The Legions! 0.4 RELEASED

[sparto]

be nice to see some people with robes on    http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9421/bbvvrttewwpc0.jpg

 

[Lord_Kosmos]

Kosmos, it would definitely be nice to see some variety and accuracy in Legionary equipment, both Gallic and Italic helmets are known to have been made in iron, coppr alloy, bronze and brass, however won't all the Legionaries then have your bronze helmets? I'd simply prefer to stick to the current appearance, as every Legionary equipped with a bronze helmet might look somewhat odd, unless there's a way to randomly assign units different equipment?

No,no, it is an additional helmet not replacement. It only needs to be added to the troops.txt to make them wear either this or the other helmet at the same time randomly. It would look like in the picture, 2 legionaries, different gear.

be nice to see some people with robes on    http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9421/bbvvrttewwpc0.jpg

Yeah, would be nice to at least have some robes and togas for the townfolks. (I love those osprey illustrations )

 

[Nordmann]

In "Colonna Traiana"  you can see that those may not be iron armour!
It 's writting in the article

There are actually accurate accounts written by men of the era on equipment, weapons, clothing etc, and none have mentioned leather Segmentata. Trajan's Column has been used as reference material to corroborate written accounts, but should not the sole provider of evidence. It is also worth noting that the stonemasons often stereotyped depictions in order that the common man recognise the different protagonists in a battle or war, they also missed key details and often misrepresented certain equipment. Yet again, there is no evidence to support the existence of such armour, nor does there appear to be any relative bonuses to it's use, since leather is obviously inferior to iron in terms of protection.

It is a myth, spread via the internet, and a particular obsession that appears to have no end. Why people are so obsessed with with leather Segmentata is beyond me, but it seems to be one of those novelties that some will go to any length to prove actually existed, when there is no evidence to support their claims. Obscure websites, movies and stonework that may or may not be accurate are not proof.

No,no, it is an additional helmet not replacement. It only needs to be added to the troops.txt to make them wear either this or the other helmet at the same time randomly. It would look like in the picture, 2 legionaries, different gear.

Thought so, just wasn't sure whether the game had this feature or not. Since it does, I applaud the use of various helmet types and look forward to seeing them in-game.

 

[Scaevolus]

I was trying my hand at modding a little with the MB python scripts, and I remember reading that all the NPC's pick their gear randomly from a list.

It would also be accurate to see Imperial legionaries using both the Lorica Hamatae and Lorica Segmentatae.
It is known that there was no obsolescence as we know it in ancient times, and although the Lorica Segmentata was the newstead armor design, many legionaries still employed the old Hamata.  "Recycle" would be a good description of this occurrence.

 

[ealabor]

I was trying my hand at modding a little with the MB python scripts, and I remember reading that all the NPC's pick their gear randomly from a list.

You can actually set it up for the NPC to either randomly select from a list of items, or guarantee their selection by limiting it.

It would also be accurate to see Imperial legionaries using both the Lorica Hamatae and Lorica Segmentatae.
It is known that there was no obsolescence as we know it in ancient times, and although the Lorica Segmentata was the newstead armor design, many legionaries still employed the old Hamata.  "Recycle" would be a good description of this occurrence.

This is correct.

In fact many of the Legionaries preferred the Hamata over Segmentata simply for its ease of maintenance and deployment. Just simply wearing Hamata was it's maintenance as the constanct friction with the rings keep them rust free.

 

[ealabor]

List of named characters for factions:

________
Dacians
________
1. King Zalmodegikos
2. Dizo
3. Oroles
4. Koson
5. Tarsa
6. Diales
7. Brasos
8. Tarsa
9. Rhemaxos
10.Zyraxes
11.Kallindrones

__________
Sarmatians
__________
1. High King Abeakos
2. Phidas
3. Alouthagos
4. Babai
5. Erakas
6. Rastbarog
7. Zanticos
8. Rump
9. Urgos
10.Thuskes
11.Beuca


__________
Tribes of Iberia
__________
1. High Chieftan Tantalos
2. Eburankus
3. Epaphos
4. Karaecius
5. Apanus
6. Laro
7. Kalamus
8. Lukinos
9. Tiokenes
10.Melmu
11.Atinos


