These are the real issues with the class system.

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Kylbee

Recruit
So before I start this thread, I'm going to clear up any confusions when I say "Class system". I am talking about the sub-classes of the three main classes Taleworlds has refused to get rid of, despite overwhelmingly negative feedback on the subject after 8-10 months of MP beta. The only classes we should have to choose from, is Cavalry, Infantry, and Ranged. Then we should be able to customize accordingly for our needs.

And let me be clear on this one. I want a response from a dev. We all do. We haven't heard anything about Multiplayer this whole week and one quick look at the forums will tell you that a lot of people need some sort of assurance that we'll actually enjoy MP in the future. We've been waiting 8 years. These threads are not going to stop just because you ignore them.



1) You aren't letting us be stupid
I feel this is the most important reason why we don't like the classes... We can't run around naked with a dagger and throwin knives, and we can't show off our hideous character we spent customizing for the memes, because we are forced to wear a helmet.

2) The class system doesn't actually prevent snowballing.
In TDM when I die a lot, I get stuck having to use a peasant with a sickle quite often, while the people who are already doing well just repeat their slaughter upon me. The class system may work great in Captain Mode, but in literally every mode it will not work. It makes more sense to just give everyone a set amount of gold so that everyone can have a level playing field throughout the whole match.

3) I can't equip myself for ever-changing situations in combat.
I want to be able to tweak and switch my loadout on the fly to be able to combat a strength the enemy team has, or to capitalize on a weakness they have. For example, I notice the team is swinging wildly without accuracy and they never aim for my head. I want to be able to take my helmet off and use those points I just removed, towards better body armor. Or maybe I keep dying because archers keep shooting my feet while I'm on a horse. I need to be able to sacrifice one piece of my gear in order to protect myself where I am vulnerable in that situation. This happens much more often than you would expect

4) The class system does not allow us to identify people we play with on a regular basis.
This is so much more important than you probably think, Taleworlds. When I get to know people, or when I play against them a lot... I tend to recognize their appearance and remember their fighting style. This adds a level of immersion that you don't see in other games. It's a sort of exciting feeling when you see someone you know on the enemy team based off of their appearance, cleaving through a bunch of your guys, knowing you're going to have to be next at some point.



I will add more if you guys mention anything else important. I'm just trying to summarize for feedback. Let the discussion begin.
 
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Ulfkarl

Regular
I agree, the class system would have been better if they add customization to the classes, for example, you can choose the class skirmisher, you get skirmisher stats to your character and the option to choose between a variety of armors and weapons of "skirmisher" style only, cavalry the same, you have high riding points and can choose different horses and armors, lances or spears, etc.

The current class system is an strong downgrade to the game and it is not fun.
 

VindictiV

Regular
This is what made cRPG great in warband. It was a multiplayer mod that was deep in character developpement but, in short, it allowed your character to equip any gear you wanted as long as your toon had the required stats (ie: 1h, 2h, polearm, shield/blocking, archery, horse riding, etc.) to use it and enough gold to buy it (you'd made gold from simply playing MP matches on said cRPG servers). At the end of each round, each piece of gear that you had when you spawned would have a chance to break and so you'd have to pay a % of it's value to repair/sustain it's usage (this was to control and make it harder for ppl to simply always equip the best gear possible every game). Other than that, you could litterally spawn as a trollninja, run with a ninja-esque cloth costume that offered no protection but you'd run fast as heck and you'd go around throwing garbage ninja stars at ppl lol. Not super effective but still totally up to you! You could build the bulkiest and strongest (but slowest) knight that would one or two-shot anybody with his mace and would be hard to take out. You could be agile and fast, and use a hit-and-run tactic with a character that would run fast, allowing you to flank and run away if needed but would not be able to sustain much damage. Strength archers that would hit hard but would take a longuer time between each shots. Agile archers using faster bows that would hit less hard. Pure archers that would be defenseless in melee. Hybrids that would be less accurate with a bow but would stand a chance if caught in a melee fight. Hoplites. Vikings. ETC ETC ETC.

The possibilities were endless.

A similar system is needed in MP bannerlord :smile:

Anyway, to answer OP, I totally agree. There's barely any customizations and being locked with certain gear/subclasses because we happen to be stuck playing a certain faction is not fun."Faction-locking" should be left in single player.
 

Kylbee

Recruit
This is what made cRPG great in warband. It was a multiplayer mod that was deep in character developpement but, in short, it allowed your character to equip any gear you wanted as long as your toon had the required stats (ie: 1h, 2h, polearm, shield/blocking, archery, horse riding, etc.) to use it and enough gold to buy it (you'd made gold from simply playing MP matches on said cRPG servers). At the end of each round, each piece of gear that you had when you spawned would have a chance to break and so you'd have to pay a % of it's value to repair/sustain it's usage (this was to control and make it harder for ppl to simply always equip the best gear possible every game). Other than that, you could litterally spawn as a trollninja, run with a ninja-esque cloth costume that offered no protection but you'd run fast as heck and you'd go around throwing garbage ninja stars at ppl lol. Not super effective but still totally up to you! You could build the bulkiest and strongest (but slowest) knight that would one or two-shot anybody with his mace and would be hard to take out. You could be agile and fast, and use a hit-and-run tactic with a character that would run fast, allowing you to flank and run away if needed but would not be able to sustain much damage. Strength archers that would hit hard but would take a longuer time between each shots. Agile archers using faster bows that would hit less hard. Pure archers that would be defenseless in melee. Hybrids that would be less accurate with a bow but would stand a chance if caught in a melee fight. Hoplites. Vikings. ETC ETC ETC.

