Team Grades

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Rhade

Master Knight
Thought it would be interesting, after all the talk we hear about "so and so team has x cav, y archers, z inf", to set up a centralized place where people can have a chance to give their opinions and maybe discuss them some, as discussion is the entire point of this board.

Example:

Team

Inf Score: A-F

Reasoning

Cav Score: A-F

Reasoning

Bow / Crossbow Score: A-F

Reasoning

Code here:


插入代码块:
[i][b]Team[/b][/i]

[u]Inf Score:[/u] A-F

Reasoning

[u]Cav Score:[/u] A-F

Reasoning 

[u]Bow / Crossbow Score:[/u] A-F

Reasoning

Really, I'd like to see every team included here. However, I know that's a big task for some of you and a lot of  you are allergic to anything that takes longer than ten seconds to do. So, it's really up to you how many teams you want to do, how you want to divide it, or if you want to do all of them. Feel free to do the top 4, the top 8, the bottom 2, or just the teams that you have the most experience playing against or watching. Obvious sarcastic responses will be crushed mercilessly under the flaming modhammer of justice.

In regards to how grading is standardized, in the context of this thread, I think it's best for discussion to keep it in the context of this tournament. The worst that you've seen in the tournament is going to recieve and F in that department, and the best that you've seen is an A.

For example, if I feel that GKR has the best infantry in the tournament, they clearly have an A. If I feel that TMW's infantry is the worst, they obviously are recieving an F. The other clans fall somewhere in between there, and I like using the grading system as opposed to the numbering system of #1, #2, #3 etc because a grading system only requires two linear boundaries, that being the best and the worst, and the others are allowed to have some overlap which is very good for these kind of rankings. Do not just hand out A's, B's and C's out of courtesy, as the point here is using the standards set by the worst and the best, where do the others fall and who are the standard setters the boundaries and why? What made clan Y edge clan Z for the best and why do they set the standard? What about clan A puts them at the bottom of the ranged heap, what needs to be done to correct it? This is supposed to be a respectfully done thread and discussion, but it's also pointless if people are using B as average, because it isn't:

A
B
C
D
F

To help clarify and give guidelines, but these aren't absolutes either:

A is the best. B is above average. is C is average. D is below average. F is the worst.
 
Will do one for KoA since this is something that all the KoA's need to do.
Keep in mind I lack a lot of experience, so this is what I observed. Due to lack of said experience, I probably will not be able to complete other clan team grades.
Kids of America

Inf Score: B-

Reasoning: As the season went on, I think our inf improved a lot. Brave is good at anything he plays really and stepped up when he was inf. When we got Manry, things really went forward with inf. Manry went from being sort of average and now he excels so many people. It's ridiculous how much he's improved. He really helped our inf game not only by improving himself, but he also taught me a lot of what he knows (Manry and I are really the only two players that consistently play inf for KoA for most maps, we have a lot of players that play multiple classes.)

Cav Score: C+

Reasoning: Man, from what I saw when I first joined, our cav was probably a D with Brave being the only experienced cav. We did practice Cav a lot in our practices and it did improve a lot, but not enough that we can rely on our cav skills enough to win us scrims. Instead, we try to be even or steal some rounds and make up for it with our stronger inf core. We do well with bump cav (mainly Brave) but on open plains is where we struggle. We need to improve our cohesion and make it so John does not have to micro manage us.

Bow / Crossbow Score: A+

Reasoning: John.
 
Neat idea. I'll just go by alphabetical order. Also keep in mind these grades (for me) are a reflection of each team at its best.

Inf Score: C

Reasoning - Of the top tier teams, Balion's inf is probably the weakest. They're not bad, but not great either. Kaiser and Max stand out among the rest.

Cav Score: A-

Reasoning - Between Scott, Ron Burgundy, Angus and Blak, Balion has a very solid cav roster. Arguably one of the most cohesive cav lineups in the tournament, especially on open maps.

Bow / Crossbow Score: B+

Reasoning - I'll name some more names with this one; Peasant, Zero, Unix, Max, Mad Dawg and Ron Burgundy are all great archers. Zero is for me who puts Balion's ranged at B+ rather than just B.
Inf Score: B

Reasoning - BkS has a solid inf core in Joe, Tyrian and Duke. Some of their other players tend to fall quickly in melee, but those three make up for it.

