SP Viking Conquest Balance Mod 13

[Ryantheskinny]

Yes please, Lower Pannonia was Slavic populated(and ruled) land at the time period you specified.

Edit: Are you sure you don't want to make your own mod thread?

If I were to start my own thread would I put it in the pioneer guild, or would I put it in here since it a VC mod? The rules make me think the former. So I was going to start one after I release a base beta version .1 so I could have a dedicated thread in the VC mod section. But since there is some interest (which is awesome ) maybe I should, what do you suggest?

this is what we are looking at as far as possible factions at the date proposed by tingyun, which would be may 871.
I think this start date will be great and the current political situation is based on Ck2, a few maps of that time period and maps provided by tingyun. Im always open to suggestions and help from the community. 

Spoiler

Balaton should be called Principality of lower Pannonia according to stuff I've read, but I was thinking of moving the Magyars into hungary early also. Also not satisfied with lesser Poland, and the situation in Russia. francian kingdoms should also be three (treaty of meerssen).

There were two Pannonian principalities, one was the lower Pannonian ruled by Kocel, the other was Croatian and in 871 ruled by an unknown  duke. Lower Pannonian principality and Balaton principality are interchangeable but personally I would go for "Balaton" to differentiate from the Croatian one. Perhaps you could have Magyar Horsemen as mercenaries in Pannonia or maybe raiding Magyar parties and keep Hungarians in their current place on the map?

Oh so Croatia and Balaton could both be called pannonia, that's interesting, sent you a PM but I'll say it hear that it's possible Balaton was partially under Moravian rule some time in this time frame. And the Magyar Idea is great, could also see how to do a scheduled Invasions happening around 600 days, would help to keep everyone one there toes, as a giant Magyar horseman invasion would be OP and historical so any player kingdoms in the region would get some challenge after the grind had slowed down.

As I asked BNSMarko in the above comment, What do you think time to start a dedicated thread?

Edit:sorry for the double post

 

[Marko͘]

I'd wait until maybe you get the whole world map done and functioning in the game, then you'd have some tangible progress to show for a new thread. Then, the thread can be used to gather interest and discuss.

 

[Ryantheskinny]

I'd wait until maybe you get the whole world map done and functioning in the game, then you'd have some tangible progress to show for a new thread. Then, the thread can be used to gather interest and discuss.

Okay, I am shooting for playable version with the original game area, with danelaw and Wessex by next weekend (cross your fingers). I have ran it for a go with the new map, but ran into some pathfinding difficulty and the port of ribe ended up being left in central Europe. The map needs some fine tuning as well, but luckily thats not hard, once I figure out how to best utilize mesh lab for refining the mesh (still learning the controls). I am definitely going to need some help though, bug squashing, meshes, textures and research.

Spoiler

Is it just me or the carolingian helmet on the guy on the right looks like a bicycle helmet.

 

[Dazzer]

The Balaton principality under Kocel was at this time probably a vassal of East Francia, my suggestion then would be to put both principalities (Balaton and Pannonian Croatia) under Frankish rule and make their historical rulers as vassals of East Francia and give them their fiefs which they controled in reality, its been similarily done this way in vanilla VC with Aethelred and Alfred of Wessex as "co-rulers" although Alfred was just a normal vassal (for example Kocel would be given the fief of Blatnohrad and perhaps some nearby village, he would recruit Slavic units from his fiefs and they would all follow Christianity as he did in reality). Another reason to do this might be that we know of practically no nobles from this time which would be vassals of Kocel or the other Croatian duke, so putting them under Francia would make them somewhat stronger and you wont get small empty factions with no meaning.

Actually it fell under Moravian rule until about 10 years later so I think keeping it the way I proposed would make more sense. Now that you mentioned it, at this time a duchy of Bohemia was created ruled by Borivoj, although it seems it still was a part of Moravia and both Moravian and Bohemian rulers were good allies, so again I would put Borivoj as vassal of Svatopluk and give him Prague and nearby villages as a fief and give him the title Duke to reflect his position.

I also think you should wait some time until you get enough progress to show to the community

 

[Ryantheskinny]

overlayed some changes to show Treaty of Meerssen boundries and the lordship of East Francia over Pannonia. according to Wikipedia (not the best source) frisia and most of the coast there even though on paper was under the rule of the Carolingians was actually controlled by the Danes.

Spoiler

 

[Tingyun]

Looks great Ryan, very exciting!

You are welcome to use this thread as long as you like, but I agree that once you've got something for players to download and play, you should start your own thread, both to generate lots of discussion, as well as to preserve a record of the progress and changes of the mod in one convenient place.

The process is, if I remember correctly, to start a thread in Pioner guild, then message a mod over there to have the thread transfered to here, which they will do if you have a playable version released.

But again, feel free to use this thread as long as you like. Balance Mod development will be finished once I release the final update later this week, so there likely won't be much other activity here after that anyway. Glad you are carrying on with such an exciting mod project.

