The Original L'Aigle Thread, for the sake of history. Be ye warned.

[Almalexia]

In an era where human rights were unknown, the Turks were fantastic pioneers in the art of inflicting massive human suffering and death. Not saying that the rest of the world was good, look at the British massacres of protestors, the Russian revolution, the Hungarian revolution which the Russians put down, and many other incidents. However, the Ottomans were hardly innocent, in fact they were really really bad.

Well, hardly. This kind of stuff goes way back before the great revolutions of the 19th century. A great example is the 30 Years War, or the Conquest of Ireland, for the 17th Century. Or further back, the depredations of the Crusades.

I think when people look back on specific events in history, such as this one at Chios, or the Holocaust, we forget our rich human history of large scale massacres and genocide.

 

[Humlenerd]

In an era where human rights were unknown, the Turks were fantastic pioneers in the art of inflicting massive human suffering and death. Not saying that the rest of the world was good, look at the British massacres of protestors, the Russian revolution, the Hungarian revolution which the Russians put down, and many other incidents. However, the Ottomans were hardly innocent, in fact they were really really bad.

Well, hardly. This kind of stuff goes way back before the great revolutions of the 19th century. A great example is the 30 Years War, or the Conquest of Ireland, for the 17th Century. Or further back, the depredations of the Crusades.

I think when people look back on specific events in history, such as this one at Chios, or the Holocaust, we forget our rich human history of large scale massacres and genocide.

The difference between Turkish history and other people's history is that they(other people) accept what they've done. They don't try to hide it or write "altvernative history". I haven't met one Englishman who denies the massacre(and slave trade) of Irish people.

Denial makes it worse.

 

[pod455]

This makes me as sick as if you had defended the Holocaust.

How can someone defend something that never even ha----

User was banned for this post.

bad boy!

 

[Horas]

Good thing you banned the facist skum. This happens much too rarely in the www...

 

[Landgraft]

And this, dear children, is why you should never discuss history when in South-East Europe. Everyone's an expert who has been horrifically wronged by circumstance.

USER WAS BANISHED TO THE MOON FOR 1,000 YEARS FOR THIS POST

 

[pod455]

User was banned for no reason at all

 

[William S. Donovan]

User is not banned because he has nothing to do with it

 

[Agovic]

Docm30 , You have to call them armed soldiers not civillians , the turkish side was the innocent side , if you kill someone with "no reason" you will automaticly become the killer guy
greeks,    they rised against the empire , like all rebellions, and the Ottoman empire send their soldiers to take control of the city , like all empires , everyone in the world call that "defence"
İf someone got his weapon and kill innocents under the "rebellion" title , That mans death become a "deserved" death on his killers mind

This guy ( now going into politics of his " innocent & great country" ) has a sword with two blades, as we'd like to say in MNE. Basically, what he tells that the Turks crushing the rebellions of Serbs, Bosnians, Greeks and whatnot wasn't bad and they call the rebels in Syria, Libya [...etc...] the good guys while those who crush the rebellions "lords killing their own people"......

This is stupid.... It's exactly the opposite.

Anyways, I don't want a flame war here [AGAIN!.....], what I want is some screenies etc.

 

[Leifr Eiríksson]

In an era where human rights were unknown, the Turks were fantastic pioneers in the art of inflicting massive human suffering and death. Not saying that the rest of the world was good, look at the British massacres of protestors, the Russian revolution, the Hungarian revolution which the Russians put down, and many other incidents. However, the Ottomans were hardly innocent, in fact they were really really bad.

Well, hardly. This kind of stuff goes way back before the great revolutions of the 19th century. A great example is the 30 Years War, or the Conquest of Ireland, for the 17th Century. Or further back, the depredations of the Crusades.

I think when people look back on specific events in history, such as this one at Chios, or the Holocaust, we forget our rich human history of large scale massacres and genocide.

The difference between Turkish history and other people's history is that they(other people) accept what they've done. They don't try to hide it or write "altvernative history". I haven't met one Englishman who denies the massacre(and slave trade) of Irish people.

Denial makes it worse.

Unfortunately, the average English education will not detail Ireland and it's backlog of massacres at the bloody-hand of England. The closest we came was a very brief (literally, a couple of minutes) overview of the Siege of Drogheda and it's relevance within the English Civil War, as opposed to any possible ramification upon the Irish population. Nor are we taught of the Irish Confederate Wars, or typically of any English involvement with Ireland beyond the framework. Ignorance is as damaging as denial. Part of me suspects that this dark period is skipped over in English educationn due to continual ongoing problems in Ireland.
This is unless of course the National Curriculum has changed in the past eight years since I left formal education.

(Sorry Doc, I had to reply to this post. I'll leave the thread in peace!)

 

[EsoptrosOer]

I wasn't saying that but rather having greek style/named/dressed troops in the Ottoman Empire and possibly having the isle of greece?
That way I'd be able to hire greek soldiers and rebel against the ottoman empire!!!

Ah yes of course he will make greece uniforms for satisfied a racist-looking greek guy , oh come on , I think we both know the answer of this question

I am not Greek.    I am American that just happens to Love anything Greek!!  And the Greeks did rebel against the Ottoman Empire, claiming independence from them in 1821. 

