[VC RE BETA] Weapon and Units Balance

[CeltiberoCaesar]

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Soldier's wife upgrades directly to Camp Defender who's 5 levels lower, and has worse stats except for the ability to wield a bow, but still I don't really think it's worth to spend those 400 pennings on that...

It would be cool if you could change that to some kind of "Shieldmaiden" unit, but that's totally up to you. It would be amazing though.


Also, one instance when I talked to Peasant Women in my party, it gave me the option to pay them 450 pennings and get a pretty decent morale boost. I've never gotten that option again. Are there specific circumstances for it to be available?

Thank you DzsuDzaK. We will check it

 

[DzsuDzaK]

Also, one instance when I talked to Peasant Women in my party, it gave me the option to pay them 450 pennings and get a pretty decent morale boost. I've never gotten that option again. Are there specific circumstances for it to be available?

Try again in ~3 days

Could only do it once in my 100 day game.

 

[JuJu70]

Also, one instance when I talked to Peasant Women in my party, it gave me the option to pay them 450 pennings and get a pretty decent morale boost. I've never gotten that option again. Are there specific circumstances for it to be available?

Try again in ~3 days

Could only do it once in my 100 day game.

you only can ask a 'Camp Woman' for that, so I'm not sure how you could ask a peasant woman. Check the troop names please.

 

[kalarhan]

Also, one instance when I talked to Peasant Women in my party, it gave me the option to pay them 450 pennings and get a pretty decent morale boost. I've never gotten that option again. Are there specific circumstances for it to be available?

Try again in ~3 days

Could only do it once in my 100 day game.

Fixed for the next patch, thank you for the report!

 

[anoddhermit]

I'd personally like to see the ability to block with a Langseax and Broadseax, especially since it's possible to block with wood-handled axes that are even shorter. While I can do a fairly decent job of riposting 1v1 in single player, not having the ability for a weapon to block basically excludes it from my load-out. I'm no expert on historical seaxes (is that even the proper plural form? ), but weren't some of the larger ones fairly close to being what a lot of people would term "short swords," and don't the Langseax and Broadseax represent those types?

Speaking of short swords...all but one of the "Short Swords" used by the Norse Noble (Hersir) have a length of 91, which is longer than all other generic swords, with exception to some Rich/Standard Briton Swords, and the Goidelic Long Swords.

The Angle Bodyguard (Gedriht) also seems to use clearly inferior swords compared to other faction troops of the same path/tier (including the Saxon version of the same soldier). Angles receive a generic "Sword" that's 23c/swing and 18p/thrust, while the lowest end sword for the Saxon Bodyguard (Gedriht) is a False Ulfberth at 27c/swing and 19p/thrust. The Briton and Norse swords also appear to be clearly superior to what the Angles get, while the Irish and Picts aren't a total apples-to-apples comparison to everyone else (their swords are longer, slower, and have high swing/low thrust damage...and on that note, should the Irish get a chance at the same [very slightly better] "Noble" version of the Picts? Or maybe that should be the "cavalry sword" if horsemen are given swords again?)

I agree a lot of the weapons various troops use are a bit off/confusing, to the point I'd opt not to upgrade some because it replaces their weapon with a worse one.

As for the Langseax, I'm currently using one and it seems like w/o the blocking limitation it'd be just superior to most other weapons around its cost/availability. It does more damage than most axes, it's faster, and it has more reach. And if you're using a shield, which I am in my SP game, the blocking limitation isn't a big deal.

I'm not really against the block limitation being removed though. Really I just want axes buffed.

An axe's bonus vs. shields is pretty negligible. I almost never break a shield before I kill an enemy. The only real advantage of axes for NPCs as it lets groups of them to take out my PC easier if I get too mobbed, hah. As the PC they offer nothing a sword or seax can't beat. I really wish they'd have some benefit vs. armor, or at least a damage increase to make up for their speed/reach disadvantage a bit. 

 

[zelxi]

I like the high spear animation, looks cool when standing behind a shield wall. However, it may need some tweaking, it's quite difficult to hit an enemy.

 

[anoddhermit]

Something I've been noticing is armor imbalances.

For one, many of the full body armors that give bonus to 2 or all 3 of head / body / legs, still allow helm/feet items. This makes them very strong right now, not sure if it's intended. Some allow it, some don't.

Also, medium armors in general need a buff. They give skill penalties, but a dress or a robe can give nearly as much armor as them with no penalty. Some are also just flat better than others, with 5+ to body armor or more over other gambesons. The weight differences are marginal and have no effect on stats as far as I could tell, from swapping between different medium armors it made no difference if I was using one that weighed 4 vs. 5.

 

[Piédalf]

There is a problem with the "rich sword" you start with during royal sandbox: it doesn't have a scabbard and if you withdraw it there is a second sword on your side (like a scabbard).

