Vaegirs - what's their supposed historical counterpart, actually?

[Merlkir]

You're like a little kid clawing for attention. Don't be sad that your first post got no replies. But posting twice in a redundant thread - makes you redundant yourself.

You're a ****tard. Don't be sad that you have no idea what's going on. This **** is old, there are many threads about it already and still this idiotic "discussion" goes on. Every day some new dip**** comes here and has the brilliant idea: "I'll tell everyone what I just realized about the nations in Warband, WOW, I'm sure I'm the first one/ I'm right and they aren't.". It's boring and it's painful and it's annoying. Now die.

 

[Nahkuri]

Life is tough, Merlkir.

 

[E.M.Baguette]

Hi all

I searched, but this gets so many hits, it's impossible to find an answer. So, does anyone know what people or country the Vaegirs in game are supposed to represent?

I mean, with Swadians it's pretty easy, they seem your standard "Central European" knights (Teutonic/Frankish). The Nords are also clear. Khergits are Huns, and the Saranids are Sarazens/Arabs.

Rhodoks are a tad hard to sort, but people have suggested they might be modelled after "Greek" ideas (Spears, large Shields).

But I have zero clue what the inspiration for the Vaegirs is. They have some of the best knights in game, but the shape of the gear looks more related to Khergits than to European stuff of the time. Polish/Russian maybe?

Polish medieval armies were more like latin western armies, than Russian steppe troops, so it's not a good example.

Eastern europe.

Not all armies were the same in eastern Europe.


In my opinion Vaegir troops looks like Byzantine+East Slavs.

 

[Frankmuddy]

Kievan Rus. Ivan the Terrible and so forth.

*goes back to making terrible historically inpsired puns on Swabia.*

 

[cudakite]

You're a ****tard. Don't be sad that you have no idea what's going on. This **** is old, there are many threads about it already and still this idiotic "discussion" goes on. Every day some new dip**** comes here and has the brilliant idea: "I'll tell everyone what I just realized about the nations in Warband, WOW, I'm sure I'm the first one/ I'm right and they aren't.". It's boring and it's painful and it's annoying. Now die.

My goodness.  What a lovely hospitable community this seems to be...

 

[socks]

You realize that by this time crossbows had all but replaced bows in almost every Western continental nation?

And France was far from unique in its emphasis on heavy cavalry.

I'm not saying I am right  , I am just saying that I thought they were based off France. Alsace, (which is in modern day France), was part of Swabia right?
... OT post

That was not only incredibly off topic but a blatant show of nationalism, which I despise [that is, feeling proud - which implies it has something to do with you, which it doesn't - about what your ancestors did.]

The reason the crossbows and the French were owned there was because of their stupidity; the French, despite the Genoese protests, ordered the crossbows to attack while it was raining, while their pavises were still miles behind in the baggage train, and iirc firing into the setting sun. Not exactly the most ideal comparison between the conventional bow and the crossbow.

 

[ProjectAngel]

That was not only incredibly off topic but a blatant show of nationalism, which I despise [that is, feeling proud - which implies it has something to do with you, which it doesn't - about what your ancestors did.]

The reason the crossbows and the French were owned there was because of their stupidity; the French, despite the Genoese protests, ordered the crossbows to attack while it was raining, while their pavises were still miles behind in the baggage train, and iirc firing into the setting sun. Not exactly the most ideal comparison between the conventional bow and the crossbow.

Lol, you are definitely wrong in thinking that the crossbow was superior to the longbow... They are less accurate, have a slower rate of fire, are effected by the weather and are more expensive. The only way in which I can think they are any better is their power, (but not by much), and lack of training needed to use them.

Also there is nothing wrong in being proud of your country's history, but that is not the reason why I posted an account of the battle of Crecy. I posted it to show how the crossbow stood up against the longbow in battle, and it is clear which took the victory there. I can send you more stories from different battles if you would like through a PM and if you have any showing the crossbow coming out on top then please mail them to me because I would be genuinely interested in reading them, (but to be honest I don't think you really care and are just looking for an argument).

 

[Konrad von Richtmark]

Why would the factions need to have specific historical counterparts?

Historical inspiration, bring em on. Carbon copies where every detail about the faction is as in real history "just because", bleh.

 

[socks]

Lol, you are definitely wrong in thinking that the crossbow was superior to the longbow... They are less accurate, have a slower rate of fire, are effected by the weather and are more expensive. The only way in which I can think they are any better is their power, (but not by much), and lack of training needed to use them.

I never said that, or anything of the sort. In fact, I am quite infatuated with the longbow, although I do think that the crossbows were the better weapon, due to the two reasons you posted.

Also there is nothing wrong in being proud of your country's history, but that is not the reason why I posted an account of the battle of Crecy. I posted it to show how the crossbow stood up against the longbow in battle, and it is clear which took the victory there. I can send you more stories from different battles if you would like through a PM and if you have any showing the crossbow coming out on top then please mail them to me because I would be genuinely interested in reading them, (but to be honest I don't think you really care and are just looking for an argument).

1. as I said earlier, it was one of the worst examples of crossbows v. longbows.
2. how ... why? What? Again, it was incredibly off-topic. I mention that crossbows were commonplace throughout Europe and you write a large post about how longbows are better than crossbows. How is that related at all? I'm 'genuinely interested' as to why exactly you posted it, since it's really confusing me

EDIT: and, for the record, I'm mostly English in ancestry.

 

[ProjectAngel]

I went of topic mainly because I was stoned at the time.