But I wasn't trying to start anything.  I was just asking if there would be any Greek troops in the Ottoman Empire faction in this mod. .. -.-

 

[Scrat555]

Look. Pretty much every nationality has committed horrid atrocities at some point in their history. This doesn't mean that the descendants of these nations are bad, and would do the same things, or even most of the citizens of said nation when the atrocities occurred.  I'm sure Block wouldn't run into Greece or Armenia and start shooting a bunch of people because he's a Turk. That being said, he was taught a load of bullcrap history, and he should educate himself on what actually happened and keep an open mind. Even us Jews, a historically abused people ourselves, have committed atrocities (some of them ongoing in Palestine. That stupid racist conservative Israeli government). We shouldn't put the blame on the general populace of a country, although some of them may be responsible. The government should receive the blame.

Now I'm going to go and be peaceful. Listening to psychedelic 60's music will do that to ya. 

 

[Goker]

Look. Pretty much every nationality has committed horrid atrocities at some point in their history. This doesn't mean that the descendants of these nations are bad

I don't think anyone has claimed that the descendants were bad.

Anyways, might be a good idea to stop arguing about this.

 

[Ivan the Awesome]

Dude, you have an amazing title.... 

 

[Ililsa]

I recall doing Irish history for GCSE (even though my paper was on the American west) but it only really covered from the Easter Rising onwards.
I got a D, which I blame on not finishing Flashman and the Redskins before my exam. Bloody Custer, I can excuse him for underestimating the willingness of his enemy to fight, and leaving his support behind in a wish to have a glorious cavalry battle, but not for making his legacy a bunch of demanding questions on a paper.

Getting into the topic of how weapons will work though, I'd be glad to hear of how the bayonet vs horse issue is going to be balanced, I think Napoleonic Wars has it pretty good at the moment, but horses should really rear when attacked from the front by a bayonet, as it'll discourage attacking squares and other tight packed formations head on.

 

[TWking]

In an era where human rights were unknown, the Turks were fantastic pioneers in the art of inflicting massive human suffering and death. Not saying that the rest of the world was good, look at the British massacres of protestors, the Russian revolution, the Hungarian revolution which the Russians put down, and many other incidents. However, the Ottomans were hardly innocent, in fact they were really really bad.

Well, hardly. This kind of stuff goes way back before the great revolutions of the 19th century. A great example is the 30 Years War, or the Conquest of Ireland, for the 17th Century. Or further back, the depredations of the Crusades.

I think when people look back on specific events in history, such as this one at Chios, or the Holocaust, we forget our rich human history of large scale massacres and genocide.

The difference between Turkish history and other people's history is that they(other people) accept what they've done. They don't try to hide it or write "altvernative history". I haven't met one Englishman who denies the massacre(and slave trade) of Irish people.

Denial makes it worse.

Unfortunately, the average English education will not detail Ireland and it's backlog of massacres at the bloody-hand of England. The closest we came was a very brief (literally, a couple of minutes) overview of the Siege of Drogheda and it's relevance within the English Civil War, as opposed to any possible ramification upon the Irish population. Nor are we taught of the Irish Confederate Wars, or typically of any English involvement with Ireland beyond the framework. Ignorance is as damaging as denial. Part of me suspects that this dark period is skipped over in English educationn due to continual ongoing problems in Ireland.
This is unless of course the National Curriculum has changed in the past eight years since I left formal education.

(Sorry Doc, I had to reply to this post. I'll leave the thread in peace!)

hasn't changed
We didn't do the Napoleonic wars either.

 

[Ivan the Awesome]

I briefly covered napoleon and the french revolution in grade 11 social studies, its part of the Alberta Curriculum.

 

[ChrisTheThird]

--- there is not and probably never will be functioning artillery in singleplayer, unless some one comes up with a decent way to include it, which seems rather unlikely.

I thought when it came to cannons you could add them into singleplayer and make them work like they do in multiplayer?

 

[pod455]

Napoleons army without cannons 

 

[Bloc]

You know you can **** off with that hateful, ignorant, stupid as hell revisionist history. Like all decent human beings, I have absolutely no patience for people that would defend the murder of thousands of unarmed civilians (the people of Chios hadn't even joined the damned rebellion. They certainly weren't armed). This makes me as sick as if you had defended the Holocaust.
Despicable.

You dont understand me , they were armed but of course not everyone armed in there, of course innocent lifes ended because of the armed militans.Like in everywhere! Just get that ,  im not saying its the right way but they(Side of the Ottoman Army) just used the "bloody way" for rebellions that like the all monachical states did.And if we can insult them because of that method(And i think we can) then i can easily say that the all nations are part of a "massacre of human kind" , i hope you understand what i mean

@Anyone who talking about bull****s like vicenzo

Hey guys ,try to use your little brains sometimes , what do you think? isnt that a good idea?
Look ,  Ottoman Empire was not a fair empire and of course they are not great , I dont want to load too much on your little brains but think that if Ottoman Empire were great that much why they werent still alive? ,  so rethink what are you talking about ,  again they killed many innocent and not-innocent people in their times like all Empires/Factions in the history
And for someones that thinks i need to educate myself , i always make researchs and think twice before i post something and i make my researchs from both side , turkish , english and  even sometimes german and italian pages and unlikely you guys i always check the trustworty of the Wikipedia page sources , so please shut the **** up


Docm30 , please ,lets get back on your topic

 

[kpetschulat]

...trustworty of the Wikipedia page sources...

Wikipedia is... BAD. Also, if you do what Vince said... you'd be surprised that Vince is correct.