Suggestions for Versions after 2.5

Should the Vaegir Elite troop be mounted, infantry, or armored archer troop?

  • mounted (upgrade from knight)

    Votes: 4 40.0%
  • infantry (upgrade from Druzhina)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • armored archer (upgrade from Druzhina Archer)

    Votes: 6 60.0%

  • Total voters
    10
  • Poll closed .

Users who are viewing this thread

cunuck32

Recruit
Redleg said:
cunuck32 said:
Will you be making changes to the horse archer AI? As of now it just seems like they charge the enemy head on instead of circling around them, which kind of stinks because they are pretty weak in melee.

I believe the PBOD options have a horse archer fix of some sort that should help with the problem.  It's not a perfect fix, but does seem to improve the behavior somewhat.  Have you enabled that tick box?  Let me know.

I do have it checked, but from what I recall they would still run at eachother before dispersing and performing actual horse-archery.
 

Trueten

Section Moderator
WBVC
Redleg said:
trueten said:
Redleg said:
3.  V3 will not be save compatible with 2.5.  I have added another faction and other changes that are not compatible.
Whoa, another faction! Sounds awesome! Hope it will include another companion(s) added to the game :smile:

I presume you've mentioned there will be a module system provided with the v3 realease. I hope to add some more companions.

Also I've noticed some items do not display at the store (Rhodok stout kettle with coif, nordic polearm hammer etc), wonder if it is a glitch or it is intended to be so. It has some amount of chellange being able to acquire some top-tier items only via after-battle loot.

When you say those items don't appear at the store, do you mean in the cheat menu for all items or the actual town stores?  I probably need to run the factionize items script again to get those items to show up in the town stores.
I mean the actual town stores.
For example not a single native Rhodok town had Rhodok stout kettle with coif in the store throughout a 200 ingame days of playing, while I've been checking the store(s) on an almost everyday basis.

Also after supporting a Sarranid claiment and conquering towns and castles they start to provide only swadian recruits and inside the castle and town there are swadian guards everywhere.
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
trueten said:
Redleg said:
trueten said:
Redleg said:
3.  V3 will not be save compatible with 2.5.  I have added another faction and other changes that are not compatible.
Whoa, another faction! Sounds awesome! Hope it will include another companion(s) added to the game :smile:

I presume you've mentioned there will be a module system provided with the v3 realease. I hope to add some more companions.

Also I've noticed some items do not display at the store (Rhodok stout kettle with coif, nordic polearm hammer etc), wonder if it is a glitch or it is intended to be so. It has some amount of chellange being able to acquire some top-tier items only via after-battle loot.

When you say those items don't appear at the store, do you mean in the cheat menu for all items or the actual town stores?  I probably need to run the factionize items script again to get those items to show up in the town stores.
I mean the actual town stores.
For example not a single native Rhodok town had Rhodok stout kettle with coif in the store throughout a 200 ingame days of playing, while I've been checking the store(s) on an almost everyday basis.

Also after supporting a Sarranid claiment and conquering towns and castles they start to provide only swadian recruits and inside the castle and town there are swadian guards everywhere.

In version 2.5 the default culture is Swadian.  That means when you become king (and presumably, when you are helping a claimant), the troops will be Swadian.  Do you own the castle/town or does the claimant own it?

As for the stores issue, I have added new items since I last "factionized" the store.  I will make sure to re-run the program before I release ver. 3.  Until then, you can use the cheat menu to purchase any item you want.
 

Trueten

Section Moderator
WBVC
Redleg said:
Until then, you can use the cheat menu to purchase any item you want.
Ugh, I guess it could be an option.

Any hints on what kind of culture this new Geroia faction would be? I mean which historical culture/nation. Turks? Scotts? Etc.

Redleg said:
In version 2.5 the default culture is Swadian.  That means when you become king (and presumably, when you are helping a claimant), the troops will be Swadian.  Do you own the castle/town or does the claimant own it?
Both mine, king's (claiment) and lords' towns n' castles provide swadian recruits.
Villages though provide native recruits.
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
trueten said:
Redleg said:
Until then, you can use the cheat menu to purchase any item you want.
Ugh, I guess it could be an option.

Any hints on what kind of culture this new Geroia faction would be? I mean which historical culture/nation. Turks? Scotts? Etc.

Redleg said:
In version 2.5 the default culture is Swadian.  That means when you become king (and presumably, when you are helping a claimant), the troops will be Swadian.  Do you own the castle/town or does the claimant own it?
Both mine, king's (claiment) and lords' towns n' castles provide swadian recruits.
Villages though provide native recruits.

The recruit thing is a function of Diplomacy and Native.  If you own a town and have a chancellor you can request to change your kingdom culture.  In version 3 (forthcoming) I allow the player to select culture in character creation so that when they form their own kingdom it will be that culture.  They can still change culture through the chancellor but the changes are not immediate.  Professional troops recruited from towns and castles should be the same faction as the town/castle owner.  The village recruits will always remain as the original faction.  In version 2.5 you can build a manor in villages to produce current faction archers.  In ver. 3 I have replaced those archers with customizable foot troops.

The Geroian faction is supposed to represent German troops of the Holy Roman Empire around the 11th Century.  In some ways they are similar to Swadian Troops, although have better infantry and their own armor and weapons.  I designed them that way because I didn't have any other inspirations for them.  Some have suggested a Samurai faction, others have suggested Celts, still others have suggested another arab-type faction.
 