Cav Score: B+

Reasoning - Simultaneously defensive and offensive, BkS's cav is adaptive, quick and dangerous. Rhade and Vanidar are about as cohesive a cav pair there is.

Bow / Crossbow Score: B+

Reasoning - BkS often employs a sort of spray tactic with its ranged troops, playing with 3-5 depending on the map/situation. Not only that, but Fritigern, African and Harn as individual archers are all very dangerous. If peers were active and in his prime, this grade would probably be an A.
Inf Score: D

Reasoning - DoF's only real saving grace in the infantry department is Gandhi. For the most part, DoF's inf fall very quickly.

Cav Score: C+

Reasoning - Easily DoF's best class. Cav players like Alec, Erminas, William and Darin have pulled out some surprising wins before.

Bow / Crossbow Score: C

Reasoning - I admittedly don't know a whole lot about DoF's ranged game, but from what I've seen it's average. Kohath's not bad.
Inf Score: C+

Reasoning - GA has a very solid lineup of inf players; M, Cleric, Deacon, Wierdo, etc. I know this is a silly speculation, but if GA had NA ping this grade would probably be an A.

Cav Score: B

Reasoning - A few star cav players like Shema and Peter, but the cav cohesion never seemed to click for GA.

Bow / Crossbow Score: A-

Reasoning - GA's strategies often seemed to work around getting the team into an advantageous position for their ranged players. A GA crossfire is absolute devastating to most teams. LeRoux is great.
Inf Score: F

Reasoning - Unfortunately, due to the presence of so many new players, GKR's infantry lineup is paltry.

Cav Score: C

Reasoning - I know Hero beasted a few rounds for GKR. Without him on cav, the team would have lost many of its matches even more dramatically.

Bow / Crossbow Score: D

Reasoning - A few ex-ORA players kept GKR's ranged department at a somewhat competitive level, for the most part.
Inf Score: C

Reasoning - With Brave, Boogy and Fisherman, KoA's infantry isn't bad, but not enough to stand up to most of the top tier teams.

Cav Score: C

Reasoning - KoA doesn't have a whole lot going for it when it comes to cav. Some their players like Brave, John and Boogy aren't bad, but no one seems to specialize in the class.

Bow / Crossbow Score: B

Reasoning - John, Scope and Asheila are KoA's key ranged players, and they often make the difference for the team.
Inf Score: A

Reasoning - On a good day, between Mike, Oodle, Kherven, Unicorn and Volpel, TMW's infantry lineup could wreck any other. The addition of Mok presumably for UNAC Season 2 only makes this better for TMW.

Cav Score: C+

Reasoning - Blacktide is the only real cav specialist on the roster. Maynd does good work for TMW as well, but his ping is often an unfortunate factor.

Bow / Crossbow Score: B+

Reasoning - TMW's ranged players generally play quite well. Sota, Clock and Rurin stand out.
Inf Score: C

Reasoning - Without Mok, Rebels' inf crew wouldn't have been the same in this tournament.

Cav Score: C

Reasoning - Snoop, Templar and Crusader are all decent cav players, but they don't play together as cohesively as they probably could.

Bow / Crossbow Score: C+

Reasoning - With the addition of Rhadagast, and xls's consistent xbow play, Rebels have a decent ranged lineup.
Inf Score: C+

Reasoning - SF's infantry isn't bad. Rallix is on par with most of the best inf players in UNAC. I'm sure we'll see growth in this and all other classes as SF continues to improve.

Cav Score: C

Reasoning - Cav is SF's weakest point, but I wouldn't generally call it weak.

Bow / Crossbow Score: C+

Reasoning - Madness and Neanderthal are both great shots. Overall SF's range is more or less equal to its other classes.
Inf Score: C

Reasoning - Most of Wappaw's players don't seem to specialize in infantry, making it their weakest class. Kelquethas and Jim are quite good, though.

Cav Score: B+

Reasoning - Wappaw has always been known as a great cav clan. GreenKnight, Redknight, Blade and Black stand out.

Bow / Crossbow Score: C+

Reasoning - Zacty, Quantum Matrix and Mafioso are great ranged players for Wappaw. Overall, Wappaw's ranged is about average.
Inf Score: D

Reasoning - WMT's roster has some decent infantry players, but the roster's inactivity hasn't helped; most of them never seemed to attend matches anyway.

Cav Score: F

Reasoning - Unlike most teams in the tournament, there isn't really anyone on the roster who I'd say specializes in playing cav.

