to add, it is just an expansion of the system.
A test example (although I'm not sure) would be the neck hurtbox versus the shoulder and head shockbox.
If you are wearing a piece of armor in your shoulders and head, these two hurtboxes are covered, but if I am not mistaken, when it comes to "arrows and neck", the neck ends badly regardless of the protection worn, as its hurtboxes, IF I am not mistaken, it is not protected either by the helmet or by the shoulder armor.
This situation, if I have stated it correctly, is a proof of concept.
 
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