USSR

[NordArcher]

Imagine Lenin didn't have cancer, Stalin was never born. What would be the shape of humanity now? Would Europe have turned communist? Would America have turned communist?

I have always been fascinated by USSR, maybe because I'm a convinced ecologist and therefore don't sympathise all that much with capitalism.

 

[Swadius 2.0]

I don't think Lenin could have stood against Stalin for very long, even if he was at his prime.

Do I think it would have spread? No, perhaps in the third world countries or ones without a good or loyal military like the East Asian countries, but by the time the revolution was taking place if a government wanted to put down a rebellion they can and will, as the British can attest to.

 

[Urlik]

I don't know about that.

if those revolutionaries pick the right time when the First World countries have enemies that they can declare against, the old "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" comes into play and the First World arms the revolutionaries.

Britain and America armed Communists in South East Asia to fight against the Japanese in WW2 and then they armed the Taliban to fight against the USSR in Afghanistan.
the lesson from history is that the "Super Powers" will keep on making that mistake and arming groups around the world to fight their enemies with no view to the long term 

 

[Swadius 2.0]

I don't know about that.

if those revolutionaries pick the right time when the First World countries have enemies that they can declare against, the old "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" comes into play and the First World arms the revolutionaries.

That may be simplifying the relationships between states a bit too much, it's rarely the case that they stay friends after the war is won, or sometimes even before it.

Britain and America armed Communists in South East Asia to fight against the Japanese in WW2 and then they armed the Taliban to fight against the USSR in Afghanistan.

My view is that the allies predominantly funded and supported 蔣介石 and the 國民黨 over Mao's movement in the north, and that the Taliban are but one of the groups the US funded in Afghanistan during the Soviet invasion, I think they had their money on the Northern alliance taking over after the war ended.

the lesson from history is that the "Super Powers" will keep on making that mistake and arming groups around the world to fight their enemies with no view to the long term 

There's only so much you can do against artillery and air strikes. If a population does not support the guerrilla movement it makes it very hard for them to operate and fight back.

 

[CountArtha]

I have always been fascinated by USSR, maybe because I'm a convinced ecologist and therefore don't sympathise all that much with capitalism.

Yeah, those Communists were terrific at environmental stewardship.

 

[Illyrius]

*cough*Aral Sea*cough*

 

[NordArcher]

I have always been fascinated by USSR, maybe because I'm a convinced ecologist and therefore don't sympathise all that much with capitalism.

Yeah, those Communists were terrific at environmental stewardship.

They were all the same at that time. But i'm pretty sure a country where people consumme less crap the CO2 rejections are way lower.

Anyways, i now know that those who were opposed to the regime were mostly ex-Economic elites, which shows how much Communism sucks: it makes the riches lose their power, how sad. Then the other countries liders and other rich fatlards thought "**** we have to react or we'll lose our money D:!!!!!". Then they all waged war against the USSR.

I don't wonder why Stalin made it a totalitarian country anymore. I'm still in the doubt whether he was an indeologue who wanted his political system to function (by suppressing opposition) or just a dictator who took advantage of the situation.

 

[Seltus]

Anyways, i now know that those who were opposed to the regime were mostly ex-Economic elites, which shows how much Communism sucks: it makes the riches lose their power, how sad. Then the other countries liders and other rich fatlards thought "**** we have to react or we'll lose our money D:!!!!!". Then they all waged war against the USSR.

I don't wonder why Stalin made it a totalitarian country anymore. I'm still in the doubt whether he was an indeologue who wanted his political system to function (by suppressing opposition) or just a dictator who took advantage of the situation.

lolwut

First off, please make a list of nations which the USSR has waged open war against.
Then start understanding how the communists sees the political system. They believe an authoritarian system is needed, before a true classless system can be achieved. therefore, they're ****ing idiots. Also, saying that the only opposition is the rich elite is bull****. Any liberal, conservative and less extreme socialist wants ****-all to do with the USSR.
Finally, understand that Stalin was a mass-murdering bastard who just wanted the most power for himself. A man who murdered millions to further his own goals.

 

[Bohemond Chesne]

I have always been fascinated by USSR, maybe because I'm a convinced ecologist and therefore don't sympathise all that much with capitalism.

Yeah, those Communists were terrific at environmental stewardship.

They were all the same at that time. But i'm pretty sure a country where people consumme less crap the CO2 rejections are way lower.

The individuals may have consumed less. The "People" consumed a whole lot more. The USSR was quite adept at aquiring any resource it needed in massive industrial levels, regardless of expense of danger to the workers. Not knocking them, just saying when they set out to do something they did it thoroughly.

 

[Swadius 2.0]

Maybe he's referring to that village near Chernobyl where the plants are actually greener after the breach.

 

[AWdeV]

They probably glow in the dark too.

 

[El Perro Finlandese]

They probably glow in the dark too.

In some places in south-eastern Finland mushrooms still glow at night.

 

[Archonsod]

Do I think it would have spread? No, perhaps in the third world countries or ones without a good or loyal military like the East Asian countries, but by the time the revolution was taking place if a government wanted to put down a rebellion they can and will, as the British can attest to.

It wouldn't have to be revolution. If not for Stalin the Labour government of the 40's would have mirrored itself on the Soviet. I doubt we'd have been prepared to join the USSR any more than we were prepared to join Europe at the time, but given we eventually joined Europe, if Labour had took us down the red route then we may well have been tendering USSR membership rather than EU membership in the 80's.

 

[Almalexia]

USSR = ****in' lame.

 

[NordArcher]

USSR = ****in' lame.

Couldn't you keep your fingers away?

 

[Alexandru_cel_Mare]

Imagine Lenin didn't have cancer, Stalin was never born. What would be the shape of humanity now? Would Europe have turned communist? Would America have turned communist?

It would not have made much of a difference, in terms of human loss and suffering.
Still, milions of people would have eventually met their end in concentration camps.

Probably communism would have spread faster in Europe. But in USA, it would have not had a great succes. The American way of life, the American mentality and values are in complete oposition to communism, and is hard for me to imagine what kind of leader or what kind of force could have been able to compel the American people to embrace such an ideology.

 

[NordArcher]

Yes, i guess you're right. Although we don't know eactly what the Zeitgeist was at the time.

 

[Urlik]

during the great depression, if the right people had put forward a socialist party in the US then communism might well have spread in America.

I find it funny that the USA has such a hatred of Communism/Socialism and persecuted many people for holding the political view that everyone should provide what they can and get what they need (overly simplified) yet allows people to openly hold political views that see some people as subhuman based on skin colour

 

[NordArcher]

That's because they once had a war against Russia and are now traumatised. But in their heads they weren't fighting Russia, they were fighting Communism. That's just how smart humans are.

 

[Overlord-]

There's only one thing to say about it: It was damn ****ing ****.