________________
Ptolemaic Empire
_________________
1. King Philadelphos Ptolemaios
2. Meleagros Ptolemaios
3. Leontiskos Thraikikos
4. Eunostos Kypriakos
5. Alexadros Thraikikos
6. Lysimachus Ptolemaios
7. Eueregetes Ptolemaios
8. Arsinoe II
9. Appolonios
10.Demetrios
11.Lysandros Tanites


__________
Carthage
__________
1. Shophet Mago
2. Hamalcar
3. Hasdrabul
4. Bomilkar
5. Hanno
6. Gisgo
7. Carthalo
8. Himilcar
9. Aderbal
10.Bisaltes
11.Burrhus


___________
Seleucid Empire
_______________
1. King Antiochos Syriakos
2. Sarpedon Syriakos
3. Alexandros Syriakos
4. Andromachos Syriakos
5. Achaios Syriakos
6. Theodoros Syriakos
7. Attalos Pergamou Mysiakes
8. Apollonious
9. Demokrates
10.Nikomedes Arianos
11.Alexis
____________
Romans
____________
1. Consul Manius Curius Dentatus
2. Cornelius Blasio
3. Sergius Silus
4. Cornelius Scipio Asina
5. Lucius Cornelius Scipio
6. Caius Aurelius Cotta
7. Marcus Flavius Scipio
8. Postumius Megellus
9. Mamillius Vitulus
10.Gaius Duilius
11.Gaius Fabricius Luscinus


____________
Macedonians
____________
1. King Antigonos Argeades
2. Kalos Argeades
3. Krateros Argeades
4. Alkyones Argeades
5. Alexandros Argeades
6. Demetrios Argeades
7. Karpos Aiginios
8. Androkles Klerios
9. Neikon Byzantios
10.Sotades Oresteus
11.Kleon Sepieus


_____________
Gaul Federation
_____________
1. Magistrate Cocolitanos
2. Malac
3. Dennoros
4. Catamantaloedis
5. Tancogeistla
6. Cavarillos
7. Orgetoros
8. Vindex
9. Tyranos
10.Borvo
11.Mallis


___________
Tribes of Germania
__________________
1. Lord Heruwulfaz
2. Athawulfaz
3. Ansuhar Jaz
4. Hrabnaz
5. Wilagastiz
6. Harkilaz
7. Hagaradaz
8. Swartaz
9. Balthaz
10.Habukaz
11.Okaz

_______________
Hellenistic Cities
_________________
1. Hegemon Chremonides Attikos
2. Agathokles Rhodios
3. Areus Lakedaimonios
4. Hiero
5. Iphikrates
6. Helenos Aiakides
7. Akestes
8. Ennomos Korinthios
9. Aidesios
10.Diomedes
11.Megadates Delphos

 

[Lord_Kosmos]

This is correct.

In fact many of the Legionaries preferred the Hamata over Segmentata simply for its ease of maintenance and deployment. Just simply wearing Hamata was it's maintenance as the constanct friction with the rings keep them rust free.

Well then, I was going to mod the current hamata and segmentata armor mesh slightly, but after reinserting it into the brf file, the skeletal animation was missing from it. How can I readd them to the mesh ?

Besides those mesh changes I am also gonig to make some additional altered textures (some get wristbands some get a second belt either over the shoulder or around the waist, some shields are more used then the others etc...) With this I try to make the look of the units more diverse and not as uniform as they are now.

 

[ealabor]

This is correct.

In fact many of the Legionaries preferred the Hamata over Segmentata simply for its ease of maintenance and deployment. Just simply wearing Hamata was it's maintenance as the constanct friction with the rings keep them rust free.

Well then, I was going to mod the current hamata and segmentata armor mesh slightly, but after reinserting it into the brf file, the skeletal animation was missing from it. How can I readd them to the mesh ?