Bow / Crossbow Score: C

Reasoning - WMT's strongest class, but still not great. Fiery, Snubert and Core are all pretty great ranged players.
Inf Score: B

Reasoning - Until this tournament, I probably would have put this at C, but between players like PPK, Wily and Beer, wK's infantry has proven to be on par with some of the best.

Cav Score: A

Reasoning - In my opinion, wK has the tournament's best cav lineup. Calamity, Gelden, Wily, Lag, PPK and Beer are all great cav players that work very well together; Calamity has even maintained both highest kill count and best K/D ratio throughout the round robin.

Bow / Crossbow Score: A

Reasoning - Lagstro, Achilles and Robert are all amazing ranged players. Between the three of them, they probably produce more headshots than any other ranged trio I know.

**** I spent way too long doing that.
 
Grades are scaled to fit my view of NA scene, which is still a lot weaker than EU, even after improving from complete bull**** to average EU competitive level in the time period of only two tournaments. Still, no offense, simply a fact. Also, when judging cav, i'm not taking into account Open Plains all-cav that heavily as it's only one map. I also skip teams i didn't play against. GA is rated based on central pings.

Inf Score: C

Reasoning - Out of all the teams, Balion's inf was the weakest, even beaten by DoF and Rebels. They were bad overall, their inf was pretty much just a meatshield to buy time for cav and archers.

Cav Score: A

Reasoning - Scott Ray may play like a retard, but he's a skilled cav even on EU level, which makes up for his casual playstyle. I still think Mad's the smartest NA cav, which makes up for Scott Ray playing like it's a pub match. The rest of balion cavs are at least average, too, which makes them the top cav team in NA.

Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - Lot's of average level archers. Not stronger than TMW, wK or BkS, not weaker than DoF or Rebels.
Inf Score: A-

Reasoning - At the beginning of UNAC, they were simply **** at this. After getting raped hard by GA, however, they showed their competitive attitude by heavy training and adapting others by copying what they do and adding it to their own playstyle, they eventually managed to become one of the strongest inf teams, only topped by TMW at inf play.

Cav Score: B+

Reasoning - No particularly strong cavs, but pretty much every BkS can hop in to play as cav when needed. Nothing compared to Balion cav but certainly better than most.

Ranged Score: B+

Reasoning - No exceptionally good archers, but same as with cav, pretty much any BkS can hop on and play archer roughly as good as an average archer. What makes them better than Balion archers is that they're not as hopeless in melee as Balion, because of mainly playing infantry class.
Inf Score: C+

Reasoning - DoF was absolute **** last tournament, but before UNAC and during it, they have improved their infantry a lot. Still pretty weak, though.

Cav Score: B+

Reasoning - The thing that separates DoF and GKr. Not that retarded EU cavs and some average NA cavs combined, they can deal some serious damage depending on the map.

Ranged Score: B-

Reasoning - Kohath. He might be a solo player not listening to orders but he can support the team when he makes the right choices.
Inf Score: B

Reasoning - Strongest inf, but the ping hinders their performance quite a lot by ping.

Cav Score: B

Reasoning - Strongest cav, but cav is hindered by ping the most, and only a few of their players can seriously play cav, meaning they get stomped on plains hard very easily.

Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - Again, strongest by far but ping disadvantage compensates for that a lot.
Inf Score: A

Reasoning - Strongest by far at the start of the tournament, but due to lack of training others managed to catch up a bit while TMW barely improved at all.

Cav Score: B

Reasoning - I think saying EU cavs were the top cavs explains everything. Average cavs only.

Ranged Score: A

Reasoning - Str0nkest str0nk sötömrös shootink **** srsly. Also cokwiz n rurin not that bad but low ping nabs.
Inf Score: B+

Reasoning - Without bok it would be B. 3rd biggest improvement in infantry during UNAC. 1st being BkS and 2nd being DoF.

Cav Score: B

Reasoning - A lot of average cavs. Snööp.

Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - Kebab.
Inf Score: B

Reasoning - Bad, but not too bad. A lot of average infs like Tesla and Rallix.

Cav Score: B

Reasoning - Only average cavs. Nothing special.

Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - check above but replace cav with archer.
Inf Score: B-

Reasoning - Bad. With Bolpel gone their just bad.

