Wars too scripted

Currently viewing this thread:

Apocal

Master Knight
If wars were scripted they would probably make more sense than they do currently...

Sturgia: "FOREVER HELLWAR FOR OV!"
Also Sturgia: "Hmm, Khuzaits took over Tyal and Sibir, but only left 200 men for a garrison? Guess it's a good time to peace-out and pay tribute to them, lol."
 

Apocal

Master Knight
For what it's worth, I do think that Sturgia focusing on Ov Castle is wise, all things considered. But if they are willing to hellwar for Ov Castle and lose thousands of troops in the process, they should be willing to expend equal effort on holding Tyal and Sibir.
 
So after many campaigns during my 1.4k hours playing this game ive now came to the conclusion that the wars are for the most part scripted.
As i went back to playing as Sturgians right now ive noticed as always that both Battania and Vladians (now with an short war with Khuzaits after some patching) are going in to war with you as they massacre your western side straight from the start. It didnt take them many days to take over those cities.
Its np for me having this kind of action if the ai now should have choosen that way. The only thing that is not alright is that the game feels so scripted and almost same stuff happen all the time. No matter which country youre with usually the same wars breaks out along with some small diversities here and there. Please correct me if i might have seen this wrong but most of my play thrus which is a lot from all sides usually looks the same. I wanted to be sure before i went out with this statement since ive seen some small diversities here and there but still it usually looks the same depending on which faction you join since the pressure is on towards that one instead. -But i could also remember some things wrong to, so i put some reservation for gaps in my memory bank :wink:-

JJiyWBr.png
BL Kingdoms should require a casus belli to go to war against another kingdom or face a significant relationship drop from other kingdoms.
Could be a lord raiding some village, someone insulting someone, kidnapping a daughter etc. The unending baseless wars based on just how weak your opponent is is just absurd. Cardia should have rules. This area needs to be deeper, not as deep as CK3 obviously, but much more reasoned than what we have now.
 
This is not about single player campaign at all but the game to its core without it. Or did i get you wrong ? :smile: Oh yeah would be cool if such feature would come to play. Like in warband when someone wants you to provoke another faction under the kings nose due to that mission
Yeah but even that mission is essentially a script that launches a war once mission is complete. My suggestion is more of a mix of what we have now with the lord voting and certain conditions, AND a genuine reason to go to war. And it can't be 'i want more lands/castles', but something deeper, like an aserai lord stealing a vlandian lords daughter kind of thing. I honestly expect TW to have this under upcoming features.
 

Blood Gryphon

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBVC
Heres another good example...I just started a new game. Joined the South Empire as an merc then exact as i connected they go in to an long lasting war against Aserai and Khuzaits along with north Empire to start with. Was exact this way last time to. So as someone said before. When you connect to an sertain faction an scripted war sets in as sort of angry zerg rush which usually leads to years of peace if they survive long enough
yLUSOG5.jpg
Be honest Dr. Shinobi, you just like to watch kingdoms burn from the inside out. It's almost like you have some kind of curse that turns everyone in your kingdom into indecisive fools. *Cough 50% less AI decisions when merc/vassal/king in a kingdom *Cough 🤔 .

On topic, hopefully if alliances ever become a thing it could lead to factions who originally hate each other working together and building good relations to the point they aren't public enemy #1.

Also there have been a bunch of discussions about different world states to start the game, like a 3 way war between the empire at the beginning would be pretty cool considering they are in a civil war.
 

Dabos37

Sergeant Knight
I do not think that battles are scripted at all but I do agree that some things always happen. I am playing with the +20% bonus for cav in simulated battles disabled (with a mod) and even though, Khuzaits are always destroying NE and part of Sturgia.

We va Battania is not always the same though, sometimes Battania is able to destroy WE pretty handy while sometimes WE is able to resist and even slowly win the war vs Batannia. Sturgia is decent in most of my campaigns now, while Vlandia is not OP anymore and they lose territory against WE and Battania.

Aserai is always ok, not great OP while not weak at all. SE is usually pretty strong except if they fight the OP Khuzaits. Concerning Khuzaits there are some things that I cannot understand...

- Why most of Khuzait units have more than 100 HP?
- Why Khuzaits get so strong after day 200-250? They are ok in the beginning but after some point, they become unstoppable for some reason.
- Why Khuzaits have more clans than NE?

It is not my intention to turn this thread into another nerf Khuzaits but they are so disgusting in every campaign. I am tired to have to fight them every campaign to avoid they going over all the map. Hopefully Mexxico find a way to nerf them soon.

Talking again about the scripted campaign, I think not, the campaign is not scripted at all but imbalanced.
 

Dabos37

Sergeant Knight
Heres another good example...I just started a new game. Joined the South Empire as an merc then exact as i connected they go in to an long lasting war against Aserai and Khuzaits along with north Empire to start with. Was exact this way last time to. So as someone said before. When you connect to an sertain faction an scripted war sets in as sort of angry zerg rush which usually leads to years of peace if they survive long enough
yLUSOG5.jpg

Oh yes, concerning this there is currently an “issue” which will get fixed in 1.5.6. When you join as mercenary, peace triggers with less frequency and for this reason the faction you serve as mercenary gets wrecked sometimes.

