The Untapped Potential of the Notables system

[HalfMetalJacket]

Made this suggestion a while ago and its been about two years. Its not getting traction though, so I'm going to try revive it here.

I think TW has something very interesting going on with the notables system... and yet they don't quite realise the actual potential of it.

You want to keep a uniform army but your fief comes from another culture? You want to get rid of notables that hate your guts? Or maybe you just want a little more control of the types of people taking up those slots?

As a conquering player, we should have the ability to get rid of undesirable notables and then replace them with a notable from your kingdom's culture. That way, you can have your Vlandian knights in Aserai territory. In my mind, this is a more realistic and interesting way of allowing players to maintain a culturally uniform army without unrealistically changing a settlement's culture. Its also one that works within the game's systems, considering notables die all the time.

Apart from ageing troops or enterprising traders, maybe we could also have the ability to install one of our companions as a notable. Or even bring in a notable from a minor faction, to provide a source of troops from that minor faction.

And since you have those gang quests too, why not extend it to these? Make quests about migrating notables trying to fit into their unfamiliar surroundings, or resolve disputes between native notables and the new arrivals. This makes the world feel that much more lived in and truer to life. All while utilising a system that's in place, as opposed to just making something out of thin air.

Thoughts on this?

 

[niekdegrijze]

Excellent idea, i like the idea playing with an uniform army.

The beauty of this suggestion is that it combines a culture change(partly) with a way to bring the opaque notable system more to the forefront.
Like the addition of including notables from minor factions.

I hope this will be included in the base game. But any mod that adds this system would be an instant download.

 

[five bucks]

Made this suggestion a while ago and its been about two years. Its not getting traction though, so I'm going to try revive it here.

I think TW has something very interesting going on with the notables system... and yet they don't quite realise the actual potential of it.

You want to keep a uniform army but your fief comes from another culture? You want to get rid of notables that hate your guts? Or maybe you just want a little more control of the types of people taking up those slots?

As a conquering player, we should have the ability to get rid of undesirable notables and then replace them with a notable from your kingdom's culture. That way, you can have your Vlandian knights in Aserai territory. In my mind, this is a more realistic and interesting way of allowing players to maintain a culturally uniform army without unrealistically changing a settlement's culture. Its also one that works within the game's systems, considering notables die all the time.

Apart from ageing troops or enterprising traders, maybe we could also have the ability to install one of our companions as a notable. Or even bring in a notable from a minor faction, to provide a source of troops from that minor faction.

And since you have those gang quests too, why not extend it to these? Make quests about migrating notables trying to fit into their unfamiliar surroundings, or resolve disputes between native notables and the new arrivals. This makes the world feel that much more lived in and truer to life. All while utilising a system that's in place, as opposed to just making something out of thin air.

Thoughts on this?

I like this but think it would need to be balanced somehow.

So for starters you would need to own the town/village, as you said. Perhaps you could choose to buy out an existing notable (costs as much as buying a workshop) in order to install someone who likes you there; or, you could remove an existing notable by force, seize their assets and give them to your new guy, which would cause a loyalty and security drop in the town, and give you negative trait gain.

In gratitude for being made a notable, the new guy you install should have, say, 30 relations with you.

 

[ziomek24]

Jest fajny mod, który można dostosować. Polecam.

Changing Culture

- Change the culture of kingdom, clan or settlement from time to time when requirement met.

www.nexusmods.com

 

[HalfMetalJacket]

I like this but think it would need to be balanced somehow.

So for starters you would need to own the town/village, as you said. Perhaps you could choose to buy out an existing notable (costs as much as buying a workshop) in order to install someone who likes you there; or, you could remove an existing notable by force, seize their assets and give them to your new guy, which would cause a loyalty and security drop in the town, and give you negative trait gain.

In gratitude for being made a notable, the new guy you install should have, say, 30 relations with you.

I think the balance would just be a hit to your reputation in the settlement. After all, I imagine taking over a Minnesotan town and installing a Canadian mayor is going to be met with some dislike from everyone else.

That, and some significant public unrest would help. And again, maybe trying to help the new notables in quests result in penalties to your reputation too.

Jest fajny mod, który można dostosować. Polecam.

Changing Culture

- Change the culture of kingdom, clan or settlement from time to time when requirement met.

www.nexusmods.com

I know these mods exist, but I wanted something that actually expands on in game mechanics in an interesting way.

 

[Captain Obvious]

I think this is a really nice idea, which I've advocated for a while, really. I believe TW in part has dismissed this, though.

I think a good compromise for this to work is instead of just kicking out the notables and replacing them with your own and just getting a "uniformed army", instead have a system where you have like an "overseer" which is a notable who is from your own culture you send to the village. He would then handle the recruitment side of things, where you could even manage the relationships between the existing notables (and perhaps if their relationship/your actions get low enough it could cause village uprisings/sabotage and these would continue until you've owned the fief until x time). Using this system then helps to keep the "culture" different, but the uniform is the same. I think seeing how the roman army recruited from the far-reaching lands is a good idea to see here, so you could see Aserai people in vlandian gear. Lemmie know what you think

 

[ziomek24]

I think this is a really nice idea, which I've advocated for a while, really. I believe TW in part has dismissed this, though.