Cav Score: A-

Reasoning - Smart average cavs and pretty str0nk for NA cavs that play like retard pubs.

Ranged Score: B+

Reasoning - Average pewpew again.
Inf Score: C+

Reasoning - Bad. Too inactive players to have the right classes for the matches, only like, one average player per match to play inf.

Cav Score: C

Reasoning - Bad. check above.

Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - Bad. check above.
Inf Score: B+

Reasoning - Stronker than average, but still weaker than BkS or TMW. Gained their skills by copying bok.

Cav Score: A-

Reasoning - Lots of average cavs, and a few above average cavs.

Ranged Score: A

Reasoning - Lagstro's pretty much the only NA archer i consider good enough to be compared with EU archers on any level. Top NA, average EU. A few other average NA archers on top of that.
 
You guys score like game critics. 7/10 is not average. A's and B's should not be the average grade.
 
Sota, "lots of average cav" is not a A- or B, it should be a C if they are really that average

Can't take your grading seriously
 
Defenders of Faith

Inf Score: D-

Reasoning - Our infantry is probably our weakest class, and while we have a few good infantry players, its hit or miss if they can all attend a match, making us rely on our not as good infantry to fill in the gaps.  Overall we need more of our infantry to be "top tier" so we don't have to worry about missing one or two vital players.

Cav Score: B

Reasoning - We have solid cavalry who were able to hold their own against top teams like wK and BkS.  In the end we lacked coordination that wK cavalry has in spades.

Bow / Crossbow Score: D-

Reasoning - Much like our infantry, we have two or three good archers, and when they aren't around, we don't have good enough back up's to fill the gap.
 
Going to try to be honest, but still be nice and helpful. Hopefully everyone will take this with a pound of sugar

Also basing almost everything on this tournament, not taking the past into account very much



Inf Score: B+

Reasoning: They have a great inf group, Joe, Van, Rhade, Tyrian. It would be an A, but most of those players have to double as cav

Cav Score: A

Reasoning: Rhade, Tyrian, Joe, Van and pretty much anyone on BkS can play cav really well. One of the strongest cav teams

Bow / Crossbow Score: A to A+

Reasoning: Peers, Harn, Frit, African and most of everyone can pick up a bow and do well

Overall grade: A

Inf Score: B-

Reasoning: They have some solid inf, ppk, Beer, Cradoc, Willy, Leth (is leth alive?) and everyone can play inf if needed

Cav Score: A

Reasoning: Cal, Gelden, Wily, and even Lagstro. Their all cav is top tier

Bow / Crossbow Score: A

Reasoning: Lagstro, Achillies, Robert

Overall Grade: B+

Inf Score: A

Reasoning: Oodle, Mike, Kherven, Volpel, Uni etc. Pretty scary Inf lineup

Cav Score: B

Reasoning: Blacktide, Maynd, X carry the cav a lot here

Bow / Crossbow Score: B-

Reasoning: Clockwise, Sota

Overall Grade: B

Going to base things off playing with pings and I am not too familiar with most of their roster, so I am probably missing some key players


Inf Score: B

Reasoning: Cleric, M and most GA can melee pretty decently for 120p

Cav Score: B

Reasoning: Shema, Peter can only do so much, but GA have strong cav no doubt

Bow / Crossbow Score: B+

Reasoning: Leroux

Overall: B

Inf Score: C

Reasoning: A lot of their good inf players have become inactive as far as I am aware, but the inf can hold their own against most teams

Cav Score: B+

Reasoning: Scott, Mad, Blak etc. Really solid cav lineup

Bow / Crossbow Score: B+

Reasoning: Zero, Peas, Mad, Ron. Where is Zero btw?

Overall Grade: B-

Inf Score: C+

Reasoning: Solid inf, but I'm not sure how many of their Inf players are still around. It's affecting the grade

Cav Score: B+

Reasoning: Red, Blade, Green, Pizza, Slug. Really good Cav lineup, lately they seem to be lacking from their former open Cav dominance 6 months ago and I'm not sure why

Bow / Crossbow Score: B-

Reasoning: Zacty, Quantum etc


Overall Grade: C They have the skill to be higher, but activity or cohesion needs to improve

Inf Score: C

Reasoning: A couple really good inf, but still new and they need more inf players

Cav Score: C+

Reasoning: Brave carries here a lot

Bow / Crossbow Score: B+

Reasoning: Asheila, Nig, myself and most people can play archer pretty well

Overall Grade: C+

Inf Score: C+

Reasoning: I feel like Rallix and some others carry here

Cav Score: C

Reasoning: some good cav, but they need sharpening


Bow / Crossbow Score: B-

Reasoning: Captain, Kush and most sf can play archer


Overall Grade: C

Inf Score: C-

Reasoning: Mok does work, they need to practice Inf balls and engagements and disengagement

Cav Score: C+

Reasoning: Best cav in NA, Snoop and others. Don't let nevino charge in alone

Bow / Crossbow Score: C+

Reasoning: Temp, Courtney, Rhadagast and some others do work here.