I am not playing as mercenary currently until this gets fixed. I just declare wars against Khuzaits by myself and use guerrilla tactics against them since the first couple of days.
 

Dabos37

Sergeant Knight
As far I know, Devs do not want to script anything against the player. The mercenary thing is just a not desired behavior which makes the player to influde in kingdoms decision to trigger less often. This is not desired and changed in version 1.5.6.

I am currently playing as king of my own new faction, I just have one settlements and anyone is declaring war on me for the moment.
 

Xaerdys

Regular
So youre saying its not scripted and that it is...got it. Makes perfectly sense

To be fair, you are the one required to prove your assumtion and what you offer is rather weak circumstantial evidence. Yet, if it is as Askorti says, it doesn't matter if it is scripted or not, because if there is no random variable in the checks, it will turn out just as if it was scripted.
 
There is no evidence of scripted wars. The fact that in the beginning the same wars start is the result of the decision-making algorith being fed the same data every time (every campaign starts more or less the same) and coming up with the same outcome. Which makes perfect logical sense.
Lol, you literally just contradicted yourself so hard.
 

Blood Gryphon

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBVC
I do not think that battles are scripted at all but I do agree that some things always happen. I am playing with the +20% bonus for cav in simulated battles disabled (with a mod) and even though, Khuzaits are always destroying NE and part of Sturgia.

We va Battania is not always the same though, sometimes Battania is able to destroy WE pretty handy while sometimes WE is able to resist and even slowly win the war vs Batannia. Sturgia is decent in most of my campaigns now, while Vlandia is not OP anymore and they lose territory against WE and Battania.

Aserai is always ok, not great OP while not weak at all. SE is usually pretty strong except if they fight the OP Khuzaits. Concerning Khuzaits there are some things that I cannot understand...

- Why most of Khuzait units have more than 100 HP?
- Why Khuzaits get so strong after day 200-250? They are ok in the beginning but after some point, they become unstoppable for some reason.
- Why Khuzaits have more clans than NE?

It is not my intention to turn this thread into another nerf Khuzaits but they are so disgusting in every campaign. I am tired to have to fight them every campaign to avoid they going over all the map. Hopefully Mexxico find a way to nerf them soon.

Talking again about the scripted campaign, I think not, the campaign is not scripted at all but imbalanced.
If I remember correctly it was both the +20% cav bonus and the cultural speed bonus for Khuzait that causes the imbalance. So if you still have the speed bonus active they will still dominate (almost impossible to catch their parties/ they will always catch you).

I truly do wish they would balance the # of clans between kingdoms, honestly I'm pretty disappointed they just gave each of the factions a new clan and didn't use the opportunity to actually balance. In fact they even screwed NE over harder by giving everyone a Tier 4 clan while they got a Tier 3 clan :facepalm:
giphy.gif
 
Last edited:

Blood Gryphon

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBVC
Its mostly due to their Auto calc bonus that cav gives still an major bonus to like here now with the Batts with more cavs in their roster. Even if Khuz refill and support speed along with chasing targets does help to


They said they are working on it but letting the battanians have it to now when they havnt fixed it is fubar....
Mexxico tested the game with both bonuses gone and its the most stable 10 year map I've ever seen. The khuzait cultural speed bonus is definitely a big factor as well.

As suggestion of @MostBlunted I made another test with removing Khuzait's speed bonus and 20% strength bonus for mounted units at autocalculation and here is map situation after 9 years :

nP1QU.png


This shows remaining snowballing is caused because of these 2 bonuses. There remained nearly no snowballing after removing these 2 bonuses at 1.5.1 + hotfix adjustments. There is nothing I can do for these 2 bonuses. I will report this however as long as they stay at game its very hard to stop Khuzaits in long gameplays. In any case even in 10 years they can get 30% of map, better than older versions. Anyway this was final test from me for these issues. I think we collected all information and fixed problems mostly. To improve game we need to add rebellion feature and adjust faction bonuses.
 
tenor.gif


BTW, I was the one who said try to remove the Khuzait bonus, guess what, still there even if Mexxico agreed :smile: .

Wouldn´t be that hard to replace it with another bonus, Khuzait already profits more than any other faction from the cav bonus in auto calc, but who cares :grin: .
 
Last edited:

Blood Gryphon

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBVC
tenor.gif


BTW, I was the one who said try to remove the Khuzait bonus, guess what, still there even if Mexxico agreed :smile: .

Wouldn´t be that hard to replace it with another bonus, Khuzait already profits more than any other faction from the cav bonus in auto calc, but who cares :grin: .
giphy.gif


giphy.gif



Who knows maybe Armagan has a sneaky solution up his sleeve.... otherwise we ****ed
 

Cybersbe

Recruit
As far as I can tell, the only "Scripted" wars are the ones that occur at the very start of the game, due to some kind of issue with the game generation decision process.

But beyond that, there is nothing scripted, and things can get unpredictable once factions start declaring peace. There is an internal logic system to determine how wars are declared, but ultimately no guarantees.
 
That's why if i'm not making my own kingdom i join the empire that gets defeated by the khuzaits so it adds some spice to the experience. After finishing the game with my kingdom for the first time i think i'm gonna start a modded vlandia playtroug to see how they roll. Always astonished by the fact that they have 7 or 8 cities from the beginning.
Vlandia is fairly strong.
 
Top Bottom