Vlandia nerfs necessary.

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LDominating

Regular
Nerf this faction,remove 1 to 3 clans from them,lower all Clan tiers across the board by 1 to 2.
And remove 2-3K prosperity from towns aswell as half what castles they got.
It's not fun having to deal with your 100 parties raiding settlements over and over,play your game for once and see for yourself because they get no drawbacks.

Remove the cavalry bonus speed and 20% bonus from A.I ,why is it here after 2 years of complaints is unbelivable.
A.I doesnt need horses to upgrade,the upgrade cost is halved for cavalry so they just spam and auto resolve for BS results.

Up the influence cost penalty to 35% to 50% for armies.
Actually fix it because it's lowering instead of increasing...they have no drawbacks as of right now in culture,some developer here we got...
Move crossbowmen 1 tier up so they can't get stacks of it with ease,lower a lot of armour,head especially from T2 and T3 of their armies and remove maces and axes from them.

I just don't want to play AGAINST THEM ANYMORE,they make 4 ****ing factions absiolutely undersirable,DO SOMETHING about them already.
2 years and I still complain about this **** faction you decided to introduce.
 

five bucks

Knight at Arms
Vlandia is overtuned, but you propose too many nerfs IMO. You would make them worse than Sturgia (as difficult as that is).
 

Blood Gryphon

Grandmaster Knight
WBVC
Yeah im with @five bucks on this one. I do think Vlandia could be balanced further with the removal of a clan or two, but these other suggestions go to far. I just took a look at 1.8.0 and this is how factions are starting out.

KingdomClansAdult MembersStarter kidsTierMax PartiesReinforcementsClans w/ 3+ Reinforcements
Aserai
9​
45​
24​
32​
27​
18​
4​
Battania
8​
37​
21​
28​
24​
13​
2​
Khuzait
9​
43​
24​
31​
27​
16​
2​
Northern
8​
49​
27​
30​
27​
22​
3​
Southern
9​
42​
24​
31​
27​
15​
2​
Western
9​
39​
22​
31​
27​
12​
2​
Sturgia
9​
48​
26​
32​
27​
21​
5​
Vlandia
11​
52​
28​
37​
33​
19​
4​
Total
72​
355​
196​
252​
219​
136​
24​

As you can see in the table above Vlandia starts out with 2 extra clans and can field a maximum of 33 parties at once compared to the average of 27. Each clan can field 3 max parties so those 2 extra clans make a massive difference. This might be okay if vlandia's member count was low and their reinforcements (adults past 3 members) was the lowest instead of 3rd highest. When you compare this to their neighbors Battannia and Western Empire it is no wonder they get decimated in the majority of games.

Off topic @Duh_TaleWorlds , but glad to see starter kids has been massively increased. For those wondering the last time i looked at this in 1.5.4 there were only 34 starter kids total and I had major concerns about the population of the world once AI vs AI death was introduced. I had suggested at least 100 more kids back then, but as you can see they got us up to ~200 so population is unlikely to die out at the current death rate. (y)
 
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LDominating

Regular
Yeah im with @five bucks on this one. I do think Vlandia could be balanced further with the removal of a clan or two, but these other suggestions go to far. I just took a look at 1.8.0 and this is how factions are starting out.

KingdomClansAdult MembersStarter kidsTierMax PartiesReinforcementsClans w/ 3+ Reinforcements
Aserai
9​
45​
24​
32​
27​
18​
4​
Battania
8​
37​
21​
28​
24​
13​
2​
Khuzait
9​
43​
24​
31​
27​
16​
2​
Northern
8​
49​
27​
30​
27​
22​
3​
Southern
9​
42​
24​
31​
27​
15​
2​
Western
9​
39​
22​
31​
27​
12​
2​
Sturgia
9​
48​
26​
32​
27​
21​
5​
Vlandia
11​
52​
28​
37​
33​
19​
4​
Total
72​
355​
196​
252​
219​
136​
24​

As you can see in the table above Vlandia starts out with 2 extra clans and can field a maximum of 33 parties at once compared to the average of 27. Each clan can field 3 max parties so those 2 extra clans make a massive difference. This might be okay if vlandia's member count was low and their reinforcements (adults past 3 members) was the lowest instead of 3rd highest. When you compare this to their neighbors Battannia and Western Empire it is no wonder they get decimated in the majority of games.

Off topic @Duh_TaleWorlds , but glad to see starter kids has been massively increased. For those wondering the last time i looked at this in 1.5.4 there were only 34 starter kids total and I had major concerns about the population of the world once AI vs AI death was introduced. I had suggested at least 100 more kids back then, but as you can see they got us up to ~200 so population is unlikely to die out at the current death rate. (y)
Yea,I lost my composure after I beat an army of 1200,chased 600 men off my village and had to beat another 1200 army sieging my castle..
Yea they do need some tweaks related to campaign map.
The only thing I say it's really needed from my thread rant it's the Clan Tier lowered for some clans...

