The length of the pikes in singleplayer should absolutely be longer

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Totalgarbage

Regular
WBWF&SVC
Pikes just aren't that effective against cavalry right now, which is a feat considering how wonky the cav AI (or more accurately all AI decision making in regards to melee weapon length and footwork) has been since 1.8.0. Of course, the current AI issues also affect the infantry when they brace, but assuming that the AI will be fixed, the pikes need to be longer than 300 length to be effective against heavy cav.

Another issue that needs fixing is units like the vlandian sergeant and battanian oathsworn which have braceable spears failing to brace when they also wield a shield. Either make them put their shield on their back, or make spears braceable with a shield. Interestingly, I have seen dismounted cataphracts putting their shield on back to spear brace against me when I was mounted. I'm 99% sure that the reason for this was their spear being 2 handed only, so there is an easy solution of making the braceable spears in loadouts 2 handed only.
 

Totalgarbage

Regular
WBWF&SVC
If the AI remains the way it is now, you're 100% right. I'm talking when they (hopefully) fix the AI bug in judging distances, they should lengthen the pikes to at least 3m and make all braceable spears 2 handed (or fix their use with shields) so that pikemen have an actual battlefield advantage over heavy cav.
 

Brano

Sergeant
It also require proper pikemen troop branch having them available from tier 2 /after recruit. So you can form such dedicated formation early on.
 

Totalgarbage

Regular
WBWF&SVC
Meh, I agree that the pikemen troop line should be more accesible but them being more specialised means that they are inherently weaker against other comps (in the pikemen's case, its everything not melee cav). I think the current pikemen with its current loadout(s) (except with longer pikes) should be made T4 and a new armoured pikemen for t5 should be added to the game equipped with good armor and helmet, the better versions of the newly added vlandian pauldrons and a shield + mace. TW should outright remove the braceable spear from the sergeants so that the pikemen won't be so heavily overshadowed by a unit that can do even more than everything they can do but better.
 

Brano

Sergeant
For spearmen/pikemen it is important that at least second row overlaps first one with their sticks so they can hit also units who manage to bypass first row of sticks => to cover hit/distance area from hug-loving enemy as much as possible. Without this, any discussion about lenght of sticks is futile.
 

Totalgarbage

Regular
WBWF&SVC
For spearmen/pikemen it is important that at least second row overlaps first one with their sticks so they can hit also units who manage to bypass first row of sticks => to cover hit/distance area from hug-loving enemy as much as possible. Without this, any discussion about lenght of sticks is futile.
Yes you're right, I forgot that pikemen don't do that automatically. Ideally, it will be 3 lines of pikes fighting horsemen that are actually competent in landing hits.
 

czarny

Veteran
I don't think TW will fix spears nor add pikemen. You just need few things:
1. My Little Warband mod - make your own troop tree, give them weapon named PIKE (299 length or more i don't remember)
2. Spear rework mod - no additional dmg version, spear toops work great in formation even without dmg boost, dmg isn't spears biggest issue
3. RBM AI - fix retarded AI
4. Bannerlord 1.7.2 - TW somehow broke battle AI in 1.8.0 and never mentioned about AI changes in patch notes...
 

Totalgarbage

Regular
WBWF&SVC
I'm not sure if TW will fix spears but they at least have the intention of AI distance calc in melee according to what duh wrote. Anyways, a game will almost always be better with mods than without, but we still should at least tell the devs what and how they should fix. It would be great tho if they actually applied spear rework for all stabbing weapons in vanilla.
 

czarny

Veteran
We already suggested it many times.Same with implementing RBM AI. You are last one who keep posting suggestions which will be ignored or refused at TWVisonMeeting™
 

Totalgarbage

Regular
WBWF&SVC
Hey, never lose hope. You never know, someone at the office may accidentally fix spears by sneezing on the keyboard while they were working on the code.
 
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