The (special) Fifth Weapon Slot

Users who are viewing this thread

Epicurus

Recruit
Despite the title, I am not really advocating a fifth complete weapon slot. Four is just enough to allow creativity without allowing someone to have every weapon type they would ever want. For instance, my new character carries a bow, two quivers of arrows, and a greataxe. Don't I ever miss having a shield or lance? you bet I do, but I also feel that my choice to give those up is rewarded by my 54-arrow quiver. So leave the slots limit at four.

No, what I am suggesting is loosely based on something that was once mentioned by someone (sadly I don't recall whom) on the forums but did not have its own thread.

Here's the idea:
Players should have a 'backup' weapon which is simply always with them. It goes into a fifth slot which can only be used to carry backup weapons. A Backup weapon is one of those lousy weapons that you never see players use like the dagger, butchering knife, hatchet?, etc. - those weapons which read "Cannot be used to block"

The fifth slot essentially represents a very small item which is not an encumbrance and could be stored in a boot sheath or somewhere equally innocuous. Why is it valuable?

Well, In the case of archery-based characters the utility is obvious: An archer can now take a ranged weapon and three slots of ammo (or four, in the case of thrown weapons) and not have to worry about actually running completely out of offensive options. It is much better to carry a 'real' weapon, but people who really want to go that extra mile and take another quiver will have to fall back on vicious dagger fighting when their last arrow is spent. In the case of a cavalryman, one might carry a shield, lance, crossbow and bolts, but when dismounted and in melee have to rely on the trusty dagger or hatchet to stave off attackers.

This presents a balance issue: what about those (the vast majority) who carry and rely on a powerful melee weapon? If weapon durability or disarming are not implemented, backup weapons will not be very useful for them.

I then propose that a few special items be made for the slot., namely special thrown weapons/ammunitions. These are just like ordinary ammo or thrown weapons of the same type except that they only have about 1/4 (or less) ammunition capacity. Thus, a "backup" set of throwing axes has two axes. A "Backup" set of stones has four or five stones. A "backup" set of arrows has six arrows, etc. In this way, a melee-oriented character's inventory might be as follows: Bastard sword, Shield, lance, Military Hammer (for capture missions), and two throwing axes in case of emergencies.

Another use for backup weapons for melee specialists is that it might be used to carry a bludegoning weapon for slave capture, such as a small sap or billy-club. A sample inventory might be: Scimitar, shield, Crossbow, Bolts, and a sap.


Not only will this increase the flexibility of the equipment system to allow for more customization while strongly preserving the concept of specialization, but it will give those small and nasty weapons a chance to be seen in combat and even play an important role.
Furhtermore, it offers a realistic and practical alternative to swapping weapons at the baggage.
Implementation would, in my opinion, be relatively simple and very valuable and cool.


Replies to possible objections:

Objection: "Adding another weapon will mean it will get confusing to cycle through them all. "

Reply: A separate key could be assigned to each of the five slots. Alternatively, one key immediately pulls out the backup weapon, which does not appear in the normal cycle. If neither of these is implemented, simply do not carry such a weapon, or use it for ammunition.

Objection: "This will overpower ranged-combat characters by allowing them to stock up even more on ammo"

Reply: I disagree. A ranged fighter will often have to fall back on their melee weapon, and they typically spend most of their time blocking attacks with it. Losing that ability is a serious liability and is not worth extra arrows in the minds of many. Most archers can easily get away with loading their inventory with arrows by having a fast horse and a very good melee weapon in their baggage to swap with - this alternative lets them have some way to fight back, since there is no "unarmed combat".


Apologies about how long that post ran! As always, your comments and criticisms are invited.
 
Epicurus said:
A bit long though - ; )

I'll try to keep 'em shorter in future.

Can't be long enough ;-) really good suggestions there! Sure hope it gets implemented. Definately would add up to the diversity of gameplay.
 
Yes, I have wondered since the time I found this game about the possibility of using a "Cloak and dagger" technique. fighting hand to hand, drawing in close locking weapons, and then pulling a dagger out of your cloak and bringing about your opponents untimely end. :cry: :lol:
Great idea.
 
General_Specific said:
Yes, I have wondered since the time I found this game about the possibility of using a "Cloak and dagger" technique. fighting hand to hand, drawing in close locking weapons, and then pulling a dagger out of your cloak and bringing about your opponents untimely end.

I share your dream, but I don't think that this will ever be implemented - shed a tear for grappling dagger combat.
 
Good idea, imo. Requires additional item classification, but that's not necessarily a bad thing in the long run. :)
 
Not bad except the ranged backups are useless. What good are 2 throwing axes? If degrading weapon quality is implemented this would be awesome.
 
It works for a lancer getting stuck in melee without a normal melee weapon. For that i like it. I even like the idea of having a normal good weapon strapped in an extra slot, which in order to use, you would have to drop, say, your lance. You could designate before hand which you'd drop, or just have it as whichever you are currently carrying. I think this idea is mentioned in a topic about strapping weapons to horses?
 
Sounds good to me.

I would like that the back up weapon would be pulled out from a different key, rather than next/previous weapon, so I would not have to equip it if I didn't need it.
 
thats a good idea, but it should only be some kind of knife in that extra slot. arrows or trowing weapons wont be much value if you have 81 arrows or 24 jarids
 
I like the sound of this, but feel it should only be for weapons that say "Cannot be used to block" or possibly a wooden club to knock people out.  I don't think it makes sense to allow extra ammunition or throwing weapons in that slot.  But this would give the option of a archer character to use 3 slots for ammo and then still have a small knife as an emergency.  makes sense because most soldiers would probably have some type of emergency weapon and it makes some of these 'useless' weapons usable.
 
I like throwing weapons, but not arrows. 2 throwing knives are actually probably very useful since you can stun someone and then follow up with your main melee.
 
Good idea, but I also hope they leave out (or make it an option) weapon degradation. It would be annoying to have to go get a weapon every five hits. Like in Dead rising. Who heard of a sword or axe that broke after about five hits?
 
I think that around 42 hits would be good for a one handed sword geting sadomized by a berserker whit a 2 handed axe.
 
Im gonna be the negative guy on this one because I realy dont see the point for a feature like this.
Strapping weapons to horses makes much more sence.
 
Ilex said:
Sounds good to me.

I would like that the back up weapon would be pulled out from a different key, rather than next/previous weapon, so I would not have to equip it if I didn't need it.
I believe the last time this came up, the suggestion would be that the dagger slot would be your "unarmed" weapon.  IOW, the "sheath weapon" button would access it.

Usually, this discussion leads to a discussion of a "paper doll" inventory screen.

quixotecoyote said:
Not bad except the ranged backups are useless.  What good are 2 throwing axes?  If degrading weapon quality is implemented this would be awesome.
Actually, I've wanted the ability to give my troops all just one javelin or jarid for a long time now.  Basically, you throw it just as you're about to engage the enemy to soften them up a bit before the clash.  That way, my guys always get in the first shot, but they don't stand there waiting for a clearing in the melee because they have 3 jarid left instead of getting into the melee themselves.
 
Back
Top Bottom