This should off set the higher nr of parties
 

Wheem

Grandmaster Knight
WF&SVCWB
When it comes to on-the-battlefield performance, Vlandia needs buffs, not nerfs. Melee cavalry is still extremely bad overall, and in basically every 1.8 game I've started, Sturgia has 100% wrecked Vlandia in the initial war. They haven't taken any territory beyond Caleus Castle, but my god do they *destroy* Vlandia's armies. I'm not sure if the Sturgians are starting with more T5 units than the Vlandians do or what, but the open field battles aren't even remotely a challenge for them.

I've tried joining Vlandia to turn the tide, but it feels pretty hopeless in the early game. The Vlandian cavalry can't really do anything worthwhile, and once the infantry lines clash it's just an endless sea of red and absolutely horrendous kill:death ratio for our side. Sturgia still has issues defending 2-3 fronts when fighting multiple different wars, but that's true for most factions (though perhaps a bit worse for them). But at least Sturgia is strong when actually fighting the battles - Vlandia is actually quite bad.
 

LDominating

Regular
When it comes to on-the-battlefield performance, Vlandia needs buffs, not nerfs. Melee cavalry is still extremely bad overall, and in basically every 1.8 game I've started, Sturgia has 100% wrecked Vlandia in the initial war. They haven't taken any territory beyond Caleus Castle, but my god do they *destroy* Vlandia's armies. I'm not sure if the Sturgians are starting with more T5 units than the Vlandians do or what, but the open field battles aren't even remotely a challenge for them.

I've tried joining Vlandia to turn the tide, but it feels pretty hopeless in the early game. The Vlandian cavalry can't really do anything worthwhile, and once the infantry lines clash it's just an endless sea of red and absolutely horrendous kill:death ratio for our side. Sturgia still has issues defending 2-3 fronts when fighting multiple different wars, but that's true for most factions (though perhaps a bit worse for them). But at least Sturgia is strong when actually fighting the battles - Vlandia is actually quite bad.
I experience the same thing.
Sturgia is even giving me a hard time in manual battles when I'm Battania.
W Empire have lords that spam Menavliatons and you realise too late that they are destroying your infantry.
The 3rd one that's impressive as **** are the Aserai.
When I see an army of 600 with 200 cavalry(not HA) I instantly know there will be high casualties on my side.
Throwing Cavalry are insanely good right now.
 

Foefaller

Recruit
When it comes to on-the-battlefield performance, Vlandia needs buffs, not nerfs. Melee cavalry is still extremely bad overall, and in basically every 1.8 game I've started, Sturgia has 100% wrecked Vlandia in the initial war. They haven't taken any territory beyond Caleus Castle, but my god do they *destroy* Vlandia's armies. I'm not sure if the Sturgians are starting with more T5 units than the Vlandians do or what, but the open field battles aren't even remotely a challenge for them.

I've tried joining Vlandia to turn the tide, but it feels pretty hopeless in the early game. The Vlandian cavalry can't really do anything worthwhile, and once the infantry lines clash it's just an endless sea of red and absolutely horrendous kill:death ratio for our side. Sturgia still has issues defending 2-3 fronts when fighting multiple different wars, but that's true for most factions (though perhaps a bit worse for them). But at least Sturgia is strong when actually fighting the battles - Vlandia is actually quite bad.
I feel like it's partly thanks to the AI actually being too good at defending against cavalry. As soon as they so much as see a horse they'll pack in tight with a Shieldwall or Circle formation that protects the archers and entraps anyone foolish enough to think they can charge through without getting stuck by the mass of bodies or a spear causing their horse to rear up. It's usually a different story if the enemy is engaged in combat, but like you and LDominating said, Vlandian infantry will start loosing badly if the matchup is poor, taking massive casualties long before the lancers can make a meaningful dent in the enemy numbers.
 

five bucks

Knight at Arms
I feel like it's partly thanks to the AI actually being too good at defending against cavalry. As soon as they so much as see a horse they'll pack in tight with a Shieldwall or Circle formation that protects the archers and entraps anyone foolish enough to think they can charge through without getting stuck by the mass of bodies or a spear causing their horse to rear up. It's usually a different story if the enemy is engaged in combat, but like you and LDominating said, Vlandian infantry will start loosing badly if the matchup is poor, taking massive casualties long before the lancers can make a meaningful dent in the enemy numbers.
The real problem here is that cavalry forget to couch their lances most of the time (they need to be travelling downhill to do it), and if they don't couch their lance and try and stab instead, they will miss the stab 70% of the time, especially if their target is even slightly moving in any direction.