Also when I read this,

You realize that by this time crossbows had all but replaced bows in almost every Western continental nation?

I thought you was trying to suggest the crossbow was superior.

If you can find some accounts of where the longbow went directly up against the crossbow then I would be interesting in reading them. The only ones I have read so far all end in the same way. 

Anyways, just a misunderstanding, no need for further "handbags at dawn" eh.

 

[Frankmuddy]

My goodness.  What a lovely hospitable community this seems to be...

BAH! I disagree with you! I hit you with an axe to express my displeasure! BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD!

 

[Helmut_AUT]

You're a ****tard. Don't be sad that you have no idea what's going on. This **** is old, there are many threads about it already and still this idiotic "discussion" goes on. Every day some new dip**** comes here and has the brilliant idea: "I'll tell everyone what I just realized about the nations in Warband, WOW, I'm sure I'm the first one/ I'm right and they aren't.". It's boring and it's painful and it's annoying. Now die.

Reported to moderator again. Who exactly forces you to read these topics?

 

[Nahkuri]

You're a ****tard. Don't be sad that you have no idea what's going on. This **** is old, there are many threads about it already and still this idiotic "discussion" goes on. Every day some new dip**** comes here and has the brilliant idea: "I'll tell everyone what I just realized about the nations in Warband, WOW, I'm sure I'm the first one/ I'm right and they aren't.". It's boring and it's painful and it's annoying. Now die.

My goodness.  What a lovely hospitable community this seems to be...

Now now. One cranky twat bursting in flames for an irrelevant reason like that doesn't exactly mean everyone likes to do so.

 

[AWdeV]

I vote that the thread with armagans' comment regarding the rhodoks be stickied and anyone bringing it ever up elsewhere again banned.

Well, the first part anyway.

Now, compared to some people around here, I'm fairly new. However, during my presence on these lovable forums I've seen dozens of different threads and discussion about the exact same topic; only twist here being is that the focus lies on the Vaegir instead of the more ambiguous Rhodoks, who, according to a MSN conversation Merlkir had quite some time ago (IIRC) with Armagan, big cheese of this game, are "some sort of highland people". They have influences from several sources so trying to pin them down as SWISS! No, nub, ITALIAN! GREEK! SCOTTISH! is inane and toroughly annoying, especially if it pops up for the gazillionth time.

Merlkir was a tad rude, but then again, he's seen this exact same thing probably hundreds of times and one goading wiseass certainly won't simplify matters, especially not if that wiseass runs off to the report button after every other post.

 

[Nahkuri]

He was being quite obnoxious. I can't recall any particular threads where this topic would've been brought to a conclusion, but if there's one, I'd given the link to it instead of STUPID _****ING_ COCKSUCKERS! THIS ****TY TOPIC HAS BEEN DISCUSSED ALREADY ELSEWHERE BY OTHER ****ING PEOPLE FOR GOD'S SAKE. **** OFF WITH THIS **** ALREADY.

 

[AWdeV]

Had I been on my laptop I'd given the link to the thread/comment I was referring to. I'll probably do that this afternoon.

 

[Helmut_AUT]

Merlkir was a tad rude, but then again, he's seen this exact same thing probably hundreds of times and one goading wiseass certainly won't simplify matters, especially not if that wiseass runs off to the report button after every other post.

Thanks for the "Wiseass". For some it must be really hard to communicate civil here on this forums.

First, the fact is that I started my post by saying I had searched, but try your luck and search for "vaegir + history" or similar combo, you get about 10 pages of results and none of them remotley answer the question. Can you tell me the magic search key words that will precisley answer my question? Or show me a sticky with the information? You can't, so me asking again was understandable and necessary.

Second, there are hundred thousand repetitive topics in these forums, from the multiplayer 2h spam to other MP balancing issues to single player items. No one is forcing you or Merlkir to read these threads, just as I ignore any multiplayer-whining since that does not interest me.

Third, I'm not normally quick to report to admin, but if an user thinks he has to try and disrupt my topic two times, and calls me "****tard" in the process then that crosses a certain line, and simple slinging insults back would be below my level of behaviour.

Fourth, and most sad: The most abusive insults, trolling and flaming **** words I've seen on these board come from people with a very long lance under their name. It seems a certain few think just because they've been here longer they somehow own the place and can govern other posters and what they are allowed to do. I don't think this is the reception to newer users that the Taleworld staff wants to see happen on their forums, so reporting these "****tards" to me makes sense in a broader scope as well.

 

[Merlkir]

**** YOU, YOU WHINY *****ES!!!!!!



ok. Now that we got that out of the way - this topic has been discussed many many times and it's one where the answer can not be found. It's as simple as that.

1) Only the devs know what they based the nations on and while they gave us hints, they haven't posted a "It's like this..." thread. So clearly they don't want to make it clear like that.
2) I'm sure it's changed a few times, Rhodoks in particular - people are having a really hard time agreeing on their inspiration and it seems it wasn't just one specific nation.
3) People misunderstand this and try to see it as "Swadians ARE Swabians." instead of "Swadians may be a play on words from Swabians, therefore they may be some inspiration for them found in the medieval Germany." This makes the discussion entirely pointless, because factions like Rhodoks or Sarranids simply aren't one nation with a different name and people will never agree on one like that.

Maybe there should be a stickied thread, or a place in the FAQ which would list the possible real history influences on factions.

And yes, I don't HAVE TO read these thread, it's enough for me to see them popping up every week or two.

And yeah, I totally own the forums. Pay me, or I'll ban your ass.