The non-battling merchant

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Wanderer

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I'd like to see the merchant side of things in the lands expanded more. The ability to become one of the caravan leaders, with more emphasis on skills and gaining them through trade then battle, and possibly hiring defenders/interceptors, like we do for the other caravans.

A merchant basically cannot get better at his trade unless he goes out and beats people over the head. This seems silly. It's also counter productive to trade if you need to be an expert archer and spend a lot of time perfecting that.

There are two ways I could see this being modified.

1 ) Make it so you have to purchase the trader skills, like inventory management, trade, and so on. Make this price exorbinant so that you have to trade, and do it a LOT, to make the cash to be able to buy an upgrade, with exponential increments (say between ^1.4 to ^1.7). However, it shouldn't be level based, or if it is, you should only be able to raise charisma or intelligence on a 'purchased' level. I believe it should still be restricted to your base attributes, but I'm not entirely sure how to deal with this, without the 'purchase level' option, and only 'purchase' skills can be upgraded with the skill point if you take the INT one (the base skill point on a purchased level would not be available).

2 ) Allow for trade skills to be increased the same way your battle skills increase, on usage. It would require them being modified out of the existing skill tree for this though.

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Another thing I'd like to see that's previously discussed, but without mechanics, is either purchasing or building your own shop/goods creation.

Example. Tihr produces Dried Fish. For a price of say 1000x base price of the good, I can buy myself a fishing boat there. Once I've done that, I buy the goods from my own boat (purchasing it to pay for maintenance fees and the like) at 50% base price for the town.

These shops would produce 1 40lbs item a day (or perhaps some variant depending on the material, like velvet, might take longer). The more boats/mills I purchase, the faster I can create goods to take and sell. This will allow the avoidance of relying on the merchant to get their limited goods together, and I can load up on some rediculous amount of goods while I'm at my stores.

This wouldn't break the trade routes or balance of the routes much, as you'd still be traveling the same general distances, but would add more variety into the game.

If you sold them to the merchant in the town they're in, you'll get a cheap rate anyway, because the town is flooded with the good, but someone has to supply the merchant, you could simply become a supplier, but you'd be better off transporting it elsewhere.

This would give the players more investment in a community, and goals to strive for.
 
Truthfully while it's a good idea, I don't care to be a merchant. The idea of building a buisness empire is not only silly and tedious, but impossible for the time period. M&B is about fighting. While you need a lot of money to do so, that is certainly one of the more tedious aspects of gameplay. Though it would be nice to see it become a skill so you wouldn't have to waste any points on it upon leveling.
 
I like those ideas! My character is a merchant/skirmisher (horse archer basically), and I am definitely not in combat 24/7. Id love to be a caravan leader...mine would be really fast with only me for protection. :lol: But Im sure the economic system will become more developed as more patches are released.
 
I think it's a fascinating idea, but what would be the point? You amass a huge fortune and...then what? It won't help you put together a larger force, because that's still dependent on your leadership skill. Maybe it would work a little better if you could make your heroes, like Borcha and Marnid, split off and lead their own war parties, who could follow you around. It'd be a pain in the ass having to put points into their leadership slot, but potentially, you could have 3 little armies accompanying your trade goods. But I suppose the only way that would REALLY work is if keeping troops were more expensive, or God forbid, you really DID have to pay for all their equipment. As is, I could afford that many troops just by looting corpses.
 
Saladin said:
Truthfully while it's a good idea, I don't care to be a merchant. The idea of building a buisness empire is not only silly and tedious, but impossible for the time period. M&B is about fighting. While you need a lot of money to do so, that is certainly one of the more tedious aspects of gameplay. Though it would be nice to see it become a skill so you wouldn't have to waste any points on it upon leveling.

But that's half the point. The 'war skills' wouldn't be affected by either plan. I don't find merchanting as tedious as you, that's apparent, but it'd give more depth to a simple 'combat' game.

Trade, historically, was EXTREMELY important, at least above the peasant level where you grew your own food and made your own clothes from cornstalks. M&B is primarly a combat game, yes. I'd like to see more to it than hack and slash. This isn't an overly cumbersome modification, but if you chose to pursue it, for some of us, it would be a quite enjoyable way to play the game.

