We need a real serious revamp of how Player's Units/Parties are treated by the game. Why is it do hard to just leave them ALONE!

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

I'm so fed up with the way this game just tosses troops out for no reason at all. I've made other reports and post about the garrison related garbage, food garbage, I seen plenty of people complain about clan parties just losing troops for reason, well I'm paying close attention in 1.6.1 and it just vanishes a elite troops form my clan party, in an army with me for no reason at all. We have plenty of food, money and they weren't even at party cap (not that it should matter). I'm checking it constantly as I replace their party with the troops I want so I notice it just suddenly drops 1 for no reason. I have to load an old save from 30 mins ago now, because nothing is more valuable then 1 good troops. I takes days of campaign time to go replace it. I wish to I could just tell my clam member to make the troops I want instead of having to swap troops with them but of course that's too much right?
Okay, I found semi workaround by just inspecting thier troops immediately after each battle to upgrade thier recruits for them, but still I want to trust them with my hunky guys!

@Duh_TaleWorlds @SadShogun @Dejan I don't know at all who deals with this mechanic but please, it needs to be locked down tight so that the troops the player raises up can't get thrown away for ANY reason what so ever. If I can't just use and keep the troops I want I don't understand what the point of playing this game is supposed to be? I should just keep making the party I want and it deletes it's self "oh you put it in a garrison.." "Oh the clan party...... number....?????..."

Troops should NEVER be thrown away or given away or ANYTHING else, no mechanic or reason is acceptable. I, the human player picked out and raised up those troops myself and I expect to use them until they die in battle.

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

Just to be clear - what you are describing only occurs when you hand off the troops to a settlement or mobile party (which have some autonomy) right?

If so, does the removal from garrisons occur if you have the no recruitment / donation ticked and have the allowed wage set above the actual wage? Mexxico implemented the wage toggle to deal with situations like this.

As for parties, we can make it a suggestion to have a toggle to lock party behavior in some way (f.e. don't disband any troops).

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

Just to be clear - what you are describing only occurs when you hand off the troops to a settlement or mobile party (which have some autonomy) right?

My gripe ATM is a clan party that is in an army with me, so they had almost zero campaign time without being attached to my party and the loss of the troops didn't occur until some time later after about 12 stops to recruit and trade troops around and and fight looters and what not. So they evidently do have some autonomy even in my army, but I don't agree that they should remove my (our...) troops in such a way. I only have them in a party to begin raising leadership and swapping troops is only to have room to raise recruits to the ranged branch and trade them back. At any other point I wouldn't give them any special troops, but I don't have a fief yet so it's normally how I create thier parties if I choose to become a vassal and in the past I haven't had problems. In recent versions I have read people complain of this so I was weary and watching out for it though. I don't understand at all the reasone or mechanic why it happened.

If so, does the removal from garrisons occur if you have the no recruitment / donation ticked and have the allowed wage set above the actual wage? Mexxico implemented the wage toggle to deal with situations like this.

This particular issue with the garrisons dropping troops has been reported here with a save
https://forums.taleworlds.com/index...re-raw-recruits-in-1-6-0.444931/#post-9720871
and here with a video
https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?threads/1-6-0-and-1-6-1-auto-recruitment-bug.445442/
The NO recruit checkbox does not seem to prevent the garrison from recruiting, it simply deletes other troops for some reason when it's disabled and still gets recruits, even without the wage limited.

As for parties, we can make it a suggestion to have a toggle to lock party behavior in some way (f.e. don't disband any troops).

Yeah, but I think really a bit more care should be used in how the game deals with the player clan's troops. It could be that the existing mechanic (that I don't understand) is appropriate for the AI parties, but it's not so for the player's clan as we take care and inventory with our troops often and feel our time obtaining them was an investment we expect to keep.

Thank you for reading this!

 

[Antaeus]

As for parties, we can make it a suggestion to have a toggle to lock party behavior in some way (f.e. don't disband any troops).