Overall Grade: C

Inf Score: D

Reasoning: Pretty weak here, but I know they are training a lot to become better

Cav Score: B

Reasoning: Darin, Alec and most DoF are good at cav. I feel like they can compete with most others

Bow / Crossbow Score: D+

Reasoning: I don't know the ranged here

Overall Grade: C-

Actually has the skill of a mid tier team, but they are lacking something and I also know this team is getting changed massively. I actually didn't get to play against them at all and didn't get to watch any of their streams, so I'll have to skip them here

Inf Score: C

Reasoning: I don't really know many players here, but if they are better than a C I want to see it!

Cav Score: D

Reasoning: Again I know very little


Bow / Crossbow Score: D-


Reasoning: Same as above


Overall Grade: D
 
sotamursu123 说:
Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - Lot's of average level archers. Not stronger than TMW, wK or BkS, not weaker than DoF or Rebels.
Funny man Sota, all your grades are far from being accurate. But this in particular amused me, Balions archers are the 2nd best archers in the tournament, some of the most consistent skill wise in North America. We aren't flashy like John with the occasional impressive headshot. The best archers in the tournament are in West Knights. Achilles to me is hands down if not the best archer in NA, in the top 3. Lag is very flashy with some impressive Headshots, but as a archer for me flashy hs doesn't make you good. Consistent in hitting opponent and supporting the rest of your team is what matters and wk has the best archers that do that.  I am only worried to archer fight vs wk archers and frit on a good day. The rest are just above average including all the eu's ones [LeRoux is the only EU archer thats very good in my opinion, he supports and setups up kills for his team like none else do]. Now on subject Juve's team grades is probably the best one so far.

@John I missed probably the 2 of the most important matchs for Balion, the wk and bks match. Due to a unexpected trip I had to do for work related issues.
 
Z3ro 说:
sotamursu123 说:
Ranged Score: B

Reasoning - Lot's of average level archers. Not stronger than TMW, wK or BkS, not weaker than DoF or Rebels.
Funny man Sota, all your grades are fair from being accurate.


:shock:
 
The day people get mad at sota for being nice. You guys might not realize this, but he graded everyone (tmw included) higher than he really believes.

Anyway, just gonna do an overall grade for each team cause I'm bored on the train.

BkS - B+, beats most teams by sheer willpower honestly.
wK - A-, plays really well but doesn't take advantage of mixed maps as much as they should.
TMW - A-, honestly should've done better but we overestimated BkS and tried to play too fancy when we couldn't won straight up. Too clever for their own good.
GA - B, ping.
Balion - B, they don't work as much as they should but they have the skill to be really good.

My trains here, nvm.


Zero needs to stop taking a piss at anyone who says that some aspect of balion isn't perfect as ****.

Edit: fcking train in front won't move.

Wappaw- B-, same with Balion they have the skill but need to train. Also moral problems.
KoA- C+, too inconsistent, but individual player skills been improving. I'm hoping for a B next season. John needs to not play cav.
 
Sota has a very clouded view of the NA scene, and has an obvious bias towards his homeland.

Understandable, but it produces some pretty trolly posts.
 
John7 说:
Cav Score: C+

Reasoning: Best cav in NA, Snoop and others. Don't let nevino charge in alone


:razz: no comment on closed towards the end of the tournament I played like **** my open I thought was ok I mean just look at our stream vs KoA John xD
 
MrNevino1 说:
John7 说:
Cav Score: C+

Reasoning: Best cav in NA, Snoop and others. Don't let nevino charge in alone


:razz: no comment on closed towards the end of the tournament I played like **** my open I thought was ok I mean just look at our stream vs KoA John xD
I have a whole bag full of punctuation thingys that I am donating to you Nevino. It's on the house bro.
 
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