[UNPOPULAR OPINION] The amount of "mods" on nexus will KILL the game

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HunDeTroie

Veteran
There are currently many "mods" on the nexus page. I will discuss the current state by making successive assumptions :
1) The current "mods" are not mods. They are tweaks

2) Bannerlord's true mods are and will be swarmed into the utter crap that is the mod community right now. Impossible to browse through high quality content mods.

3) Adding mods on top of mods will mean a raise in troubles, considering the game is already prone to trouble. Most tweaks use harmony when it is not needed, resulting in a larger risk of trouble that is not easy to solve.

4) Mods working together cannot work in MB, tweaks can. You have created a tweaking platform.

5) Balance is more than a problem. It is non existent

6) Remember that you are ruining the early access by providing those mods, not enabling people to report NATIVE BUGS but instead swarming the forums with mods-related bugs.



To conclude, if your "mod" is not necessary to the community, don't release it. You are ruining the game.

If you make a translation, CONTACT THE AUTHOR and give him your file but don't put it on moddb/nexus. Remember, it is NOT your work.

Currently, Nexus is in a very bad state. It could work for skyrim because every part of the game was decorrelated from the others. But here, everything is interconnected.

I will establish a list of people - modders and tweakers - and people will be able to classify tweakers and modders and browse their work via a python script. So basically tweakers will be blacklisted.
 

Askorti

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WB
I disagree with not making mods for the EA, however, I do agree with not making mods for the beta branch.
Also, I strongly dislike your attitude. If someone made a mod, it is their prerogative to release it if they feel like it. You are in absolutely no position to tell anyone if they can or cannot release it.
 
So take as an example my mod that fixes a bug with unit skills. Should i not post it even though it is very easy to fix and it took 10 min from finding to fixing it? This takes much longer for developers as they have to go through QA, administration and then wait to for the next hotfix. Or take my mod Equipment in encyclopedia. Is this a mod or a tweak? Where is the line? In warband you had 1 module at a time. No way to mix mods unless the modders included other mods in their own. Now you can mix freely, as many mods as you want. Yes some mods are going to be incompatible, at the same time a lot will be compatible, many mods, big and small, will work together so that point is pure BS. What is a necessary mod? What is a true mod? Who decides which mods are high quality? If there are enough people swarming the forums with mod bugs to affect the normal game, there is obviously a huge demand for these mods. So how are they ruining the game?
 

Kipsta

TAKE DOWN THE FRIGGING MODS AKDA TWEAKS AS I LIKE TO CALL THEM YOU ARE RUINING NEXUS AND THEREBY BANNERLORD 😭
 

HunDeTroie

Veteran
I said it would be an unpopular opinion.

So take as an example my mod that fixes a bug with unit skills. Should i not post it even though it is very easy to fix and it took 10 min from finding to fixing it? This takes much longer for developers as they have to go through QA, administration and then wait to for the next hotfix. Or take my mod Equipment in encyclopedia. Is this a mod or a tweak? Where is the line? In warband you had 1 module at a time. No way to mix mods unless the modders included other mods in their own. Now you can mix freely, as many mods as you want. Yes some mods are going to be incompatible, at the same time a lot will be compatible, many mods, big and small, will work together so that point is pure BS. What is a necessary mod? What is a true mod? Who decides which mods are high quality? If there are enough people swarming the forums with mod bugs to affect the normal game, there is obviously a huge demand for these mods. So how are they ruining the game?

I will try to answer one point at a time.

About your mod that fixes a bug with unit skills. You should just report it to the developers, and explain clearly how you fixed it. No need to put a mod on nexus that will be useful 10 days and destroy the scale of downloads/endorsements later.

The Equipment in Encyclopedia is to me a modder resource. It is a tweak as it can't be considered as a mod to me. However, it could be added to a larger-scale mod as a relevant feature.

The line is : does your mod overhaul a part of the game or not. If not, consider teaming with other modders to build a better mod. If you don't have the time, don't bother posting your mods.

A necessary mod is a mod that CLEARLY improves the game. A true mod is a mod that STRONGLY enhances the need for a player to get into the game, by adding or changing a whole part of gameplay. For example, SkyUI for Skyrim is a great mod. But Bannerlord Tweaks is not.

