To all Spammers

[Ruthven]

The spam is easy to deal with, so bleh. But saying that an amazing Monty Python sketch was dedicated to a certain type of player in Warband? That's just low.

 

[Nahkuri]

I like to think that the word spammer is used when one encounters an agressive player and doesn't know what the **** he should do.

I don't recall having any problem with someone coming at me like a ****ing freight train with spinning blades attached to the front. Unless he's got good skills, in which case complaining would only make me a bad loser and a twat.

 

[Qwertyman]

nonetheless,  its sad that a player can acheave a good score by mashing the attack button and holding forwards,    it discourages any tactics whatsoever,  why bother forming a shieldwall when you can rush forwards like a blind monkey and have a garunteed kill or two.

 

[Ruthven]

nonetheless,  its sad that a player can acheave a good score by mashing the attack button and holding forwards,    it discourages any tactics whatsoever,  why bother forming a shieldwall when you can rush forwards like a blind monkey and have a garunteed kill or two.

Exactly. Why would you? Who's the better player, the one using the bad tactic who dies all the time or the one who uses the good one and wins?

 

[Qwertyman]

are you suggesting mashing attack and holding forwards is a good tactic?  (or a tactic at all?)

 

[Faranox]

nonetheless,  its sad that a player can acheave a good score by mashing the attack button and holding forwards,    it discourages any tactics whatsoever,  why bother forming a shieldwall when you can rush forwards like a blind monkey and have a garunteed kill or two.

Think of fighting games. In many fighting games, one player can button mash and come out with the win, but they'll gain no respect for it, and more often than not a skilled player will find them easy enough prey.

 

[Qwertyman]

nonetheless,  its sad that a player can acheave a good score by mashing the attack button and holding forwards,    it discourages any tactics whatsoever,  why bother forming a shieldwall when you can rush forwards like a blind monkey and have a garunteed kill or two.

Think of fighting games. In many fighting games, one player can button mash and come out with the win, but they'll gain no respect for it, and more often than not a skilled player will find them easy enough prey.

my point isnt that a low skilled player will beat a high skilled player by spamming,    its that the majority of players will find more success spamming, so they will spam (talking about my own team here)  making tactics impossible because nobody will cooperate as they would rather rush wildly at the enemy.

it drains the fun from the game,  because I am forced to either join the blind monkey rush,  or fight alone.  very rarely i will come across a player or two at most on a server who is willing to use teamwork.

 

[Faranox]

I understand your sentiment there, but the issue is communication.

 

[Qwertyman]

perhaps,  but i do think that if spamming was much less effective  (say-  give a slight pause between each swing depending on weapon weight) then players would feel less inclined to rush at the enemy swinging,    if they couldn't twirl their weapons as fast as they do now and instead had moments of vulnerability between swings (at least, being forced to block between swings)  then they would feel much more vulnerable when ramboing,  and much safer in a group,  leading to better cooperation and teamwork.

(note that i dont think ramboing is strong,  but when you have a greatlongaxe in your hands, you do get an unrealistic sence of power and players often think they can take on whole teams )

just my theiory is that if you nerf the effect of spam you will get better cooperation.

 

[A_Mustang]

Quote for Wikipedia:

"As of 2003, Spam is sold in 41 countries worldwide. The largest consumers of Spam are the United States, the United Kingdom and South Korea."

I wounder why...

 

[Aethelred]

Spammer hatred is nonsense. I love it when I see a spammer charging at me, because I already know I'm going to win unless I completely **** something up. It's so easy to get the first hit on them, and once you get the first hit on a spammer you're guaranteed to get the last. You can't succeed at M&B by just mashing attack, unless all your opponents are even more useless. Very few even play that way, and those that do are probably totally new to M&B or too lagged to be able to do anything else.

 

[Tool]

I normally go 1h/Shield as a pref and find most spammers easy enough to deal with, even if they destroy the shield with 1 axe swing, manual blocking is simple as they tend to use horizontal strikes. The trick is to be patient and have confidence in your ability to manually block. Working to position yourself to their side or rear is ideal, also with most it's easy enough to leave your guard down and dance near their max weapon range, normally they take the bait and swing giving your a nice open melon to split.

In group situations I love seeing 1 or more 2h wielding enemies come at me with their weapons back, even better when I'm in a duel with someone else. Stepping at them and catching your sword to their face then turning back to continue your duel is priceless.

 

[Mabons]

Just to say, there seems to be certain players who swing faster than other players. Might just be my eyes, but I swear some swing faster.

 

[Tool]

Just to say, there seems to be certain players who swing faster than other players. Might just be my eyes, but I swear some swing faster.

