TW is quiet

[Shun]

This game have not been in development for 8 years. They made a reset around 2014 I think, started building a new engine, took them maybe 2-2.5 years and then coders and designers had to learn to work with the new enginge, another 1.5-2 years.

I dont think they starded development for real around 2018, maybe some smaller things before that.

I think that there are moments where the game shines, and it seems the love of (some?) developers for the game is obvious. It does feel as if the cart is pulled in many different directions at the same time though, so to speak. Which for me leaves the impression of the game not being directed or produced according to a coherent vision. I think this is a shame, because I felt M&B and Warband both had very strong connections to a overarching vision of which experience the games wanted to offer to the player. For Bannerlord, I don't get this impression at this point in time.

Edit: I want to add that I am aware of my limited knowledge of how things work in the company and how producing video games works in general. My view is expressed as the view of someone who holds both Taleworlds and the M&B series in very high esteem. I want them to succeed, and keep on being successful. And I do believe that in the end they will provide Bannerlord as a great game. But this is a belief, not sure knowledge, and there are many decisions still to be made. So I offer my input in this Early Access phase, to give them data to help them make the best decisions.
I am looking forward to the result.

 

[Apocal]

Please provide examples of what other areas you have found TW to have really thought about or put effort into? I'm generally curious, because.....................................................................I can't think of one.

The economy is the one I'm thinking about. They have a really good underlying system for simulating an economy as the base, but then added in balances to make sure things don't spiral out of control, that every fief has a different set of needs, there is price differentiation (which is the really great bit; a lot of dynamic econ games that are allowed to run long enough have issues with this), and it hooks into other systems like garrisons and workshops, so the player (if they choose) can have a tangible impact.

There is clearly thought and effort put into it and TW could've totally avoided that by just press-stamping workshops to make a certain amount (+ a little RNG) per day and 95% (or more) of players wouldn't even notice. But they went with a really in-depth design instead of minimal effort.

 

[Worlok]

The opposite of what your saying is demonstrable.

The most developed part of the game, that receives the most praise is the mindless sword swinging and combat aspects.

However, not a single other aspect of the game is well developed. AND the forums are filled with people who care about more than just sword swinging.

Your comment has literally made my head hurt with how ass backwards it is.

Please provide examples of what other areas you have found TW to have really thought about or put effort into? I'm generally curious, because.....................................................................I can't think of one.

Perks? - no
Dip? - no
Economy? - no
Quest? - no
Fief management? - no
NPC interaction? - um **** no

So wtf are you even talking about?

To reflect on this - what do I enjoy other then fighting and wars:
1. I do like the clan system. Family and clan progression. When I look at the big picture, I definitely see there was a vision. It's not finished yet indeed, but it doesn't need too much at this point. I still enjoy the current system.
2. I do like smithing too. The options inside the crafting system are amazing. So many different weapons - single handed Thamaskene sword, 2 handed swords and axes and polearms. Trying all these crafted weapons in battle is nice.
3. I also like the idea of the faction participation. Mercenary, vassal or own kingdom. This also needs some more work but it is already nice, obviously not perfect.

By the way, the income from tribute is a nice addition to the economy...

 

[Moton]

I think that there are moments where the game shines, and it seems the love of (some?) developers for the game is obvious. It does feel as if the cart is pulled in many different directions at the same time though, so to speak. Which for me leaves the impression of the game not being directed or produced according to a coherent vision. I think this is a shame, because I felt M&B and Warband both had very strong connections to a overarching vision of which experience the games wanted to offer to the player. For Bannerlord, I don't get this impression at this point in time.

Edit: I want to add that I am aware of my limited knowledge of how things work in the company and how producing video games works in general. My view is expressed as the view of someone who holds both Taleworlds and the M&B series in very high esteem. I want them to succeed, and keep on being successful. And I do believe that in the end they will provide Bannerlord as a great game. But this is a belief, not sure knowledge, and there are many decisions still to be made. So I offer my input in this Early Access phase, to give them data to help them make the best decisions.
I am looking forward to the result.

You're exactly right about the fact that Taleworlds seems to have massive communication problems and as such things can get really confusing for programmers.

Not sure tho if their vision of the end product is the problem here, however, not beeing able to show an actual roadmap is concerning since that indicates they have no real month to month goal at all wich is healthy for gamedevelopers to have. I have no idea where they think they are in the development, perhaps they simply think that there are to many problems and speed bumps for them to put a roadmap out for uss to see and maybe they will do that in the future.

Also dont get me wrong, I think they have ALOT of work ahead of them and many things to improve. I just had to explain that they have not been developing this game for 8 years. That's simply not true and people need to stop thinking that.

 

[Shun]

You're exactly right about the fact that Taleworlds seems to have massive communication problems and as such things can get really confusing for programmers.