I do see the conflict here - we want our parties to have some autonomy - to recruit/upgrade new troops within their budget etc... but to not throw away those that we give to them - so we can safely give them high level troops that they have the budget to keep...

A functioning toggle for keeping them - the same as we have for inventory items and troops/prisoners in our own party would work wonders...and solve Ananda's issue I think.

If there were parties over budget, they should drop unchecked troops first...

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

This particular issue with the garrisons dropping troops has been reported here with a save
https://forums.taleworlds.com/index...re-raw-recruits-in-1-6-0.444931/#post-9720871
and here with a video
https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?threads/1-6-0-and-1-6-1-auto-recruitment-bug.445442/
The NO recruit checkbox does not seem to prevent the garrison from recruiting, it simply deletes other troops for some reason when it's disabled and still gets recruits, even without the wage limited.

Will check on the status of the bug. If it's broken, it will be fixed.

As far as I can tell an issue was found and a fix was made - this fix has also been sent to 1.6.0 and 1.6.1 since. That was 03/08/21 - so you likely need to wait for the next hotfix to see it.

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

Will check on the status of the bug. If it's broken, it will be fixed.

As far as I can tell an issue was found and a fix was made - this fix has also been sent to 1.6.0 and 1.6.1 since. That was 03/08/21 - so you likely need to wait for the next hotfix to see it.

Well that's very good news TY!

 

[KingEroc1st]

As far as I know, there are a few ways the game automatically deletes random units from your party for no logical reason which is completely thoughtless and annoying.
- companion/clan party troop donation to allied settlements
- random siege bombardment casualties
- companion/clan party replacing troops with recruited prisoners over limite

 

[snuggans]

- companion/clan party troop donation to allied settlements

this is likely what happened, especially since Ananda said they made 12 stops. armies will pad up garrisons if they're too weak. TaleWorlds will probably keep this feature, although having a toggle for the parties in your clan would be nice

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

I will include the donation in the discussion as well. Aka no disband/donate as a single toggle. (I don't think a multitude of small control valves would get approval but matching relatively similar ones may work.)

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

As far as I know, there are a few ways the game automatically deletes random units from your party for no logical reason which is completely thoughtless and annoying.
- companion/clan party troop donation to allied settlements
- random siege bombardment casualties
- companion/clan party replacing troops with recruited prisoners over limite

this is likely what happened, especially since Ananda said they made 12 stops. armies will pad up garrisons if they're too weak. TaleWorlds will probably keep this feature, although having a toggle for the parties in your clan would be nice

That's what they did, I loaded old auto save and I can see my Khuzait Torguud in the Vlandian garrison like a sore thumb! They got a 200 man garrison and 200 + militia why would they donate to that... but they did! ? Thanks for solving it guys, I didn't expect that at a healthy looking town!

I will include the donation in the discussion as well. Aka no disband/donate as a single toggle. (I don't think a multitude of small control valves would get approval but matching relatively similar ones may work.)

Sounds like the perfect solution thank you for bringing it forth to discussion!

 

[Askey]

I just want to say thank you to Duh, for responding to threads like this. Really good to see you guys interacting with the community, makes me feel hopeful for the future of this game and the general development of it.

 

[black_bulldog]

I'm so fed up with the way this game just tosses troops out for no reason at all. I've made other reports and post about the garrison related garbage, food garbage, I seen plenty of people complain about clan parties just losing troops for reason, well I'm paying close attention in 1.6.1 and it just vanishes a elite troops form my clan party, in an army with me for no reason at all. We have plenty of food, money and they weren't even at party cap (not that it should matter). I'm checking it constantly as I replace their party with the troops I want so I notice it just suddenly drops 1 for no reason. I have to load an old save from 30 mins ago now, because nothing is more valuable then 1 good troops. I takes days of campaign time to go replace it. I wish to I could just tell my clam member to make the troops I want instead of having to swap troops with them but of course that's too much right?
Okay, I found semi workaround by just inspecting thier troops immediately after each battle to upgrade thier recruits for them, but still I want to trust them with my hunky guys!

