The Turkish Army in Syria 2019
- 主题发起人 Looter31
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They can and are voting in the elections already? They are electing people to rule local municipalities. We are not in 1970s. There were incidents with local municipalities giving public resources to PKK here and there by the way.Antonis 说:Cioss Julius U.X. 说:
What the hell, dude? Shouldn't they be the ones to find out if they are capable of ruling or not? You know, by actually ruling themselves? Because that is a right they deserve.
Whoever wants to go their seperate ways are free to do so, but without land, obviously.
Turkey has been earned with blood and even if 79.999.999 people would want Turkey to be something else than Turkey, then those people are wrong, not welcome and free to leave. Really simple. I ain't giving anyone any land. If you stay, don't be a seperatist. Giving seperatist land is being a traitor and digging own grave.
TL;DR Don't want to be part of Turkey? Leave.
PPS: I am serious about the solar system claim.
Turkey has been earned with blood and even if 79.999.999 people would want Turkey to be something else than Turkey, then those people are wrong, not welcome and free to leave. Really simple. I ain't giving anyone any land. If you stay, don't be a seperatist. Giving seperatist land is being a traitor and digging own grave.
TL;DR Don't want to be part of Turkey? Leave.
PPS: I am serious about the solar system claim.
We don't vilify being Kurd as being a terrorist, rather terrorists try to justify their actions on being Kurd. Even thou they can represent their values on Turkey's political system with their own nationalistic party.Antonis 说:
Like hell, if i would be a Kurd in South East Anatolia to smuggle drugs and weapons, kill people which gets into my way of living which consist of taking "tax" from locals in area and not contributing to their well-being rather preferring personal gain and Western media support me because some gas and oil companies want to get some share on that part of the World; what a good way for living ain't it? It's not about being Kurd, it's about being a terrorist.
pentagathus
Baron
I kind of imagine that for Turks the western public support of YPG(?) feels something like the support for the IRA from the US did during the troubles for us. Maybe not a great comparison but you're all welcome for my delightfully helpful insights.
pentagathus
Baron
Not the PKK, I meant the Syrian branch who have been actively fighting ISIS. I don't think the PKK are analogous to ISIS either, as ISIS are quite keen to shout very loudly about how barbaric they are - their international propaganda does not attempt to convince people that they don't use brutal violence but in fact tries to shock people with it. Whereas the PKK are not nearly so blatant about it (outside of Turkey I mean) much like the IRA(presumably) did not make a point of telling their American sympathisers all about how they often targeted civilians and suchlike. I think most westerners don't know much about the PKKs terrorist activities but we all know about ISIS
Isn't that funny actually? A 40 years of bloody history behind one and no one cares, other one is not even a decade old and it's a big deal. Well, yeah ISIS has direct connections to Al Qaeda and that's why it's the most evil organisation evil for the west but that's all thanks to United States for that anyway.Big Bad Pent 说:
I think there is an analogy here. U.S. creating a puppet terrorist organization in a foreign country for fighting Russians -and/or their proxies- in a proxy war and later losing the leash and puppet terrorists attack their ex-masters in the west, can be apply to both Afghanistan and Syria, Al Qaeda and ISIS. They literally ****ed up 2 countries for oil. Freedom and oil jokes are funny because they are real to the bones.
And here we go again, with oil:
Maybe there's value for both Americans & Syrians in protecting a natural, non-renewable resource which accounts for approximately a quarter of Syria's GDP and is a regular political talking point in the US. Maybe it's possible that some of us across the pond learned from what the Brits did to Iran's oil industry prior to the revolution, and understand now that wrecking a country's economy by hijacking a major source of revenue is a great way to create hostile sentiment and political radicals. Maybe this "America is in the Middle East to steal their oil" nonsense is getting as tiresome as some Turks saying there's an international Armenian conspiracy to defraud the Turkish government of reparations for a fabricated genocide.
But hey, if we want to talk about a real issue regarding oil in the Middle East, why were the Turkish port cities of Ceyhan and Dortyol major routes for Daesh's oil smuggling operations?
If you want an explanation for why ISIS is higher profile than PKK, realize that PKK is mostly just a domestic problem for Turkey while ISIS/Daesh was and still is active across multiple countries in the region and was (arguably still is) a major security threat to all of them.
But hey, if we want to talk about a real issue regarding oil in the Middle East, why were the Turkish port cities of Ceyhan and Dortyol major routes for Daesh's oil smuggling operations?
If you want an explanation for why ISIS is higher profile than PKK, realize that PKK is mostly just a domestic problem for Turkey while ISIS/Daesh was and still is active across multiple countries in the region and was (arguably still is) a major security threat to all of them.
NovaItamar
Recruit
ancalimon 说:
Many in the U.S. view the Kurds(we really don't think about the PKK) as our closest ally during the Iraq war. Hence why even much of Trump's base saw the withdrawal as a betrayal given the unstable local climate. We're not very educated on the history between Turkey and the PKK, so it's hard for us to draw the connections necessary to grasp Turkish actions against them. Is it really accurate to say the Kurdish paramilitaries that fought against ISIS in Syria, and those in Northern Iraq are all PKK?
Northern Iraq is KDP and Peshmerga. It fought against PKK in the nineties, and helped PKK to hold Kobane when Isis was sieging it a few years ago. Turkish army used to train and arm Peshmerga until a few years ago, maybe it still does. They’re dependent on Turkey for trading their oil and also infrastructure projects so we have good relations with North Iraqi regional government. But Turkey(along with the US) was against the referendum for the independence of Northern Iraq. KDP and Barzani were against Turkish invasion of Syria.
Those in Syria are prettt much the PKK. Same fighters, same ideology, same idol(Ocalan), same commanders, different region.
Those in Syria are prettt much the PKK. Same fighters, same ideology, same idol(Ocalan), same commanders, different region.
NovaItamar
Recruit
Calradianın Bilgesi 说:
Interesting, so it's fair to say the Kurds are divided ideologically between the regions? I'll not pretend to understand the different motivations.
Finde 说:
You're probably right, here's another update
This guy is just on point. It makes me feel weird. Where is the ****storm? Where is blaming Turks for genociding Kurds? Where is freedom fighter hyper brave Kurds who fought down the evil ISIS? He is is rational I may cry. He must be a Turkish secret service agent, working in the west to brainwash poor westerners. 
He is literally on point with my views. We were using this FSA guys but they are far from being an army or any kind of organised and civilised group of people. I personally despise them from the beginning. Now, just like I said before thanks to Turkish intervention, Assad is one big step closer to uniting his country and finishing the war. I think Turkey at that point, just stop supporting this puppets since they can hit anyone with any reason. Just like he said in the video, they can actually turn down on us.
I hope U.S. just totally get the heck out of Syria asap. With that, other foreign powers such as Russia and Turkey can also bail out finally.
He is literally on point with my views. We were using this FSA guys but they are far from being an army or any kind of organised and civilised group of people. I personally despise them from the beginning. Now, just like I said before thanks to Turkish intervention, Assad is one big step closer to uniting his country and finishing the war. I think Turkey at that point, just stop supporting this puppets since they can hit anyone with any reason. Just like he said in the video, they can actually turn down on us.
I hope U.S. just totally get the heck out of Syria asap. With that, other foreign powers such as Russia and Turkey can also bail out finally.
