Tell me

JulianKo

Lord_David said:
Didn't think there had been any default wins in this cycle yet.
There had been defaults. For instance (ARMY vs Wolfpack)

Saxnot said:
There is a admin mod? Can you spawn trolls with it?
Yes there is an admin mod, look here.

Guys if you are fooling around stop it. I think he is having a hard time organizing this tournament and stuff, and you are just messing about.

@Lust: The main problem for me is that when you add rosters to the squad you get confused, for instance I add a roster for 4 guys, then I add fith one and they are right next to each other and accidently copy the wrong ID
 

Teblar

Veteran
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Cpt Lust, you copied wrong id. Look on punisher's ID in reiko's post on 35th page.

Polish Eagles
Player Adding Request
PEr_ThePunisher ID: 145966
PE_Zwiadowca ID: 1031282
PEr_Suchy_suchar ID: 996587
PEr_Bastek ID: 113045
PEr_Thor ID: 739431
PE_Rycerz_Regulus ID: 94250
PEg_ArroW ID: 709085[/quote
 

Arch3r

Count
M&BWBNW
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captain lust said:
Tell me what's so hard about using the ENL Admin Mod to check your roster.

I don't understand, so someone will have to tell me.
If people weren't lazy, they would be organizing a tournament of this scale. But people are lazy, too lazy to organize a tournament and too lazy to verify them ID's.
 

Irishman.

Sergeant Knight
WBNW
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A drunken Flust appeared, creating a useless thread.

I'm a biggest fan of M&B. I'm forty-four years and I very respect all things, made professional. I think what work of Captain Lust done professionally and it's great. My opinion - future of captain Lust will be successful.
This tournament, against foolish and envious people, was a fantastic event for many people from different countries.
The basis and foundament  of this success is strict rules, constancy, endurance and more more.

P.S. Who can -  makes, who can not - babbles.
Good luck, Lust.

This message from Olonzo  (mentor of Inquisition)
Very sorry for my English  :???:
 
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Teblar said:
Cpt Lust, you copied wrong id. Look on punisher's ID in reiko's post on 35th page.

Polish Eagles
Player Adding Request
PEr_ThePunisher ID: 145966
PE_Zwiadowca ID: 1031282
PEr_Suchy_suchar ID: 996587
PEr_Bastek ID: 113045
PEr_Thor ID: 739431
PE_Rycerz_Regulus ID: 94250
PEg_ArroW ID: 709085
This is the second apology I've owed Teblar and PE, in as many days.

I put everything into making sure the roster system is water tight but a string of errors has managed to form this cycle. This is the first error of this sort that I've managed to make so far and clearly the most regrettable. Whilst it's slightly worrying that you didn't realise this yourselves, there are no excuses on my part. Your score will obviously be reverted.

I offer my humblest apologies for the inconvenience and sarcastic rage in this thread, that I falsely directed at your team.

Once again, I wish you the best for the rest of the cycle.



@Irishman (and Olonzo): Well yesterday was something of a dark day for the ENL but I've awoken with renewed optimism. On the whole, this cycle has been going very well and there have been a number of a successes. It's always great to know I've got support and I'm glad to know you're enjoying the ENL.

Congratulations on your early success in our Division and if our teams meet, I know it will be a thrilling and respectful affair.



Arch3r said:
If people weren't lazy, they would be organizing a tournament of this scale. But people are lazy, too lazy to organize a tournament and too lazy to verify them ID's.
Must be some middle ground between wasting all your time like me and not giving a **** like Modus...

Anyway, it seems the error was only from GH who have already been having problems with their roster and it remains a select few, rather than an eminent problem.

First post changed.
 

Maynd

Grandmaster Knight
WBWF&SNW
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Mr.Lust, what is this thread suposed to be now? Can we say what we think of the league untill now? give some opinions and so on?
 

Maynd

Grandmaster Knight
WBWF&SNW
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captain lust said:
Don't be ridiculous. I don't care about opinions.

Except nice ones
Having in mind the recent events, related to problems that do not allow to start the match's at the correct time, what is you view on this subject?
- Example: The match was suposed to start at 20:00, both clans are in the server with 10 players at 20:00, all condition are gathered to start the match, but the clan leader its missing, and they wait wait and wait, and one of the teams doesn't wanna start without their leader, while the other its starting to get pissed...by now its 20:30. What happens from here on? What should teams do? Is it correct to go for default win? is it correct to ask for a postponement? alternatives?
Having this clarified could help to prevent future issues on this subject.
 