@Duh_TaleWorlds @SadShogun @Dejan I don't know at all who deals with this mechanic but please, it needs to be locked down tight so that the troops the player raises up can't get thrown away for ANY reason what so ever. If I can't just use and keep the troops I want I don't understand what the point of playing this game is supposed to be? I should just keep making the party I want and it deletes it's self "oh you put it in a garrison.." "Oh the clan party...... number....?????..."

No troops should NEVER be thrown away or given away or ANYTHING else, no mechanic or reason is acceptable. I, the human player picked out and raised up those troops myself and I expect to use them until they die in battle.

One of my biggest frustrations in this game is how TW keeps saying they don't want to give too many options because it will overwhelm the player. But to keep a tight reign on stuff like this you end up having to micro manage it, which is infinitely worse than giving people a set it and forget it policy. It becomes much more tedious and makes playing the game a chore. Taking away options and control from the player is probably the worst decision a game company/designer can do.

 

[Dabos37]

Yep, I do not get the “we do not want to overwhelm the player”, when we actually have not anything to do in late game except conquering the world.

 

[mujadaddy]

“we do not want to overwhelm the player”,

but, here, micro these siege engines;

but, here, micro these perks for everyone in your clan even with the toggle checked;

but, here, buy a Caravan (I bet they do it ?);

but, here's a governor/governor perk for you;

but, ...

 

[svelok]

One of my biggest frustrations in this game is how TW keeps saying they don't want to give too many options because it will overwhelm the player. But to keep a tight reign on stuff like this you end up having to micro manage it, which is infinitely worse than giving people a set it and forget it policy. It becomes much more tedious and makes playing the game a chore. Taking away options and control from the player is probably the worst decision a game company/designer can do.

The entire point of the game is that you don't have control, though. In battles you don't control each soldier like an RTS. On the map, you don't control every party like Total War. You play as one character and the other characters make their own decisions independent of you, it's the entire premise of the franchise.

That doesn't mean the AI should be frustrating and constantly working against you but time and time again people get upset because AI parties make decisions. People want to micromanage stuff like the troops of clan parties and that's just not what the game is about.

 

[black_bulldog]

The entire point of the game is that you don't have control, though. In battles you don't control each soldier like an RTS. On the map, you don't control every party like Total War. You play as one character and the other characters make their own decisions independent of you, it's the entire premise of the franchise.

That doesn't mean the AI should be frustrating and constantly working against you but time and time again people get upset because AI parties make decisions. People want to micromanage stuff like the troops of clan parties and that's just not what the game is about.

You're jumping to a lot conclusions, I never once said I want control of every soldier every character or anything like that. That kind of control is impossible. What I was asking for is that we don't have to micromange the game, but instead we need to be able to set the game up so we don't have to do that or did you not read what I wrote?

 

[svelok]

What I was asking for is that we don't have to micromange the game

But what you're asking for is exactly the ability to micromanage the game - you want 100% control over what your clan parties do.

 

[ShakenSpeare]

or did you not read what I wrote?

C'mon, be easy on him, reading is too complex. This game would be FAR too complicated if we let the players decide what to do. It's TW's way or the highway, as it should be by their divine judgment.

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

C'mon, be easy on him, reading is too complex. This game would be FAR too complicated if we let the players decide what to do. It's TW's way or the highway, as it should be by their divine judgment.

His point is accurate and relates to what is being discussed - unlike the points of others. (At least I certainly didn't discuss "too complex". Indeed, the topic is discussing additional options for players - on top of the additional options that were introduced already (wage slider, etc.).

It would also be great if you could refrain from flame-baiting users. At best you are discouraging developers from engaging.

 

[Lord Grindelvald]

At best you are discouraging developers from engaging.

I’ve seen this line come up a few times in the last couple of days, its very true, but is it something that is/was adressed within the team? Is it spoken of and would the devs engage or want to engage more if we werent as hostile? Not relevant, just curious, if you dont want to answer that is ofcourse fine since its way off topic.