 

[Ryantheskinny]

Thanks again Tingyun.

And thanks for your balance mod, it has made VC a very enjoyable experience.

As for my end, not far away from my goal of at least releasing a early beta version. Going to try and have the British isles, maybe west frankia and the tribal settlement feature in for the first go. Probably after Christmas if all goes well but I'm going to try for earlier, I'll be out from the 15th of Nov. thru til the 25th of December. Here goes for version .1!

 

[kalarhan]

As for my end, not far away from my goal of at least releasing a early beta version.

if you gonna release betas and the map bit by bit I have a suggestion: dont make them savegame compatible. It is a tough limitation on the modder, it requires a lot of workarounds as you add more stuff and makes your code less clear over time. Create a schedule for breaking saves, a cheat code to create higher level characters (for testing). It will save you a lot of headaches.

Also delete (instead of commenting it out) all the code you wont use (like story-mode related stuff). Easier to work as the files are already huge. If you would delete all the MP, quests, etc, you could delete a lot of lines (just make sure you dont delete the hardcoded engine ID stuff)

 

[Ryantheskinny]

Thanks for the advice kalarhan.

Main reason I edited it out was to make sure I didn't break anything, as I have it all listed in a change log as well for reference.

 

[Dazzer]

Just checked the map again, Mercia seems to be missing, their king Burgred was fighting off the Vikings until 874

 

[Ryantheskinny]

Just checked the map again, Mercia seems to be missing, their king Burgred was fighting off the Vikings until 874

Hey thanks, yeah I was just looking into Wessex last night, and noticed that they were still separate in 871. It might be a challenging situation though stuck between Wessex and the Danelaw. Also another oddity I noticed on one map was the that the northern half of northumbria was under Saxon rule but I couldn't find a definite date to go with that.

 

[Tingyun]

I think Mercia/Wessex is a tough call, and there’s good reason for either choice. While Mercia still retained most of its independence, it was closely tied to Wessex, especially in opposition to the invading Norse. Warband AI really doesn’t handle close alliances well, with bad diplomacy and non existent military coordination. Rolling some close alliances together into single factions, and representing the absorbed junior partner with a town lord that retains a title of equal rank to king, might make sense in a lot of situations.

 

[Dazzer]

Maybe you could try allying Mercia with Wessex (posted this right after Tingyun )? Strathclyde appears to be the Britonic kindom of the Alt Clut and I think its correct for 871, unless you mean something else?

 

[Ryantheskinny]

I think Mercia/Wessex is a tough call, and there’s good reason for either choice. While Mercia still retained most of its independence, it was closely tied to Wessex, especially in opposition to the invading Norse. Warband AI really doesn’t handle close alliances well, with bad diplomacy and non existent military coordination. Rolling some close alliances together into single factions, and representing the absorbed junior partner with a town lord that retains a title of equal rank to king, might make sense in a lot of situations.

Yeah I almost think the best option is making them a vassal now instead of having the Danes massacre them and then wessex, it's unfortunate but makes better sense.

Maybe you could try allying Mercia with Wessex (posted this right after Tingyun )? Strathclyde appears to be the Britonic kindom of the Alt Clut and I think its correct for 871, unless you mean something else?

Yes it's supposed to be Alt Clut. It's called Strathclyde on alot of the maps and also CK2 uses that name. More than likely it will retain the name currently assigned to it in game.

 

[Ryantheskinny]

If I can make an independent Mercia work as a allied power, then I might as well do the same for the northern half of northumbria, which was a client state that operated independently of the Danelaw. Would be cool but I won't expend to much time on that. I might just leave Mercia in for historical purposes.

 

[Dhamon]

this is what we are looking at as far as possible factions at the date proposed by tingyun, which would be may 871.
I think this start date will be great and the current political situation is based on Ck2, a few maps of that time period and maps provided by tingyun. Im always open to suggestions and help from the community. 

Spoiler

Balaton should be called Principality of lower Pannonia according to stuff I've read, but I was thinking of moving the Magyars into hungary early also. Also not satisfied with lesser Poland, and the situation in Russia. francian kingdoms should also be three (treaty of meerssen).

If the time is set to 871, there are a few anachronisms in italy:

- Italy as we know it did not exist until 1861. In 871 there was the Regnum Italicum, successor to the Kingdoms of the Lombards, which extended only in northern italy.  In 871 was reigned by Charles the Bald, along with Provence.  It got annexed to the Holy Roman Empire in 1014. https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Carolingian_empire_870.svg

- In central Italy there should be the Papal states, founded in 756. It should include  part of the central italy. https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Karte_kirchenstaat.jpg. see also previous map

- Southern Italy is a bit of a mess. It was previously under the Kingdom of Lombards, and after its end in 774, it remained mostly independent or under Bizantine rule, with incursions from Saracens. The Principality of Benevento remained independent, a part of which became the independent Principality of Salerno in 851. On the other hand, the Thema of Calabria was under bizantine rule. By 871, however, the cities of Bari and Taranto were under the Saracens.

