Two weapon fightin? (dual wielding)
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Krizby said:
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This was discussed a billion times grmwblbgbrl...read the *grmlbrl* ****ing thread....
ThorofAsgard
Sergeant
SacredStoneHead said:
*Must save Facepalm symbol*
brognar said:
Note how the weapon in the left hand is basically being used as a ****ty shield. He might as well have been grabbing his crotch with his left while flailing away with the right.
I feel compelled to say no, dear god no, oh no no no. NO!
To clarify, this is not something that can be Implemented in multiplayer without breaking the balance of combat. Off hand will either be a shield surrogate with a "bash" function, or a spastic independent attacking arm with complicated blocking controls.
To clarify, this is not something that can be Implemented in multiplayer without breaking the balance of combat. Off hand will either be a shield surrogate with a "bash" function, or a spastic independent attacking arm with complicated blocking controls.
elorian
Sergeant at Arms
balance problems? i don´t see them. There WERE soldiers which would go berserk with two weapons, they used such to break shield walls and stuff like that. saying that they´d be overpowered or imbalanced is like saying "We cant put horses in a multiplayer game." Whats next, how about no one gets weapons at all? I mean, anyone would have the same power than! Jk jk, but you see were this is going. Also, in multiplayer you have four weapon slots, and if you´re not REALLY good or in a REALLY bad server, achiving enough money for two "good" swords, or a sword and a decent dagger, would be hard. Anyways, in multiplayer balance speaking, we have to settle the time in which the mod with dual wielding takes place; Viking mods? no problem, just make it so that only berserkr may use it, they have the worst armor, so there is your balance (a spear in the right direction and BOOM goes your viking). I think skyrim managed it pretty good, disabling the blocking function when using two weapons, which wouldn´t just balance it, but make it also extremly hard to play as a dual wielder.
Reneissance? Thats harder; disabling blocking there would just destroy the game balance, so we´d have to think about something else... How about decreasing attack speed? the weapons of that time were very slim and fast (in comparison to other times), to make them slower would be balance enough I think.
Basic Medieval mod? now you got me, I don´t have a vlue what we could do to balance it there.
Modern times mods?
show me one which would be worth the thinking
Fantasy mods? Tehahaha, how about we can dual wield Uzis while mounted on a Pink Pegasunicorn which shoots death rays out of its eyes melting down hords of orcs?
Reneissance? Thats harder; disabling blocking there would just destroy the game balance, so we´d have to think about something else... How about decreasing attack speed? the weapons of that time were very slim and fast (in comparison to other times), to make them slower would be balance enough I think.
Basic Medieval mod? now you got me, I don´t have a vlue what we could do to balance it there.
Modern times mods?
show me one which would be worth the thinkingFantasy mods? Tehahaha, how about we can dual wield Uzis while mounted on a Pink Pegasunicorn which shoots death rays out of its eyes melting down hords of orcs?
elorian said:balance problems? i don´t see them. There WERE soldiers which would go berserk with two weapons, they used such to break shield walls and stuff like that. saying that they´d be overpowered or imbalanced is like saying "We cant put horses in a multiplayer game." Whats next, how about no one gets weapons at all? I mean, anyone would have the same power than! Jk jk, but you see were this is going. Also, in multiplayer you have four weapon slots, and if you´re not REALLY good or in a REALLY bad server, achiving enough money for two "good" swords, or a sword and a decent dagger, would be hard. Anyways, in multiplayer balance speaking, we have to settle the time in which the mod with dual wielding takes place; Viking mods? no problem, just make it so that only berserkr may use it, they have the worst armor, so there is your balance (a spear in the right direction and BOOM goes your viking). I think skyrim managed it pretty good, disabling the blocking function when using two weapons, which wouldn´t just balance it, but make it also extremly hard to play as a dual wielder.
Reneissance? Thats harder; disabling blocking there would just destroy the game balance, so we´d have to think about something else... How about decreasing attack speed? the weapons of that time were very slim and fast (in comparison to other times), to make them slower would be balance enough I think.
Basic Medieval mod? now you got me, I don´t have a vlue what we could do to balance it there.
Modern times mods?
Fantasy mods? Tehahaha, how about we can dual wield Uzis while mounted on a Pink Pegasunicorn which shoots death rays out of its eyes melting down hords of orcs?
