Ukraine Today

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Jhessail

Panzervixen
Grandmaster Knight
Yulia has announced that she will not accept the post of "head of government". Though her former right-hand man is now the Speaker of Parliament and the Acting President. Hedging her bets for the presidential run or did the prison tenure drain her energy, so that she's willing to stay in the sidelines?

More promises of EU and IMF monetary support. USA warned Russia that intervening militarily would be a "grave mistake". Russian foreign minister still maintains that this was a "violent, unlawful coup", which probably explains why Danik calls for special forces to wash the streets with the blood of the protestors. Because Mother Russia stronk! Anti-EU parties warn that Ukraine cannot be fixed by throwing money at them, which is a nice gesture because what they really want is defunding the whole Union. Catherine Ashcroft will be flying to Kiev tomorrow to iron out details of EU support. Merkel is apparently acting as a mediator, trying to placate the Russians that EU-leaning Ukraine is not a threat to them. Putin looked quite happy in the closing ceremony at Sotshi but he has an awesome poker face anyway.
 
Jhessail said:
Yulia has announced that she will not accept the post of "head of government". Though her former right-hand man is now the Speaker of Parliament and the Acting President. Hedging her bets for the presidential run or did the prison tenure drain her energy, so that she's willing to stay in the sidelines?

More promises of EU and IMF monetary support. USA warned Russia that intervening militarily would be a "grave mistake". Russian foreign minister still maintains that this was a "violent, unlawful coup", which probably explains why Danik calls for special forces to wash the streets with the blood of the protestors. Because Mother Russia stronk! Anti-EU parties warn that Ukraine cannot be fixed by throwing money at them, which is a nice gesture because what they really want is defunding the whole Union. Catherine Ashcroft will be flying to Kiev tomorrow to iron out details of EU support. Merkel is apparently acting as a mediator, trying to placate the Russians that EU-leaning Ukraine is not a threat to them. Putin looked quite happy in the closing ceremony at Sotshi but he has an awesome poker face anyway.

I truly hope Yulia get the leadership.
She earned it.
 

Úlfheðinn

Section Moderator
WB
Nah, I'm quite happy to see someone new take a go, she isn't exactly the most trustworthy of politicians.

Granted, I'm not really sure if there are many viable choices for Ukrainian people beyond of course getting rid of Yanukovych.
 

Jhessail

Panzervixen
Grandmaster Knight
She's best of the Old Guard, at least from an outsiders point of view. Our Ukrainian posters might have a different image of her. When she was the Prime Minister, she did a good job of traipsing between EU and Russia. But getting new blood to run the new government could be beneficial to the country as a whole.
 
Putin looked quite happy in the closing ceremony at Sotshi but he has an awesome poker face anyway.
You're not kidding, you only have to watch videos with him and old Dubya in the same room to see evidence of that. :lol:
 

Anthropoid

Sergeant Knight at Arms
I'm curious what the local Ukrainians think: what is the risk (if any) of some sort of

1. Right-wing ultra-nationalist or neo-nazi faction rising to power, or

2. The 'Euromaidan' alliance breaking apart into fueding factions?

It is my understanding that this "Anti-Yanukovych / pro-EU" protest movement is actually

A. An agglomeration of a number of smaller political parties, and groups and

B. Does include one or more far-right, militant if not neo-Nazi elements?

Not trying to beat a dead horse, just curious. Of course we were all quite excited at the prospects that the revolutions in Libya, Egypt, Syria would lead to democratic reforms, increased justice, plurality, etc., but in those cases--largely as a result of the 'infiltration' of the revolutionary movement by extremists--things have not played out that way. Obviously, Ukraine is very different from these other societies, but the fact that there are extremists elements (pronounced minority or not) does raise the question.

And yes, my apologies to push things off topic. I just couldn't resist an opening to tease our beloved Canadians. I promise I'll be good . . .
 
The Fascists and NEO nazis element don't really support the EU.

They rioted because they happen to also hate Russia and pro Russian politicians.
 

Anthropoid

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Rebelknight said:
The Fascists and NEO nazis element don't really support the EU.

They rioted because they happen to also hate Russia and pro Russian politicians.

And this of course raises the question(s): since they do not particularly like the EU, how likely are they to:

i. try to thwart developments going forward, and place themselves and their agendas in the forefront of the 'post-revolution' rebuilding?

ii. negotiate for concessions toward their interests, given that they apparently did make important contributions to the protests?

I have no idea if we are talking about a few hundred or 10,000 "neo-Nazis" nor how solidary and well-organized they are. But I can imagine that, with the Yanukovych regime ousted, they as a special interest group, will take a vested interest in seeing THEIR agendas furthered.