Not sure tho if their vision of the end product is the problem here, however, not beeing able to show an actual roadmap is concerning since that indicates they have no real month to month goal at all wich is healthy for gamedevelopers to have. I have no idea where they think they are in the development, perhaps they simply think that there are to many problems and speed bumps for them to put a roadmap out for uss to see and maybe they will do that in the future.

Also dont get me wrong, I think they have ALOT of work ahead of them and many things to improve. I just had to explain that they have not been developing this game for 8 years. That's simply not true and people need to stop thinking that.

I get the feeling of the lack of vision because many of the systems implemented, and especially the improvements on the older systems, are lacking impact. An example would be the siege minigame before the actual battle. what's the point of having this 90's style ballista shooutout before the battle? They have a great engine, why not show the siege duel in the siege scene? At the momet it only serves as a speed bump for the siegeing party. Maybe that's the intention, but it could be so much more, letting us experience dramatic trebuchet shots, fire arrows lighting the night, etc etc.

Maybe something more consequential is planned, designed, in the drawer or worked upon. But the only point we only know from the SP improvement list kinda is written like "improve sieges" (i am paraphrasing here), so there is no way to know. And that's dynamic medieval castle sieges, one of the most unique selling propositions Bannerlord has!

 

[TKnight]

ye , siege minigame is trash.. i wish we could have our own siege equipment that we can buy or smth or asemble as we march and fast deploy , i never used siege equipement in this state, its just a waste of time and army. and its not worth it.

 

[fanugi]

1.5.3 today? Whatcha say TW?

 

[Eugene Shutto]

1.5.3 today? Whatcha say TW?

It's getting late , I'm loosing hope about today . Tomorrow is friday , so not tomorrow either , not this week then ...

 

[Wolfmensch007]

You're exactly right about the fact that Taleworlds seems to have massive communication problems and as such things can get really confusing for programmers.

Not sure tho if their vision of the end product is the problem here, however, not beeing able to show an actual roadmap is concerning since that indicates they have no real month to month goal at all wich is healthy for gamedevelopers to have. I have no idea where they think they are in the development, perhaps they simply think that there are to many problems and speed bumps for them to put a roadmap out for uss to see and maybe they will do that in the future.

Also dont get me wrong, I think they have ALOT of work ahead of them and many things to improve. I just had to explain that they have not been developing this game for 8 years. That's simply not true and people need to stop thinking that.

I am wondering if we will get multi layer siege like it was in warband, where when you got overrun on the walls, you could retreat back to the keep and defend there. I just dont understand why you would remove such mechanics. It makes the game more bare bone then it already is, and the fact that you have less features in a sequel then the prequel is just disappointing.

I dont support this game anymore financially, meaning i will recommend all my friends who were still unsure whether they should buy the game or not to wait, until the game improves.

I really think that Taleworlds are just a bunch of lazy developers who dont want to get in to more complex stuff because it gives them more work to Deal with.

Anyways i am off for a shisha break.

 

[Dr-Shinobi]

ye , siege minigame is trash.. i wish we could have our own siege equipment that we can buy or smth or asemble as we march and fast deploy , i never used siege equipement in this state, its just a waste of time and army. and its not worth it.

I love using em since you can kill so much on choke points and open up for archers. Only problem is that the offensive battles are usually to little defenders except if you choose to attack yourself with fair numbers that its needed to get that edge. But for lesser loss you get the better i always think.

Also for some reason theres little bowmen on the walls now to so idk whats up with that. Just stormed an castle with 800 men in em and there was like 5 archers small firing and 2 catapults

 

[method man]

Soon™

 

[Hans 77]

The economy is the one I'm thinking about. They have a really good underlying system for simulating an economy as the base, but then added in balances to make sure things don't spiral out of control, that every fief has a different set of needs, there is price differentiation (which is the really great bit; a lot of dynamic econ games that are allowed to run long enough have issues with this), and it hooks into other systems like garrisons and workshops, so the player (if they choose) can have a tangible impact.

There is clearly thought and effort put into it and TW could've totally avoided that by just press-stamping workshops to make a certain amount (+ a little RNG) per day and 95% (or more) of players wouldn't even notice. But they went with a really in-depth design instead of minimal effort.

^^
This is one of the few aspects of the current singleplayer experience I have genuine respect and esteem for. Taleworlds did a fantastic job creating a dynamic and interesting world economy that adheres to supply/demand and general market principles. Plus the level of player interaction with the economy is surprisingly deep -limited only by one's own imagination. I applaud the dev team team for this one.