Besides those mesh changes I am also gonig to make some additional altered textures (some get wristbands some get a second belt either over the shoulder or around the waist, some shields are more used then the others etc...) With this I try to make the look of the units more diverse and not as uniform as they are now.

hmm it should really only be concerned with editing 3 things. texture, material, and meshes in that order.

Yoshi has an extensive walkthrough on the matter which should be helpful..

http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,6146.0.html

 

[Nordmann]

You can actually set it up for the NPC to either randomly select from a list of items, or guarantee their selection by limiting it.

We could actually have some variation in Legionary equipment, with both Hamata and Segmentata in use, not to mention different helmets; it is unlikely that the Legions would have been completely uniform, since equipment was commonly reissued rather than replaced. This could also be applied to other factions as well, since barbarians were definitely not uniform in appearance.

List of named characters for factions:

*Snip*

Looks good, a definite improvement on the current characters. Is this a final list or are their any adjustments etc to be made?

 

[ealabor]

Looks good, a definite improvement on the current characters. Is this a final list or are their any adjustments etc to be made?

Not unless someone has historical corrections to inject as far as character names for the set date 272 B.C.

 

[Legionary]

are there any would introduce leather lorica segmentata?sigh...Leather lorica segmentata existed

 

[Inukshuk]

It can't matter too much - this whole business about the leather lorica segmenta. We're not going to release this mod, and have all our fans going, "Why is there no leather lorica segmenta you morons?!?".

But anyway, I did a little test. I typed leather lorica segmenta into google images. I got loads of metal lorica segmentas, but no leather ones.

 

[Nordmann]

Legionary, have you actually read what we posted regarding this matter? Seriously! There is no evidence for the existence of leather Lorica Segmentata, only an Italian re-enactment group actually believe in it's existence and they are not taken seriously in the re-enacting world; anyone that bases their historical information on pure theories, rumours, movies, websites or otherwise is an idiot, period. You have not presented one shred of evidence to support your argument, if it can be called as such, simply saying "leather Lorica Segmentata existed" does not prove that it did. Present some evidence and we might reconsider, otherwise the point is mute.

 

[ealabor]

Did anyone play this mod when roman units had Pila?

if so, how did the AI behave?

 

[RayvenQ]

Did anyone play this mod when roman units had Pila?

if so, how did the AI behave?

They behaved alright, some had them, some didn't and those that had them did throw them before they drew their gladius and fought (But the accuracy of the Pila itself was horrendous)

 

[Scaevolus]

I've given myself a set of only 2 pila to throw before a battle.  I'm sure all of you know that you can turn your character over to the AI, and in so doing the computer will throw the pila first before drawing the gladius. 
Unfortunately the AI throws them right after the other with at most a 2 second pause, and most of the time at the same target...so sometimes the first pilum will kill the victim so that the second passes through the dead model.

 

[Spawn Of Achilles]

In response to all the 'historical facts' about the Segmentata... This mod was based on Rome:Total War, which means it is --from a historical point of view-- incredibly inaccurate.  Now, don't you think we should stick to that so we don't have to remake the ENTIRE mod just to make a historical attempt?  Personally I think the mod is awesome the way it is, and if it gets better then...WOW!  But again the mod is based on Rome:Total War, and please don't forget that. 

 

[SPQR]

Good to see everyone involved in some constructive cross-talk.  The mod is great and looks stronger than ever. 

 

[Eagle114th]

It can't matter too much - this whole business about the leather lorica segmenta. We're not going to release this mod, and have all our fans going, "Why is there no leather lorica segmenta you morons?!?".

But anyway, I did a little test. I typed leather lorica segmenta into google images. I got loads of metal lorica segmentas, but no leather ones.

To challenage myself, I decided to search for leather lorica segmenta just for fun and I found this:

http://www.nightshadeleather.com/images/IMG_1743.jpg



However, metal version of loria segmenta is more efficient and is far superior to leather loria segmenta in battle, in my opinion.  And I also have been learning new things about different versions of loria segmenta armour from this forum, where it is starting to get rather interesting to me!




Eagle out...

 

[RayvenQ]

Just because someone replicated the design of Segmentata in leather instead of metal is not really proof that it did exist or that it was used