The possibilities were endless.

A similar system is needed in MP bannerlord :smile:

Anyway, to answer OP, I totally agree. There's barely any customizations and being locked with certain gear/subclasses because we happen to be stuck playing a certain faction is not fun."Faction-locking" should be left in single player.
Well, I don't know if that's what I was trying to say. I'd rather cRPG be its own thing. Everyone should be on the same playing field at all times is what I'm saying. Even if you get everything upgraded, like heavy armor and the best sword/shield in the faction, you will still be able to get killed fairly quickly because people can afford a weapon with high damage if they sacrifice a piece of their gear.

Also, faction locking is fine for MP. I just want to be able to customize the gear within that faction. I think that's what most people are trying to get at.
 

Caps

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
you dont have any real problems? the class system is in theory still the same, you pick a class and then put armor and weapons on it. The just got rid of all the gimmick options.

dont think i heard a single person in the last 5 years complain about nw classes, which are litterly all the same.
 
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VindictiV

Regular
Well, I don't know if that's what I was trying to say. I'd rather cRPG be its own thing. Everyone should be on the same playing field at all times is what I'm saying. Even if you get everything upgraded, like heavy armor and the best sword/shield in the faction, you will still be able to get killed fairly quickly because people can afford a weapon with high damage if they sacrifice a piece of their gear.

Also, faction locking is fine for MP. I just want to be able to customize the gear within that faction. I think that's what most people are trying to get at.
My point was more toward the fact that customization is absent and that we are locked behind those sub-classes. Giving the players full choice (with say a gold limit when choosing gear) in gearing their character (something close to but much less complicated than cRPG) would be awesome.
 

Caps

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
My point was more toward the fact that customization is absent and that we are locked behind those sub-classes. Giving the players full choice (with say a gold limit when choosing gear) in gearing their character (something close to but much less complicated than cRPG) would be awesome.
idk if you are looking just for cosmetics or gameplay wise
 

Kylbee

Recruit
you dont have any real problems? the class system is in theory still the same, you pick a class and then put armor and weapons on it. The just got rid of all the gimmick options.

dont think i heard a single person in the last 5 years complain about nw classes, which are litterly all the same.
What? I can find 4 threads addressing it in the front page of the multiplayer thread you found this one in.
 
you dont have any real problems? the class system is in theory still the same, you pick a class and then put armor and weapons on it. The just got rid of all the gimmick options.

dont think i heard a single person in the last 5 years complain about nw classes, which are litterly all the same.

NW takes place in a historical setting in which soldiers had to abide by strict dress codes or they would be thrown in a cell. Normal m&b is entirely based in fiction and fantasy. The historical context of NW is the main draw for many players.
 

E V O C A T I

Sergeant at Arms
you dont have any real problems? the class system is in theory still the same, you pick a class and then put armor and weapons on it. The just got rid of all the gimmick options.

dont think i heard a single person in the last 5 years complain about nw classes, which are litterly all the same.

Not really fair to compare NW classes to Bannerlord's - NW's setting and gameplay style made it necessary for a class system. The standardized uniform and arms of the Napoleonic era had to be represented properly.
 

VindictiV

Regular
idk if you are looking just for cosmetics or gameplay wise
Both, actually. You could maybe say that I was spoiled with cRPG. But being stuck in choosing between a handful of "classes" when some factions clearly have better ones is bad by design, but also horrible because it removes customization from the players' hands.
 

Proton

Sergeant Knight
WBWF&SNWVC
There's practically zero reason for a class system in the first place. It also means 3/4 of the content is missing in multiplayer. The amount of armour and weapons available in the singleplayer, and yet I feel like im using the same weapon and armour on every faction in Multiplayer. It's honestly a complete joke.
 

Falrock

Recruit
I think they should let the class system be optional for server admins. Flick it on and off. Most everyone previously on Warband hates the current system.

I'd like to add that I would really like to be able to make multiple characters and names I can switch between too like in Warband. People would prefer to be able to change name if they want to remain anonymous from their steam tag and it will also be appreciated by people who want to RP on modded servers in the future. (PW)
 

Al_Mansur

Grandmaster Knight
WB
Sadly you're losing your time. During months, the devs just ignored the very constructive criticisms which were made against this horrendous class system. Btw it's far from being the only enormous flaw of the MP, so it's pretty clear that they took the decision to ruin the MP. Why? We'll probably never know.
 

Kylbee

Recruit
Sadly you're losing your time. During months, the devs just ignored the very constructive criticisms which were made against this horrendous class system. Btw it's far from being the only enormous flaw of the MP, so it's pretty clear that they took the decision to ruin the MP. Why? We'll probably never know.
These threads of mine will not stop until a developer or Callum acknowledges that they know people are not happy with MP, and steps are being taken to correct the mistakes.
 
I could accept the class system if they gave us more options in our load outs. You should be able to trade any weapon for any weapon. And give us similar choices in armour. While a legionary or the Khan's guard would have uniforms, most classes wouldn't. And yes, this would be for cosmetic reasons but it does look silly seeing berserkers or recruits all wearing identical outfits.
 

Scarf Ace

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVCM&B
1) You aren't letting us be stupid
I feel this is the most important reason why we don't like the classes... We can't run around naked with a dagger and throwin knives, and we can't show off our hideous character we spent customizing for the memes, because we are forced to wear a helmet.
I disagree in a sense, as the majority of possible loadouts are stupid. I think the issue far more is that they wanted to make choices for newbies easier, but the system has utterly failed at that. They fixed nothing, and took the fun out in the process.
 
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