There is nothing worse than being Khuzait and using this class point system

[JimmyCakes]

You've waited 10 minutes for a game to finally begin, you're hyped and excited, you get killed because of lag or your block was too slow even though you clicked in time and you die. Now the only role available is a Khuzait peasant. What do you do? I ALT+F4.

 

[Mabons]

And that's why I usually give my first few spawns over to the lowest class, especially when attacking, your just fodder pushing rams or towers until they are in place. Once one of those is achieved you get a massive gold boost and can play how you like for the rest of the game at that point.

Not saying it's fine or anything, just offering a work around.

 

[Bloc]

Well, there is also another side of this story. If you are playing against Khuzaits and they somehow manage to get on top with few kills - then the game turns into horselord in seconds. And since Khuzait high tier units are quite beefy, they cannot be killed easily as well.
In Warband, it was a miracle to see Khergits in a Siege server, but even in Warband, I feel like overall Khergits were more balanced than Khuzaits. Most likely because of the class system wasn't a thing in Warband.

 

[Mabons]

Well, there is also another side of this story. If you are playing against Khuzaits and they somehow manage to get on top with few kills - then the game turns into horselord in seconds. And since Khuzait high tier units are quite beefy, they cannot be killed easily as well.
In Warband, it was a miracle to see Khergits in a Siege server, but even in Warband, I feel like overall Khergits were more balanced than Khuzaits. Most likely because of the class system wasn't a thing in Warband.

I don't recall siege maps in warband being so accessable to cavalry as they are in bannerlord. They were usually too closed a space to play cav in, these maps have massive spaces and the cav is much more maneoverable with the double tap W/S thing. I dont think the class system is the culprit here when khergits had access to horses from the start anyways.

 

[Bloc]

I don't recall siege maps in warband being so accessable to cavalry as they are in bannerlord. They were usually too closed a space to play cav in, these maps have massive spaces and the cav is much more maneoverable with the double tap W/S thing. I dont think the class system is the culprit here when khergits had access to horses from the start anyways.

Yeah true but in Warband, you were able to choose your own equipment, so you could choose to go without horse and save that money for armor - in Bannerlord Khuaits don't have proper infantry.
But about this not being the only issue, you are certainly right. In Warband, your only chance to get into the castle with the horse was if someone already breached the side doors or lifted the main door from inside. Currently, you have the chance to go inside with sides by breaking the "wooden obstacles". Spawn point shifting is also a major issue, since, after the first breach, you can basically spawn in the inner circle with horse and charge. Because there is no secondary door or anything similar to stop you. And that creates the horseclusters. In Warband, they could be taken down by archers before reaching to keep even if the doors are down. But in BL they are literally spawning inside or super close.
Also in Warband, you had to go up to "keep" to open the main doors. In Bannerlord, you can just open it as if it's a normal door. I think this makes it more susceptible to misuse by the defender army. There are many people who open doors just because it's quite easy to open it.

I actually now realized why I don't like Bannerlord's Sieges. Because it always feels like in a Rush game mode in Battlefield rather than feeling in proper good old Warband Sieges. Yes, Warband sieges had a lot of weird bottlenecks, but this spawn shifting and poor functionality designs in Bannerlord make the game less enjoyable for me. And Bannerlord maps are not even that much big compared to Warband's. So I don't get this CTF logic in Siege. I hope when custom servers up, people will put only one flag, into middle and bring back the old siege feeling.

 

[Terco_Viejo]

[...]

I actually now realized why I don't like Bannerlord's Sieges. Because it always feels like in a Rush game mode in Battlefield rather than feeling in proper good old Warband Sieges. [...]

+5 In the same way I feel it

I know many of you will not agree with me; but I must say that cavalry in a siege mode is at least debatable...who on earth would bring a horse to one?
Personally I would exclude that option, but of course... it clashes with the system of premade classes...

 

[hoonii]

I never got to use peasant class 3 or 4 times during a siege or tdm. The kill award it gives you as peasant is really high and if you manage to kill only 2 guys as peasant you'll never return to it again, if you don't keep rushing groups of enemies and die that is.

 

[Younes]

I never got to use peasant class 3 or 4 times during a siege or tdm. The kill award it gives you as peasant is really high and if you manage to kill only 2 guys as peasant you'll never return to it again, if you don't keep rushing groups of enemies and die that is.

-> Implying getting shot by archers is not a thing

 

[hoonii]

-> Implying getting shot by archers is not a thing

I mean just stick with the group, besides %95 of the archers in tdm suck, with a little bit of a-d'ing you can avoid them pretty easily lol. I'm implying killing as peasant class is really rewarding. There have been times I killed 3 people and did a few assists and got 300 gold and never returned to peasant lol.

 

[Younes]

I mean just stick with the group, besides %95 of the archers in tdm suck, with a little bit of a-d'ing you can avoid them pretty easily lol. I'm implying killing as peasant class is really rewarding. There have been times I killed 3 people and did a few assists and got 300 gold and never returned to peasant lol.

Must really suck to have that much gold and nothing to spend it on.

The ingenious class system

 

[Clausewitz123]

Must really suck to have that much gold and nothing to spend it on.

?

 

[Kripaz]

I never got to use peasant class 3 or 4 times during a siege or tdm. The kill award it gives you as peasant is really high and if you manage to kill only 2 guys as peasant you'll never return to it again, if you don't keep rushing groups of enemies and die that is.