 

[Wolfmensch007]

Time for a shisha break

 

[StewVader]

The economy is the one I'm thinking about. They have a really good underlying system for simulating an economy as the base, but then added in balances to make sure things don't spiral out of control, that every fief has a different set of needs, there is price differentiation (which is the really great bit; a lot of dynamic econ games that are allowed to run long enough have issues with this), and it hooks into other systems like garrisons and workshops, so the player (if they choose) can have a tangible impact.

There is clearly thought and effort put into it and TW could've totally avoided that by just press-stamping workshops to make a certain amount (+ a little RNG) per day and 95% (or more) of players wouldn't even notice. But they went with a really in-depth design instead of minimal effort.

Its really not though. They simply have an invisible NPC (Artisan) in each town who buys and makes stuff and the rate that Artisans buy/make stuff is fixed. Also, villages only sell to towns, they don't buy stuff.

It's not well thought-out or good at all. It's simply a buy low sell high with not many outside influences like climate / disease / drought etc that impact the economy.

You guys are delusional.

 

[method man]

The economy is the one I'm thinking about. They have a really good underlying system for simulating an economy as the base, but then added in balances to make sure things don't spiral out of control, that every fief has a different set of needs, there is price differentiation (which is the really great bit; a lot of dynamic econ games that are allowed to run long enough have issues with this), and it hooks into other systems like garrisons and workshops, so the player (if they choose) can have a tangible impact.

There is clearly thought and effort put into it and TW could've totally avoided that by just press-stamping workshops to make a certain amount (+ a little RNG) per day and 95% (or more) of players wouldn't even notice. But they went with a really in-depth design instead of minimal effort.

The economic modelling was unimpressive when I played. Beyond the obviously broken prices of gear, there just wasn't that much going on.

 

[El Capitan]

Soon™

In Soon™ we trust. The almighty soon.

We'll probably get the update next week, in the meantime I might try Medieval Dynasty.

 

[Shiroin]

#JOKE#

I start to notice the threads which complaining TaleWorlds always can get more attention in the forum.

SO↓

Am I the only one who following the long novel<Bannerlord development blog> for years? The season X should be SoonTM.

Will I get more followers in the forum?

 

[Apocal]

Its really not though. They simply have an invisible NPC (Artisan) in each town who buys and makes stuff and the rate that Artisans buy/make stuff is fixed. Also, villages only sell to towns, they don't buy stuff.

It's not well thought-out or good at all. It's simply a buy low sell high with not many outside influences like climate / disease / drought etc that impact the economy.

You guys are delusional.

Production outputs are only one part of the economy. At any rate, it is a pretty clear example of where TW went with way more than minimal effort, which was the point I disputed.

edit:

The economic modelling was unimpressive when I played. Beyond the obviously broken prices of gear, there just wasn't that much going on.

It goes deeper than almost every other game that wasn't deliberately designed as economic simulation. Whether you consider that impressive is up to you but that's certainly more than anyone would expect from the game people describe as "Total War but you can fight with your troops."

 

[HugoTheFrenchMan]

#JOKE#

I start to notice the threads which complaining TaleWorlds always can get more attention in the forum.

SO↓

Am I the only one who following the long novel<Bannerlord development blog> for years? The season X should be SoonTM.

Will I get more followers in the forum?

Bruh i have read every single dev blog and am a true believer in the religion of Soon

 

[Rungsted93]

I might have worded myself poorly, I'm in no way against modding tools being released. It just feels like TW are releasing it earlier than previously planned so they can let modders do the work they themselves should be doing.
Just a simple example, they showed gang mechanics 3-4 years ago, and yes I totally get that they showed something which wasn't completely working by then, that's not the problem. But whatever bugs related to this not working they seriously couldn't bother to fix in 3-4 years... This kind of just shows the mentality and lack of ambition, they're cutting corners at every single opportunity. And I don't get why so many people give TW a pass for this when I've seen other developers ripped apart for much less!

Why not assign 1 guy to do nothing but quests ? In 8 years we should've had hundreds!
1 guy making cool in-depth dialogues and companions with cool backstories
1 guy working on diplomacy / political / vassal system (heck they could pretty much copy the tiered vassal system from CK 1:1 and it would be amazing! perhaps even expand upon it and give each culture their own unique one).
Also why is your wife getting pregnant so illogical designed ? It should be an option when she's in the keep where you chose "Lets spend the night together" and then there's a chance she'll get pregnant. Instead we get 30 kids while she's leading an army on the other side of the continent (yes they're wasting their time on a fix, when my idea legit would take a competent person 30 minutes to do)

And why do we not have unique scenes for everything yet ? even if say their scene editor first worked 4 years ago they should've been done with all of them at this point. Honestly sometimes it feels like everyone at TW is just sitting watching Mexxico working.. And yeah sorry for this little rant, but all those years I was hoping for next level stuff like Co-op campaign etc. At this point I'd be happy if they bothered adding banners and fix marriages..