Follow a pack of Banner Knights sometime and watch as they hardly ever couch and half their stab attacks are released way too early/late, making them swing wildly at the air three meters away from where their target actually was.

If TW fixed this inaccuracy, melee cavalry would be worth a damn.
 

Foefaller

Recruit
The real problem here is that cavalry forget to couch their lances most of the time (they need to be travelling downhill to do it), and if they don't couch their lance and try and stab instead, they will miss the stab 70% of the time, especially if their target is even slightly moving in any direction.

Follow a pack of Banner Knights sometime and watch as they hardly ever couch and half their stab attacks are released way too early/late, making them swing wildly at the air three meters away from where their target actually was.

If TW fixed this inaccuracy, melee cavalry would be worth a damn.
Yeah, after playing today I had the chance after getting knocked out early to watch cavalry try to do their thing, emphasis on "try."

It was like they had crippling choice anxiety; if there was more than one on foot target within range, they'd start jittering between targets and either stab at some empty space near them at the last moment or fail to try and stab altogether.
 

five bucks

Knight at Arms
Yeah, after playing today I had the chance after getting knocked out early to watch cavalry try to do their thing, emphasis on "try."

It was like they had crippling choice anxiety; if there was more than one on foot target within range, they'd start jittering between targets and either stab at some empty space near them at the last moment or fail to try and stab altogether.
That could be the root cause behind it, like how the AI bounced between targets on the world map or between ladders in sieges.

But sometimes they can be running right at a single player who is also running forwards, and miss. Idk, it's weird.
 

Mayonaka

Recruit
out of the 8-9 vanilla playthrough i did (ver 1.7 and 1.:cool: strugia is always the first to go feel so sad for this fraction, the land is poor the troops are lackluster the ruler is a dimwit.. and no, dont think vlandia is OP as compared their top tier troops are not very strong AI can stand to be smarter though.. i ever kite a 1500 armies until they run out of cohension buying important time for my other armies to do their job.
 

mortache

Recruit
I believe "cavalry" and "mounted troops" should have the same movement speed. I got flak for saying that in this forum before but there is little reason why troops that travel on horses should have DOUBLE the speed bonus even when they have riding skills to mount those horses.
 

mortache

Recruit
The real problem here is that cavalry forget to couch their lances most of the time (they need to be travelling downhill to do it), and if they don't couch their lance and try and stab instead, they will miss the stab 70% of the time, especially if their target is even slightly moving in any direction.

Follow a pack of Banner Knights sometime and watch as they hardly ever couch and half their stab attacks are released way too early/late, making them swing wildly at the air three meters away from where their target actually was.

If TW fixed this inaccuracy, melee cavalry would be worth a damn.
They get in each other's way and block each other's movement. This is why the Khan's Guard is the best "Cavalry" in the game, since glaives function perfectly even when they are standing motionless. Spear thrusts need massive buffs. Even speeding up the animation would be fine, assuming that speed translates into more stab damage.
 

CrazyElf

Sergeant
When it comes to on-the-battlefield performance, Vlandia needs buffs, not nerfs. Melee cavalry is still extremely bad overall, and in basically every 1.8 game I've started, Sturgia has 100% wrecked Vlandia in the initial war. They haven't taken any territory beyond Caleus Castle, but my god do they *destroy* Vlandia's armies. I'm not sure if the Sturgians are starting with more T5 units than the Vlandians do or what, but the open field battles aren't even remotely a challenge for them.

I've tried joining Vlandia to turn the tide, but it feels pretty hopeless in the early game. The Vlandian cavalry can't really do anything worthwhile, and once the infantry lines clash it's just an endless sea of red and absolutely horrendous kill:death ratio for our side. Sturgia still has issues defending 2-3 fronts when fighting multiple different wars, but that's true for most factions (though perhaps a bit worse for them). But at least Sturgia is strong when actually fighting the battles - Vlandia is actually quite bad.

Yeah I agree with this.

I don't think that Vlandia needs to be nerfed for that reason. Maybe some better gear for the regular non-noble units as well.

Melee cavalry as a whole seems to be too weak in this game.
 

mortache

Recruit
Yeah I agree with this.

I don't think that Vlandia needs to be nerfed for that reason. Maybe some better gear for the regular non-noble units as well.

Melee cavalry as a whole seems to be too weak in this game.
At least in the current phase. It gets especially hilarious when spear cavalry tries fighting in tournaments. I think you can leave them for hours and not one would manage to hit a blow.
 
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