I'm led to believe based on some comments in various coverage of the protests that a significant fraction of the molotov throwing, if not the melee combat, and indeed the overall combat organization of the protest movement were largely spearheaded by men from this section of the protest movement? As such, I could imagine them seeing like "We fought for this movement, now its time for us to get our concessions too."
 
...but there is no enemy. Unless you count random protesters putting vaguely fascist stuff on their cardboard shields, I've so far perceived little to no fascist leanings of the majority.
 

Weaver

Count
Jhessail said:
She's best of the Old Guard, at least from an outsiders point of view.
I don't want old guard in my new government. She has enough dirt on her hands.
God, please let this be a belated lustration.
Anthropoid said:
I'm curious what the local Ukrainians think: what is the risk (if any) of some sort of

1. Right-wing ultra-nationalist or neo-nazi faction rising to power, or

2. The 'Euromaidan' alliance breaking apart into fueding factions?
1. Svoboda is an ultra-nationalist party. It's fairly popular in western regions and it is already in the Parliament.
Ultra-nationalists are a reality in my country with which we have to put up.
2. Hopefully. I'm all for political pluralism when the alternative is a dictatorship.
Anthropoid said:
It is my understanding that this "Anti-Yanukovych / pro-EU" protest movement is actually

A. An agglomeration of a number of smaller political parties, and groups and

B. Does include one or more far-right, militant if not neo-Nazi elements?
A. It is a popular movement, not affiliated directly with political parties. Many politicians jumped on the bandwagon but they didn't start nor were able to control or stir it.

B. Yes.
 

Trueten

Section Moderator
WBVC
Weaver said:
1. Svoboda is an ultra-nationalist party. It's fairly popular in western regions and it is already in the Parliament.
Ultra-nationalists are a reality in my country with which we have to put up.
Blah, it's not. It's Kluev's project. It's a nice move to troll the South-East with a threat of Bandera's soldaten attackieren their homes, unless they wote for Party of Regions, that will protect them. They were ready to show their radicalism in a peace time, but weren't noticed in any battle when it actually was valid. Also, Tiahnybok didn't even mention at least one scenario to attack and move act aggressively. Everything they could do is put down Lenin when it was least than appropriate and had this march with torches, when everybody around them asked not to do this.
So it's a fake nationalistic party. Also, radikal requests in society grew more and more popular with each day of Yanukovich's presidentship. Since this days are over, radikal target audience started to reduce.

Jhessail said:
USA warned Russia that intervening militarily would be a "grave mistake".
Mm, yeah, but that didn't help, me thinks. Russian APCs have already 'went for a walk' in Crimea:

Also, those yellow bandaged ****s:
Machine gun at 6:10 and sniper rifles at 9:39 and further. I can hear the words from transceiver "Gun shots (means from protester side)" at 10:00. After this a guy asks "Do we have permission?" (obviously to use... well, you know what).
 

Weaver

Count
trueten said:
Blah, it's not. It's Kluev's project. It's a nice move to troll the South-East with a threat of Bandera's soldaten attackieren their homes, unless they wote for Party of Regions, that will protect them.
If it somehow got into the Parliament, it means there is a significant number of Ukrainians who want a party with ultra-nationalist ideology to represent them.
Whether it's Kluev's project is really a non-issue.
 

Trueten

Section Moderator
WBVC
trueten said:
Jhessail said:
USA warned Russia that intervening militarily would be a "grave mistake".
Mm, yeah, but that didn't help, me thinks. Russian APCs have already 'went for a walk' in Crimea:

Also, those yellow bandaged ****s:
Machine gun at 6:10 and sniper rifles at 9:39 and further. I can hear the words from transceiver "Gun shots (means from protester side)" at 10:00. After this a guy asks "Do we have permission?" (obviously to use... well, you know what).

Just in case - no russian accent, some of them speak ukranian. So those are not russians for sure.
quoting, since this is... interesting.



Weaver said:
it means there is a significant number of Ukrainians who want a party with ultra-nationalist ideology to represent them.
Again, it wasn't ultra-nationalist ideaology that motivated electors. But the growth of desire to 'kill 'em all' emotions among citizens. I know this, because I know those people who voted for them (and they are defenitely hardly even have a clue of what 'nationalistic' means) and heard their motivation.
 

Trueten

Section Moderator
WBVC
We know their commanders' names. The investigation is started. At least one sniper was captured on one civilian block-post in a black Passat with about $7k dollars.

Meanwhile russians are sending military trucks towards Novorossiysk (near Crimea):

Oh, Yanukovich is finally wanted officially.
 

Mage246

Makes sense that the Russians would want to secure the area around their major naval base, anyway. At least until things calm down.
 
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