Viking? Dual wielding? Skyr- oh right, I'll get straight to the point:
. . . . . . . .. . . . . .,.-”. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .“-.,
. . . . .. . . . . . ..,/. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ”:,
. . . . . . . .. .,?. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .\,
. . . . . . . . . /. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,}
. . . . . . . . ./. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,:`^`.}
. . . . . . . ./. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,:”. . . ./
. . . . . . .?. . . __. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . :`. . . ./
. . . . . . . /__.(. . .“~-,_. . . . . . . . . . . . . . ,:`. . . .. ./
. . . . . . /(_. . ”~,_. . . ..“~,_. . . . . . . . . .,:`. . . . _/
. . . .. .{.._$;_. . .”=,_. . . .“-,_. . . ,.-~-,}, .~”; /. .. .}
. . .. . .((. . .*~_. . . .”=-._. . .“;,,./`. . /” . . . ./. .. ../
. . . .. . .\`~,. . ..“~.,. . . . . . . . . ..`. . .}. . . . . . ../
. . . . . .(. ..`=-,,. . . .`. . . . . . . . . . . ..(. . . ;_,,-”
. . . . . ../.`~,. . ..`-.. . . . . . . . . . . . . . ..\. . /\
. . . . . . \`~.*-,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ..|,./.....\,__
,,_. . . . . }.>-._\. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .|. . . . . . ..`=~-,
. .. `=~-,_\_. . . `\,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .\
. . . . . . . . . .`=~-,,.\,. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .\
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . `:,, . . . . . . . . . . . . . `\. . . . . . ..__
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .`=-,. . . . . . . . . .,%`>--==``
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . _\. . . . . ._,-%. . . ..`
Blackthorn
Squire
brognar said:
1) 100% True. All 'Viking' dual wielding evidence is civilian fights breaking out during otherwise peaceful situations, and the most common description is a spear and 'blade'- suggesting the sword is held in reserve, or even the spear is thrown. Not a 'berserk' at all, the evidence for whom is sparse enough as it is without adding in the 100 tonnes of Bullsh!t.
2) The fact that people would even consider dual-wielding over dual-handed techniques demonstrates the two-handed AND shield dynamics need to be worked on, rather than ''we need two weaponz!" In real life a spear is so much deadlier than in M+B where it is the worst ''hook a duck'' device available.
Just one thought: what is more efficient to break shields?
a) Two-handed, 1,7 meters long dane axe;
b) Dual wielding of any lighter one-handed weapon.
A.: No matter what you do with the two weapons, you'll never reach the power and momentum of a two-handed axe strike.
@Blackthorn:
Welcome back, sir
a) Two-handed, 1,7 meters long dane axe;
b) Dual wielding of any lighter one-handed weapon.
A.: No matter what you do with the two weapons, you'll never reach the power and momentum of a two-handed axe strike.
@Blackthorn:
Welcome back, sir
ThorofAsgard
Sergeant
SacredStoneHead said:Just one thought: what is more efficient to break shields?
a) Two-handed, 1,7 meters long dane axe;
b) Dual wielding of any lighter one-handed weapon.
A.: No matter what you do with the two weapons, you'll never reach the power and momentum of a two-handed axe strike.
@Blackthorn:
Welcome back, sir
To add to the shield wall thing (first of all it's 'a') your left arm (for most people) will be alot weaker then your right arm, so the extra sword would just get in the way (Even less power than a one armed stroke from your right). If I had the choice I'd take a two handed axe or spear or even a sword with a shield (at least I could slam the thing into his face) rather than taking two weapons
Blackthorn said:
Could also relate to a hadseax or scramseax held in the rear hand by the blade so that should the opponent close too quickly to shorten the grip on the spear, it can be dropped and the hadseax/scramseax is drawn, in the hand and ready to use. Was a trick I used to great effect when I was a re-enactor.
Sadly this is very true. Spears, as they are in M&B, make me cry inside. The spear is such a wonderful weapon, so extremely effective on it's own and when in formation, that it is sad to see it degraded so, as it is in many other games. The range, speed and power, not to mention accuracy, of a spear is not to be underestimated - first day I was given a spear I put the tip on target inside a 2" square opening in a shield wall vs shield wall. I also knocked someone in the eye with the tip on that first day (they were alright, socket was a little bruised, no permanent damage thank goodness).
Compare that to M&B... it's so very sad. Still! At least the Vikingr mod got as close as you can within M&Bs engine to making spears viable.
(Welcome back Blackthorn
)
Even in mount and blade they are quite deadly, not many people can judge their reach properly, and a well timed spearman can be a good asset to any team.
Except that the vast majority of the time in Native spears are used as 360º lolspin or side-swing-spam weapons - when the weapon is most effective when swinging from the side, as well as being faster than thrusting, there is something majorly wrong. But then that is down to problems with M&Bs combat which encourages turning into attacks with the mouse & spamming which makes the for some reason really slow spear thrusts almost pointless. It's easy to block a spear thrust, so, so easy, whereas it's harder to parry the spin-swing of a weapon because of the retarded speed & M&Bs engine.
rapier17 said:
Mostly because the side attack should be a side thrust.
I think that spears could have two modes, one with all attacks being thrusts in different directions and the other with blunt attacks, pretty much the way it is now.