I'm fairly certain that's due to the combination of their ping relative to the server and yours couple with turning into weapon swings. Sometimes it'll appear that they swing at such a rate that is nearly impossible to block but in reality they swung their weapon a slight time before, the insane speed seems to be your side catching up to display their action. It's unfortunate but to really see the affects of ping relative to weapon speed, try a few duels on a 200+ ms server with people that have various pings, you should notice differences in their attack speeds.

 

[Mudcrab]

They are annoying but relatively easy to beat.

 

[Sir Bogan]

Yes...... ^ ^ ^ Above (Ruthven that is).

Otherwise.... get over it.... all we have heard since Warband has been released is .....2 hand spam....2 hand spam....

Just ****ing go a 1 hander, and if you get killed, suck it up and try again.

but that surely shows that its an issue,  something that detracts from the fun of the game and thus something should be done to improve the situation.

That IS a good point.
Unfortunately, people have been calling for changes to the speed or attributes of 2 handers, and things have not changed.

<Rant> The Sarranids and their bloody two handed maces! </Rant>

As I implied in my previous post, probably not the most politely, is that us 1 handers sometimes have to rise above the spammers, take the higher moral ground, get killed a few times, and as others have mentioned previously, then give lessons in what a 1 handed weapon can do when wielded properly. (Not that I am saying I can do this consistently).

I think the biggest issue with the perceived spamming of 2 handers, is that now the beta is open, new players join, try some weapon combinations, see that the leaderboards are populated by those who choose to wield 2 handers, and then follow suit. A vicious circle.

 

[Qwertyman]

I do agree there,  and I do fully understand that 2handed spam-  whilst annoying, is not an issue for people who know how to deal with it.  but sadly most people don't (probably due to the large number of new players) and thus 2handed spam is powerful since half the players you meet will panic and fall to it.

This makes a good portion of each team go 2hander seeing it as the 'proper way to play inf'  (although this is fun when you're an archer,  and lognaxespammers call you nooby for using an 'easy weapon',  the idea of bringing a shield doesn't even cross their mind)    its not fun to have over half of each team do a blind spamrush at each other,  then for half the remaining players to get steamrolled because they don't know how to deal with spammers.
People simply dont use tactics anymore because the vast majority of players either spamrush or turtle under 3 sheilds (thinking this is the way to deal with spam).

sorry to sound ranty,  but spam is more of a problem than just being skilless,  it detracts from the entire game, not just 1v1 encounters.

 

[Sir Bogan]

Heck, I know how to deal with it, but I still panic and get done, especially, as you say, when the opposition battle team has a whole bunch of two handers ganking one guy with a shield.

One thing I just noticed in a DM tonight, and I don't know if it's this patch or has been around for a while, was that when I blocked a two hander with my trusty short sword, I froze and could not attack for a fraction of a second.

As an aside, I can understand how the new guys like the two handers.

I was having fun playing as a one hander, and helping a new guy learn how to duel tonight, yet all the way through one character seemed to enjoy breaking duels, or not acknowledging signals, with his large two handed axe (don't know which kind). I decided to give myself a long axe, along with my short sword (for duelling those who wished) and show this character what a two hander can do.

This guy was leading by a long way, and he then fell to a distant second on the list at the end. (So effective was spamming, that originally I was using leather armour, boots, and no helmet, yet, as you can see by my character, by the end of the match (as this is when the screenshot was taken), I had full best armour (gloves, helmet, boots and torso).

隐藏

Balance is definitely needed.

 

[mcnostril]

I haven't been playing long enough to know how to deal with this crap.
On one of the EU TDM servers, most of the enemy team was doing this, and I have no idea how to fight it. 2h axe would shatter my shield in a few hits (and when that happens the stagger gets me killed), and attempting to hit them between swings just ended in many "double ewe tea eff mate" moments for me when it seemed that they could swing noticeably faster than me with my one hander.

Maybe it's also due to latency, but I have no idea how to deal with 2 handers attacking non-stop. Best I can come up with is a well timed kick, but with the reach of 2 handers they're rarely in range, and when I do get a good hit in, it never seems to be enough to kill. The few melee kills I do get in these situations seem to be due to sheer luck. Archery is a good bet, but see the other archery thread to see why that's also problematic.

Help a noob.

 

[Úlfheðinn]

Block the attacks of the 2H as you move forwards towards him, then attack. The 2H are not fast enough to constantly attack if you block, at most two strikes in you will have time to swiftly strike.



The problem with this whole discussion is that it is not about balance its about players. Even if you changed the balance of the game, I remain unconvinced it would cause a shift in play style.

New players or those without experience are always going to fall for tactics that "veterans" may see as easy, such things will never change. That does not mean that the weapons are problematic.

I would not want combat to be slower or further limits placed on swing frequency, that would detract from the fluidity of combat. Along with ruining much of the fun of fighting multiple opponents("Oh, time to wait for my attack to charge so I can stop blocking and swing at these three blokes.").