- As in your map, at the time Sicily was under Andalus  rule

 

[Ryantheskinny]

Thanks Dhamon

The situation in southern Italy has me stumped on a good solution and I had thought about just adding them to carolingian Italy. 

 

[kalarhan]

Thanks Dhamon

The situation in southern Italy has me stumped on a good solution and I had thought about just adding them to carolingian Italy.

check out this OSP if you want to add a in-game world map http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,328367.0.html

this one has a example of the companion matrix as well http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,328368.0.html

you can follow the links in the description to find the original threads and how to add them to your game

 

[Ryantheskinny]

Spoiler

BETA for VC Balance Mod 10.0 posted under "main downloads" at the nexus page. Module files also posted for modders like Ryantheskinny.

Please test if you can. Provided no bugs are found, I'll make it an official (and final) release in a week or so. But I really need some help playtesting if at all possible.


IMPORTANT NOTE: 9.0 added the option to manage all settlements, to allow the player to build religious buildings or assist his lords. This is intended behavior.

CHANGELOG 10.0:

Updated with changes from latest Viking Conquest release, 2.044

Some tweaks to religion

Fixed vanilla VC bug where AI kings courted ladies (includes code to make AI kings break up for current saves)

Saxon troop recruiting rosters made a bit more elite, to show their relative ascendancy in comparison to mercia and east anglia, and give a greater chance of them being the last kingdom to stand against (and defeat) the invading norse).

Druid sacrifice tweaked

Made prison break success independent of whether the lord is conscious or unconscious (just put him on a horse or something, no need to abandon him even after all guards are dead, eliminate the video game escort quest annoyance)

To balance with the above, and encourage more interesting larger fights, village elders now require a good deal more money in bribes to take on the risk of involving themselves in your plots to set fires

Made prisoner escape check happen free of a couple of conditions (in particular, it will run periodically even during day)

armor performs a little better against blunt damage

A general balancing pass on all tier 2 and above slingers, increasing many of their WP. Also slight increases to peasant sling WP of cultures that heavily use the sling

Sling rocks given less ammo (decided their stats reflect better shaped rocks, and wouldn't be so easily obtainable in battlefield conditions

Some slight increases to WP norse axe warrior

Removed range guranteed tag from briton champions (wasn't on any other infantry),

altered lord random personality distribution to shift a bit more away from the worst 2 personalities

interupt damage threshold moved to warband levels (meshes better with the improved mail armor)

Changed some values in AI courtship

Right to rule increases slowed in a couple of places

further +2 damage increase to 1.5 handed axes, and additional +2 for non-irish basic 1.5 handed (closing the gap a bit). Dane axe -2 damage, +5 speed. Axes made swing only (thrusting being epecially poor choice for them). 1 handed battle axes given +1 damage. A couple Pict/irish 1 handed axes given -1 damage. A couple other axes slightly tweaked to create more logical progression of length/speed/damage and balance of factions.

1 handed axe speed reduced

spears made a bit more breakable

plain length 30 seaxes/knives made stab-only when on foot (should help seax armed troops quite a bit, as their cut damage is terrible)

Fixed vanilla VC bug in Thora persuasion check

CREDITS:

Taleworlds user Ryantheskinny for his conversions of Troops and Parties files. Everyone should follow the progress of his mod in development, where he is expanding the VC map to cover Europe, among other exciting changes.

Taleworlds user Eternalflame for druid sacrifice change

Reddit user ObeseMcDese for discussions leading to the more elite Saxon recruiting templates (when compared to Angles)

Steam users 杰克·赫兹, Disturbed, and Pode, and Nexus user adslhzc543, for discussions on fix for Thora dialogue

Taleworlds user Toster and everyone who participated in discussions at Taleworlds regarding marriage and courtship

Thanks Tingyun.

Spoiler

Thanks Dhamon

The situation in southern Italy has me stumped on a good solution and I had thought about just adding them to carolingian Italy.

check out this OSP if you want to add a in-game world map http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,328367.0.html

this one has a example of the companion matrix as well http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,328368.0.html

you can follow the links in the description to find the original threads and how to add them to your game

The in game world map would be a cool addition. I also added a bunch of new companions, is it possible /easy to convert the companion matrix into a list format vs. the current tiled format?

Also the vanilla code for the companion chart is based on yours isn't it?

 

[kalarhan]

I also added a bunch of new companions, is it possible /easy to convert the companion matrix into a list format vs. the current tiled format?

Also the vanilla code for the companion chart is based on yours isn't it?

the matrix is used to showcase relationship between companions, in case you have that on your mod (who likes who). It is a list. As it is a presentation, you can do whatever you want with the format (how to display stuff).

Spoiler

Companion screen was indeed added to VC with RE.