I think a good compromise for this to work is instead of just kicking out the notables and replacing them with your own and just getting a "uniformed army", instead have a system where you have like an "overseer" which is a notable who is from your own culture you send to the village. He would then handle the recruitment side of things, where you could even manage the relationships between the existing notables (and perhaps if their relationship/your actions get low enough it could cause village uprisings/sabotage and these would continue until you've owned the fief until x time). Using this system then helps to keep the "culture" different, but the uniform is the same. I think seeing how the roman army recruited from the far-reaching lands is a good idea to see here, so you could see Aserai people in vlandian gear. Lemmie know what you think

Good idea. Peasant uprisings could be suppressed in this way.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Good idea. Peasant uprisings could be suppressed in this way.

Doesn't need to be anywhere near as dramatic as it is for town rebellions, especially for a village. You could have it so if relations are poor enough, as an example, when trying to recruit you get the peasants charging at you!

 

[Terco_Viejo]

Definitely yes before and yes again now.

 

[Julio-Claudian]

I like that idea. Spend influence/money replacing notables, could have it affect loyalty. Maybe not headmen in villages because they represent local workers.

 

[Julio-Claudian]

I think this is a really nice idea, which I've advocated for a while, really. I believe TW in part has dismissed this, though.

I think a good compromise for this to work is instead of just kicking out the notables and replacing them with your own and just getting a "uniformed army", instead have a system where you have like an "overseer" which is a notable who is from your own culture you send to the village. He would then handle the recruitment side of things, where you could even manage the relationships between the existing notables (and perhaps if their relationship/your actions get low enough it could cause village uprisings/sabotage and these would continue until you've owned the fief until x time). Using this system then helps to keep the "culture" different, but the uniform is the same. I think seeing how the roman army recruited from the far-reaching lands is a good idea to see here, so you could see Aserai people in vlandian gear. Lemmie know what you think

Love that idea.

 

[KEYFEKEDER]

I really would fancy getting rid of notables by choice to be honest, preferably by execution. It never makes sense while you are the owner of a city and beat a gang leader but still can't kill him/her, it kills the whole immersion (as if we have any immersion to start with anyways)

 

[Karkus]

I like this a lot!

Perhaps different methods for removing the notables could be tied to different stat perks
Assassinate - Roguery (50) - cost gold to initiate - lose security & loyalty in castle town per day - lose honor/mercy - lose relationship with all other notables in settlement & castle/town- initiates an execution cutscene
Challenge to Duel - One-Handed/Two-Handed (100) - costs influence to initiate - lose loyalty in castle/town per day - lose honor - lose relationship with 1 notable in settlement - initiates a melee only duel
Hunting Accident - Bow/Crossbow (100) - costs influence to initiate - lose loyalty in castle/town per day - lose valor - lose relationship with 1 notable in settlement - initiates a ranged duel
Nepotism - Trade (150) - costs a good amount of gold to use - gold cost per day for new notable - lose prosperity in castle/town - lose generosity
Run Out Of Town - Leadership (150) - cost influence to initiate - lose security in castle/town - gain calculating - initiate small scale battle with supporters of the notable vs militia
Forced Retirement - Steward (250) - cost influence & gold to use - lose mercy

and if you flipped all the notables in a settlement the per day penalties would end

 

[Lord Grindelvald]

I like that idea. Spend influence/money replacing notables, could have it affect loyalty. Maybe not headmen in villages because they represent local workers.

Yeah. I was also thinking the Dev's we're looking for an influence pit since mid-to-late game the AI has so much influence that they just spawn armies non stop. Two birds, one stone.

I would also suggest tying the replacement of notables to a sort of in-scene quest. Give notables a character and give the player a reason to enter a town, castle or village scene.

 

[HalfMetalJacket]

I like this a lot!

Perhaps different methods for removing the notables could be tied to different stat perks
Assassinate - Roguery (50) - cost gold to initiate - lose security & loyalty in castle town per day - lose honor/mercy - lose relationship with all other notables in settlement & castle/town- initiates an execution cutscene
Challenge to Duel - One-Handed/Two-Handed (100) - costs influence to initiate - lose loyalty in castle/town per day - lose honor - lose relationship with 1 notable in settlement - initiates a melee only duel
Hunting Accident - Bow/Crossbow (100) - costs influence to initiate - lose loyalty in castle/town per day - lose valor - lose relationship with 1 notable in settlement - initiates a ranged duel
Nepotism - Trade (150) - costs a good amount of gold to use - gold cost per day for new notable - lose prosperity in castle/town - lose generosity
Run Out Of Town - Leadership (150) - cost influence to initiate - lose security in castle/town - gain calculating - initiate small scale battle with supporters of the notable vs militia
Forced Retirement - Steward (250) - cost influence & gold to use - lose mercy

and if you flipped all the notables in a settlement the per day penalties would end

Giving us more way to use those skills is definitely a great idea. That and things to affect traits.