The demand is here because people are always craving for change. But it is often not necessary as it is a short-term behavior. It is clearly emphasized in this case, as most of the mods are not up to date or even relevant patch after patch.
 

dannazgu

Sergeant at Arms
I said it would be an unpopular opinion.



I will try to answer one point at a time.

About your mod that fixes a bug with unit skills. You should just report it to the developers, and explain clearly how you fixed it. No need to put a mod on nexus that will be useful 10 days and destroy the scale of downloads/endorsements later.

The Equipment in Encyclopedia is to me a modder resource. It is a tweak as it can't be considered as a mod to me. However, it could be added to a larger-scale mod as a relevant feature.

The line is : does your mod overhaul a part of the game or not. If not, consider teaming with other modders to build a better mod. If you don't have the time, don't bother posting your mods.

A necessary mod is a mod that CLEARLY improves the game. A true mod is a mod that STRONGLY enhances the need for a player to get into the game, by adding or changing a whole part of gameplay. For example, SkyUI for Skyrim is a great mod. But Bannerlord Tweaks is not.

The demand is here because people are always craving for change. But it is often not necessary as it is a short-term behavior. It is clearly emphasized in this case, as most of the mods are not up to date or even relevant patch after patch.

He already said it, it prevents the reporting the bugs to the company to fix it, which is their job since we pay for the game. Everyone wants a game stable made by them, which costed you money. People who makes mods, are bunch of whining ppl who think they're better than developers, instead of helping a game to be done and complete and then move on to do their mods or the mods ppl ask for it. Right now, the issue is help TW find those problems to solve. If modders are so good, why don't they band together and create a game of this magnitude then?
 

Julio-Claudian

Knight at Arms
I said it would be an unpopular opinion.



I will try to answer one point at a time.

About your mod that fixes a bug with unit skills. You should just report it to the developers, and explain clearly how you fixed it. No need to put a mod on nexus that will be useful 10 days and destroy the scale of downloads/endorsements later.

The Equipment in Encyclopedia is to me a modder resource. It is a tweak as it can't be considered as a mod to me. However, it could be added to a larger-scale mod as a relevant feature.

The line is : does your mod overhaul a part of the game or not. If not, consider teaming with other modders to build a better mod. If you don't have the time, don't bother posting your mods.

A necessary mod is a mod that CLEARLY improves the game. A true mod is a mod that STRONGLY enhances the need for a player to get into the game, by adding or changing a whole part of gameplay. For example, SkyUI for Skyrim is a great mod. But Bannerlord Tweaks is not.

The demand is here because people are always craving for change. But it is often not necessary as it is a short-term behavior. It is clearly emphasized in this case, as most of the mods are not up to date or even relevant patch after patch.
That's ridiculous. Many people don't know how to edit the game or don't have the time, so they download these "tweaks" to improve their experience. But because you consider anything less than a full overhaul to be unworthy of the title of "mod" people shouldn't be able to access them? People are capable of navigating the Nexus website and discerning for themselves whether or not they want to use what is available. It's not at all difficult to tell when a mod is out of date. There are various search options for different mod types. Perhaps you're upset at the lack of big overhaul mods, I'm sure everyone is looking forward to them but most people understand that they will become more common with time and as mod tools are released. This seems like a weird thing to choose to complain about.

Also this whole supposed 'modders V devs' narrative which people keep going on about is just so stupid. Feels like this forum is populated by a lot of rage-filled teenage boys lol.
 

VVyrd

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SM&B
This man just killed the entire Skyrim's Nexus in a few posts.

I'll only take one point seriously and that is that big mods won't work well together - About that, it does feel like it, but I wouldn't worry too much. With proper mod tools and documentation eventually good practices and design will spread through the community to avoid mod conflicts as much as possible.
 
"About your mod that fixes a bug with unit skills. You should just report it to the developers, and explain clearly how you fixed it"
I did. The exact code they need to change to fix it. It is trivial to fix yet it will at best be in the next hotfix. Normally yes I would not post this mod, but as this bug is pretty big balance wise, for both users and modders I thought it would be better to get this fixed sooner rather than later.