Think of it this way... Instead of trying to find fights, my caravan would simply be trying to survive it. A different way to play, you don't have to do it, but it's an option.

As to a trade empire being impossible, I disagree. Most of the major merchant houses did in fact own entire guilds of shop types. They were usually located in a single city, however. In this case, it would be a case of 'oh, just blink' so that you could have places in multiple cities in a game.
 
I would like to see the two factions armies take an interest in securing their economic base.

How many times have you seen a warparty with 50+ men ride right by a smaller band of thieves attacking a merchant party? And then they have the balls to send out adventurers on quests to find the stuff they need. Come on aristocracy, secure your trade routes and you wont need us to go looking for your stuff. It's no wonder the rate of desertion is so high.

The other nationalist faction isnt their biggest problem, its the damned bandits and raiders. They should hunt them down and try to stop them if possible.

C.
 
GreenKnight said:
Very true. But of they do that, how are YOU going to rob carvans? Don't knock it, buddy. It's a living.

I guess I would do it the same way I do with any other party I choose to attack. I dont attack caravans, but if I did, I would be a damn sight more carefull not to do it where a party of troops might come along and ruin my raid.

If I were a caravan master, I would send riders out to seek assistance from any friendly troops that are within my sighting distance. It would be automatic and transparant. Just give the troops an affinity for attacking raiders engaging/persuing a caravan.

C.
 
Stonerbill said:
the game is called mount and blade. not sim-middle-ages 2000.
And because your word is law on the game, I'll just stop bothering to think of ways to increase the depth.

Be constructive or shaddup.
 
I really like most of the ideas. Trading should be a viable alternative to being a master of combat. If certain previously suggested elements were implemented, like towns being attackable and wars between nations and stuff, there would be a point to amassing a fortune. Heck, you could use your wealth to influence rulers, buy your own land, build your own empire...use your imagination. Granted, thats pushing things a bit too far, but you get the idea. Yes, i must bring up uncharted waters again. Being rich on that game was fun, and had a point, you could buy the world basically if you wanted...aside from the rival nations' home ports. Sit back and watch the great empire of spain struggle to produce a dingy a month and call it a battleship, now thats fun!!! Screw realism, give armagan a team of 50 people and lets make the greatest game of all time :grin:
 
[bulletproof] said:
It's unnecessary as the second poster said, particularly when this game boils down to combat.

Enough said.

Quite agreed, it is definately a combat game. You're also quite correct, it's unnecessary. So's running goods for merchants/lords to taverns/their households. I mean, that's not combat either, it's just travel. Mostly it's a way to get xp without combat in case you're gettin' yer arse handed to you.

Some folks are on a crusade to see full economic warfare in the game, which while nice and fun for me, I think is beyond the current engine design. I'm not trying to suggest a radical game change here.

My proposals are a small influence on the game that can give some extra meaning to the trade concept that's currently been thought out. I mean, c'mon, how many of you really build up 'trade' to the point that you care if it's xp or cash? Personally I figure most combatants would prefer to see something purchaseable so they can sink skill points from combat into combat skills.

I'd just like to see this aspect of the game enhanced some beyond the simple basics that were included. Enough thought went into it that it could be expanded with minor mods to be much more robust, and to the address the point that most are arguing that it's a combat game DAMMIT!!!!!!, without affecting the main role of the game. It's like a side quest. It doesn't need to mess with your game, it'd just be fun for some of us to have the option.

EDIT: Thanks for being a little more constructive then earlier people who simply reminded me of the game's name, which I had apparently forgotten somehow. At least you gave a reason.
 
How about replacing the inventory management skill with having each horse you own increase the amount of goods you can carry. A pack horse could perhaps also add more inventory slots than your armoured charger would, so different horses would be good for different purposes.
 
Rogge said:
How about replacing the inventory management skill with having each horse you own increase the amount of goods you can carry. A pack horse could perhaps also add more inventory slots than your armoured charger would, so different horses would be good for different purposes.

Droool, I like that. :smile:
 
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