Must really suck to have that much gold and nothing to spend it on.

The ingenious class system

That's actually a big problem in tdm and siege. Usually halfway through the match you are just rolling in gold and you can just keep snowballing without caring about class costs.

If only i could take all that gold and gamble all of that on one spawn.

 

[hoonii]

That's actually a big problem in tdm and siege. Usually halfway through the match you are just rolling in gold and you can just keep snowballing without caring about class costs.

If only i could take all that gold and gamble all of that on one spawn.

Considering nobody plays khuzait you will be heavily outnumbered and only 1 kill will get you 200 gold or something. Even if you spawn glaive cav constantly you'll never run out of gold lmao

 

[AxiosXiphos]

Yeah true but in Warband, you were able to choose your own equipment, so you could choose to go without horse and save that money for armor - in Bannerlord Khuaits don't have proper infantry.

Horsemen have considerably worse stats (Power Strike, Athletics, Iron skin) then infantry - if you were playing a lancer, or men-at-arms etc without a horse you were significantly gimping yourself before you even got started.

 

[Bloc]

Horsemen has considerably worse stats then infantry - if you were playing a lancer, or men-at-arms etc without a horse you were significantly gimping yourself before you even got started.

Wrong. Infantry is faster on foot, that's the only advantage, about nearly all of the rest, Lancer is better.
Stats of Khergit Infantry

Stats of Khergit Lancer

 

[AxiosXiphos]

Wrong. Infantry is faster on foot, that's the only advantage, about nearly all of the rest, Lancer is better.
Stats of Khergit Infantry

Stats of Khergit Lancer

I thought the Khergit foot class was a 'Dismounted Lancer'? Been a long time.

Anyway if true that is a surprise; but Khergit are the exception that proves the rule.

It's very possible I am wrong; because apart from NeoGK when did anyone actually play Khergits?

 

[Bloc]

I thought the Khergit foot class was a 'Dismounted Lancer'? Been a long time.

I took the data from here https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Multiplayer_classes and https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Khergit_Infantry I don't play Warband anymore so I cannot confırm

exception

Not quite. Vaegir Horseman stats

Vaegir Spearman

Same goes more or less for Sarranids as well https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Sarranid_Mamluke_(multiplayer) https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Sarranid_Footman_(multiplayer)

So I don't think there is a conclusion you can draw from this. Warband units are tuned fine for its own game modes. And in Bannerlord, class system + rush mechanics and stuff simply makes game unpleasant compared to WB ( at least for me )

 

[AxiosXiphos]

I took the data from here https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Multiplayer_classes and https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Khergit_Infantry I don't play Warband anymore so I cannot confırm


Not quite. Vaegir Horseman stats

Vaegir Spearman

Same goes more or less for Sarranids as well https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Sarranid_Mamluke_(multiplayer) https://mountandblade.fandom.com/wiki/Sarranid_Footman_(multiplayer)

So I don't think there is a conclusion you can draw from this. Warband units are tuned fine for its own game modes. And in Bannerlord, class system + rush mechanics and stuff simply makes game unpleasant compared to WB ( at least for me )

Well the spearmen here is much better; Atheltics 6 vs 0; that's sprinting to walking.

Regardless it's a pretty mute point - I was wrong about the Khergits and I haven't played Warband in years now.

I'm not gonna argue about the class system - that's the past.

Personally I do actually like the siege Rush mode; but when we get custom servers you will get servers with just the final capture point too. If anything it just gives map makers options on how they design their maps. So I agree with TW on this. Besides to the end of Warband NeoGK siege was using a capture point based system already.

 

[Bloc]

Well the spearmen here is much better; Atheltics 6 vs 0; that's sprinting to walking.

Yes but better in terms of what? Not fighting skills. Only moving speed. Perhaps this was like how you described in mids of game or at the beginning and perhaps they tuned their skills later on. It's also possible.

Personally, I do actually like the siege Rush mode; but when we get custom servers you will get servers with just the final capture point too. If anything it just gives map makers options on how they design their maps. So I agree with TW on this. Besides to the end of Warband NeoGK siege was using a capture point-based system already.

Never played NeoGK and to be honest, I don't care it either since it's not Native and mods are out of my scope in this discussion. I don't think rush logic should be in-game as the only option for Siege Game Mode in Native. I would suggest having old sieges in native as TW maps as well. Then players can tweak around whatever they want to do. Custom maps were never as popular as native TW maps in my opinion, and that's why I would choose to have Vanilla Siege system as official map. This is my opinion ofc, you can disagree, no hard feelings.

 

[Younes]

Well the spearmen here is much better; Atheltics 6 vs 0; that's sprinting to walking.

Regardless it's a pretty mute point - I was wrong about the Khergits and I haven't played Warband in years now.

I'm not gonna argue about the class system - that's the past.

Personally I do actually like the siege Rush mode; but when we get custom servers you will get servers with just the final capture point too. If anything it just gives map makers options on how they design their maps. So I agree with TW on this. Besides to the end of Warband NeoGK siege was using a capture point based system already.

NeoGK point system made sense on maps designed around it. Such as minas where it would be a pain to go all the way up everytime.

A mix of both point system and non system is completely viable.