"it could be added to a larger-scale mod as a relevant feature"
So incompatibility is a problem but mods that implement specific features should only exist as a part of bigger mods? The bigger it is the higher the probability that it isn't compatible. Being able to separate features of mods is one of the big pros of Bannerlord, at least to me.

"If you don't have the time, don't bother posting your mods"
"A necessary mod is a mod that CLEARLY improves the game"
So rather than make mods some people will enjoy, do nothing. The only reason i made the encyclopedia mod is because there was no way to compare units without browsing xmls. I thought it would be great if you could see their equipment and such in the encyclopedia so rather than wait for something that might not even be implemented I did it myself. To me it is necessary and clearly improves the game since you can't compare units right now. You have a different opinion so once again WHO decides? Why should this have to be a part of some other mod? What if someone only wanted this part of that mod?

"The demand is here because people are always craving for change. But it is often not necessary as it is a short-term behavior. It is clearly emphasized in this case, as most of the mods are not up to date or even relevant patch after patch."
Fair enough, though as patches grow more infrequent mods will not need to updated as often.

"it prevents the reporting the bugs to the company to fix it"
Plenty of normal bugs being reported. Modders can find bugs, people that use mods can notice vanilla bugs because of the mods. I do not believe this is such a huge problem for them. If they have stated otherwise please provide source.

"People who makes mods, are bunch of whining ppl who think they're better than developers"
I no way do I think I am any better than the developers, I highly doubt any other modder thinks that. If they do, they are most likely stupid.

"Right now, the issue is help TW find those problems to solve"
Which mods do. By others modding units they discovered a bug, by me making an unrelated mod I found the exact cause of this bug and how to fix it.

"If modders are so good, why don't they band together and create a game of this magnitude then"
......, yeah i wonder, why don't complete strangers that want to improve a game, unpaid in their free time because they feel like it and they like the game, make another game themselves instead.
 
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There will 100% be a stickied mega-thread of good mods on this or another forum for bannerlord so people dont have to search on nexus or any other site (once overhaul and other interesting mods start to come out). That's pretty much how I find all my mods for other games. I really don't think having a bunch of trash or deprecated mods is going to "kill bannerlord".
 
It'll be harder to find good mods in all the noise but there may also come more good mods in general. Maybe even with submods now that several can be used at once.
 
This man just killed the entire Skyrim's Nexus in a few posts.

I'll only take one point seriously and that is that big mods won't work well together - About that, it does feel like it, but I wouldn't worry too much. With proper mod tools and documentation eventually good practices and design will spread through the community to avoid mod conflicts as much as possible.

A second one is "be cautious when reporting a bug/unbalance/etc if you are playing a modded version", i think he is right in this point too.
 
A second one is "be cautious when reporting a bug/unbalance/etc if you are playing a modded version", i think he is right in this point too.

I accidentally reported a crash with a mod, since i forgot I had it enabled. The crash logs do show what modules are being loaded so they probably just trash those or at least put a lower priority on them.
 

Wehveechen

Regular
Oh I'm sorry I refuse to play this full price EA title with small tweak mods that happen to fix everything I'm not happy about to improve my own experience.
We're early customers who ideally contribute to bug finding etc. But we're not beta testers whose job it is to find them. And if those tweaks are what sparks joy then I don't see why we shouldn't get to use them.

Also, I like to tell myself any mod user has the common sense not to upload bug reports about issues caused by mods. Or, as said above, since the report also includes modules, it'll be fairly easy to weed out modded versions.
 

Gambles

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Well I mean, is having to FIX the actual game to a halfway decent state with tweak mods appropriate? Absolutely not, it doesn't bode well for the game for sure. Will casual players just give up sifting through the ****? For sure.

But ultimately the good big mods, years down the road, will rise to the top through word of mouth. I think some people have a lot of passion for this kind of stuff and asking them to just stop isn't a good way to go about it.

However I will agree that the current state of the game and the constant recommendation for mods on an ea alpha game isn't wise. Especially when I see all the whining and complaining about broken games and saves. What the hell did you expect the game is in alpha and you're modding it lol.
 
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