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  • If a team cannot show out with 10 players, for a match, the other team should continue with 10 anyway. If however, a team cannot make 8 players or more, the other team will be offered a default win, provided they have shown up with at least 10 players. If neither team has shown up with 10 players, the match should be rescheduled. Teams should allow 15 minutes, after the scheduled match time, for players to arrive on the server, before any of these rulings are put into practice.
  • The above notions of shown players are defined by attendance on the agreed server alone. Players must be eligible, ready and willing to start the match.
That sentence at the end, stating the "Players must be eligible, ready and willing to start the match." covers that issue.

If a team isn't willing to play, when it gets to 15 minutes past the scheduled time then the other team is entitled to a default win.
 

ModusTollens

Baron
M&BWBWF&S
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captain lust said:
Arch3r said:
If people weren't lazy, they would be organizing a tournament of this scale. But people are lazy, too lazy to organize a tournament and too lazy to verify them ID's.
Must be some middle ground between wasting all your time like me and not giving a **** like Modus...
Don't be ridiculous, there's a difference between not giving a **** and not giving a **** about the causal relation between roster violations and the frame of mind of the participants in those rule trangressions.

Either they didn't understand the rules, are- as Arch3r said - too lazy or happen to suffer from dyscalculia. In neither of those cases a reaction other than in the line of "Yup, we messed up" is even conceivable (besides no reaction at all). Well, no reaction other than some artificial drama about the roster-rules, loopholes and related stuff, which you said - with good cause - you'll prevent from happening (again).

Anyway, since the purpose of the thread now seems to have taken a turn for the better, I'd like to ask what happened to the idea of appointing some - I think you called them - judges? Especially a Turkish-, a French- and a Russian-speaking one (I think there are already enough German-speaking ones to handle the case of "The Kingdom of England"  :grin:), who's able to explain some of the rules in the relevant languages and who may mediate in some cases by means of an at least decent (additional to the aforementioned languages) English, could be handy.

Furthermore I'd like to ask what's the reasoning behind choosing Fridays for the Div C-picking sessions? If I remember correctly you originally considered choosing Thursdays for those, which would make sense since Fridays seem to be one of the more popular match-dates (especially compared to the rest of the week, except the weekend of course) - I may be wrong there though.

Div C works better than I imagined at the time I saw the basic concept, Flust is the best for organising the ENL and so on
 
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But I was referring to your self-touted general "not giving a ****" attitude, rather than specifically suggesting you were being destructive...

As for the judges... yeah I need them really but I guess I'm having trouble deciding exactly how it ought to work. The problem with the ENL is that it isn't a faceless organisation, like the ESL or Gamebattles/MLG appear to many... everyone sort of knows everyone in the ENL. So when a decision goes against a team, teams are much more able to argue against it than in the other competitions and teams that feel they have been wronged are more likely to discredit the competition and leave, rather than brush off the dirt and keep going. Personally, I like that the ENL has this stronger check on power and I think it's necessary, especially since I compete in the tournament.

Though it does have its downsides...

Whilst I suspect that much more injustices take place in the larger tournament organisations, I also think they probably experience a lot less drama. This is partly down to the ENL being organised on a forum, where people inherently have the ability to give their input (larger organisations have dedicated web pages mainly showing facts like scores rules and results, often with official forums but a smaller percentage than "100" frequenting them). As has been shown, people giving their input isn't always a good thing and often just fuels the fires of conflict.

Introducing judges would need to be done in such a way that it has the benefit of limiting the drama by adding an extra layer to the decision making process, having the judges discuss and vote on decisions, rather than just me telling people how things will be resolved. By giving decisions more legitimacy it might help in situations where there's a deadlock. There is also the benefit of improving communication with communities and groups that are more separated from the scene in the English speaking forums, as you mentioned.

The pitfalls and things which need to be overcome, in my mind as follows:
[*]How these individuals are appointed - Currently this is the main problem, as I just don't know. I can come up with any number of suitable people but is it right that I just appoint people?
[*]Their powers - I'm quite clear that their power should be to enforce the existing rules whilst making rational decisions for situations where the rules don't quite fit. However, deciding where the rules don't quite fit could be something of a problem and deciding how that gets decided poses another.
[*]Their limits - Sort of the same as their powers but really it needs to be clear what exactly they can't do. The first thing is to go against the rules but it's also important that there's some sort of standardised process for how they operate, in order for it to stay consistent and practical. If every match teams get annoyed about something, they just refuse to play and demand that their "case" be taken to a binding vote with the official tournament judges, that's going to cause a real problem to the operation of the league.
But all this aside, I think I just need to get something in place and go from there.


As for the Division C picking day... I originally figured Friday would be the worst day for matches, which is why I picked it. I could be wrong there although there were no matches at all this past Friday. Either way, I think it's quite adequate and scheduling hasn't been much of a problem for Division C.

Infact both the Division C ladder format and scheduling system have been something of a success. As more teams begin to see the value in attending the picking sessions and making the right pick, I can imagine things will only improve.
 

Morii

Sergeant Knight
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