 

[kalarhan]

There is a problem with the "rich sword" you start with during royal sandbox: it doesn't have a scabbard and if you withdraw it there is a second sword on your side (like a scabbard).

check the latest Steam Patch, this should be fixed 

Something I've been noticing is armor imbalances.

For one, many of the full body armors that give bonus to 2 or all 3 of head / body / legs, still allow helm/feet items. This makes them very strong right now, not sure if it's intended. Some allow it, some don't.

Also, medium armors in general need a buff. They give skill penalties, but a dress or a robe can give nearly as much armor as them with no penalty. Some are also just flat better than others, with 5+ to body armor or more over other gambesons. The weight differences are marginal and have no effect on stats as far as I could tell, from swapping between different medium armors it made no difference if I was using one that weighed 4 vs. 5.

If you have stamina ON you will notice the difference  . There are also some rare medium armors with higher than normal stats, they are rewards from quests or exploration.

 

[NamFlow]

Frankish Raiders have ridiculous number of prisoners (there are more of them with these numbers of prisoners like that)

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[Petro Buleka]

Frankish Raiders have ridiculous number of prisoners (there are more of them with these numbers of prisoners like that)

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in my opinion it is nothing compared with that:http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,319639.msg7948728.html#msg7948728

 

[Articulo34]

in my opinion it is nothing compared with that:http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,319639.msg7948728.html#msg7948728

So they like self-bondage. What´s wrong with that? It´s 2015, you gotta be more open minded.

Frankish Raiders have ridiculous number of prisoners (there are more of them with these numbers of prisoners like that)

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Tordiato´s screenshot, on the other hand, is utter bull****. There is no way 28 guys can carry enough alcohol to keep 431 sailors from mutiny.

 

[Utfred]

Frankish Raiders have ridiculous number of prisoners (there are more of them with these numbers of prisoners like that)

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in my opinion it is nothing compared with that:http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,319639.msg7948728.html#msg7948728

A frankish raiders party filled with vikingrs.... How could you insult Charlemagne's people like that 

 

[kraggrim]

A frankish raiders party filled with vikingrs.... How could you insult Charlemagne's people like that 

Isn't 'viking' just a word for 'raiding', so they're just generic raiders?

 

[kalarhan]

A frankish raiders party filled with vikingrs.... How could you insult Charlemagne's people like that 

Isn't 'viking' just a word for 'raiding', so they're just generic raiders?

http://www.hurstwic.org/history/articles/text/word_viking.htm

What does the word Viking mean? The word is clearly ancient, appearing in both noun and verb forms on rune stones (right) contemporaneous with the Viking age. Yet, its meaning has changed through the centuries. Even today, the word means different things to different people.

The runic inscriptions suggest that a viking was a man who left his homeland for adventure and profit abroad, with the implication that he planned to return home with his newly won fortune and fame. The word existed in both a noun form (víkingr, the person traveling for adventure) and a verb form (víking, to travel or participate in one of these adventures).

Even the origin of the word is debated. In the old Norse language, víkingr means a man from vík, where vík may have the sense of a bay, or the specific bay called Víkin in the south of Norway. Perhaps the name was applied because the first Viking raiders were from Víkin, or perhaps because the raiders waited in sheltered bays for their victims.

By the time the Sagas of Icelanders came to be written, after the end of the Viking age, the word víkingr still had the sense of a raider, or an adventurer, who traveled overseas looking for fame and fortune. Many saga-age Icelanders and saga heroes are said to have gone on Viking adventures, notably Egill Skalla-Grímsson and his brother Þórólfr (Egils saga chapter 49).

 

[kalarhan]

Now back on topic

Any other feedback on units, weapons and general combat balance?

You guys seem very happy if this thread is already going off-topic 

 

[Utfred]

Well you asked so....

Could you tune down the missile accuracy pleaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase ?

 

[kalarhan]

Well you asked so....

Could you tune down the missile accuracy pleaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase ?

it is already down  . Our tests show that npcs have a 10-15% headshot rate against each others (archers, slingers, etc).

If you are the one dying you will need to use a shield and your troops. Don't try going alone against a group of ranged troops or they will gang hit you (10 recruits throwing stones at you really hurts!)

If you are thinking of another scenario I will need more details

 

[Utfred]

I stopped ramboing the ennemy's skirms a long time ago (I learned... somehow). The only thing that is really bothering (like awfully bothering) is that the Ai never shy away from a close range-shot at someone who is fightin. Would you really be slingin at someone in melee and then explain to your best buddy's wife that she can become a happy widow ?... because of you ?

Almost any report of a battle from any time in history would give you the same account : missile stop firing when the melee troops closen up. Except of course if they jump on someone's flank or rear. Right now if an ennemy skirm stands behind he can still shoot from the tiniest, most ridiculous angle and it works ! If my shoulder, my left foot or the upper part of my forehead is in their eye-ball, I might as well start diggin me own grave.

 

[Articulo34]

That´s an AI behavior that has pestered M&B forever. Changing missile´s accuracy won´t fix it.