Trueten

Section Moderator
WBVC
Redleg said:
The Geroian faction is supposed to represent German troops of the Holy Roman Empire around the 11th Century.
This is great. I was hoping for another western culture.
 

Sarin

Master Knight
Aw...I wasn't paying attention to these forums and missed that. There are other possibilities for a good and original faction.

How about taking inspiration from ancient Europe and medieval Iberia and make a faction centered around using throwing weapons, or take inspiration from Parthia and make cavalry faction with catapract-like heavy cavalry, horse archers but only crappy archer-spearmen hybrids as infantry.
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Sarin said:
Aw...I wasn't paying attention to these forums and missed that. There are other possibilities for a good and original faction.

How about taking inspiration from ancient Europe and medieval Iberia and make a faction centered around using throwing weapons, or take inspiration from Parthia and make cavalry faction with catapract-like heavy cavalry, horse archers but only crappy archer-spearmen hybrids as infantry.

Thanks for the ideas.  The Geroians are actually quite good at throwing and have dedicated throwing troops, like the Iberians.  They differ in that they are more heavily armored and quite balanced from foot to mounted.  Since they are a small faction I wanted them to be able to hold their own. 
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
trueten said:
Does the new faction include another companion to be added to the game?

I did not add another companion (beyond the 4 added in a previous version). 

Also, please respond to the poll in this thread.
 

Sarin

Master Knight
Ah, a poll.

No IIRC other faction has elite archers, so Vaegirs should get archer elite.

I'm still hopeful for a faction whose melee infantry would have guaranteed throwing weapon like troops from classical period tended to have.
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Sarin said:
Ah, a poll.

No IIRC other faction has elite archers, so Vaegirs should get archer elite.

I'm still hopeful for a faction whose melee infantry would have guaranteed throwing weapon like troops from classical period tended to have.

Most of the factions have dedicated skirmishers/peltasts with guaranteed throwing weapons.  Some of these factions have a quite deep skirmisher line, up to level 25 (Nords, Keltons, Sarranids, Geroians, Eastern).  The Nords, Sarranids, and Eastern skirmishers can upgrade to mounted at level 25. 

Two factions have professional troops with guaranteed throwing, for example the Nords have a line of professional troops specializing in throwing (Nord Hirdmann->Nord Thane->Nord Elite Thane), as do the Keltons (Kelton Dryhtman upgrades to Kelton Gesith or Mounted Gesith).  These are guaranteed through a script rather than by designating them as ranged troops.

I think you will find that even in version 2.52 there are plenty of throwing troops, more-so in forthcoming ver. 3.0.

 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Skorpion1974 said:
more-so in forthcoming ver. 3.0

ok but.. any idea when this is happening?

Yes, soon.  Within the week.  I have had some PC issues to deal with but am back to the final steps in completing the mod.  I am still cleaning up the brfs to remove unused stuff and am writing the changelist and new features document.  Not much left, just need to find a chunk of time to complete it and upload.

In regard to the poll for the Vaegir elite troops, I have decided to make their elite troop a mounted archer that upgrades from the Druzhina archer found in ver. 2.5.  This elite archer is well equipped and has excellent archery and melee proficiencies.  I have had a good deal of fun play-testing the new version and am quite happy with it and the stability of the game itself. 
 

Lefto26

Regular
M&BWBNW
Hey Redleg, thanks for the mod, it's great work.
That's just my opinion but what I would change would be:

-The names and clothing of the Eastern Province female characters to better fit the faction's theme.
-The faces of female characters that seem too cartoonish and indistinct, I think the native were better.
-Nerf or decrease the use of pikes because even the weak sarranid footmen can do big damage to my quality cavalry.
-I would increase the effect that forage has or decrease the food consumption because at this point buying food so often has become a boring chore.
-Amp up the morale a little bit because I'm at 130 party size and the morale is always around average and it pisses me off a little bit. (:
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Hey Redleg, thanks for the mod, it's great work.
That's just my opinion but what I would change would be:

-The names and clothing of the Eastern Province female characters to better fit the faction's theme.
-The faces of female characters that seem too cartoonish and indistinct, I think the native were better.
-Nerf or decrease the use of pikes because even the weak sarranid footmen can do big damage to my quality cavalry.
-I would increase the effect that forage has or decrease the food consumption because at this point buying food so often has become a boring chore.
-Amp up the morale a little bit because I'm at 130 party size and the morale is always around average and it pisses me off a little bit. (:
Thanks for the support. I also appreciate the suggestions.
1. I have thought about changing the clothing for eastern province females but don't know what they should look like. Any ideas? Are there native outfits that would suit them?
2. I am not a big fan of native faces for females. I have tried a variety of female face mods and most don't provide much variation. Some actually make the women look like supermodels with long, modern hair styles. I might provide a small guide on how the player can revert to native faces in the next release.
3. The sarranid footmen don't really have a pike- the longest spear they have is the bamboo spear, and those are used by lower tier footmen. There is a setting in the PBOD options that has to do with the spear versus horse damage. Part of the problem is that horses just want to charge into a mass formation of spears. I have found that I need to keep very close control over my cavalry to keep them from doing stupid things.
4. I will take the forage idea into account. Or decrease food consumption rate. Or something else. I agree that with a big army is does seem a chore to keep food in stock. Of course that was always an issue with medieval warfare.
5. I have made some changes to the morale aspect in my current work-in-progress version. You should be able to maintain a good sized army without losing morale too quickly.
 

Lefto26

Regular
M&BWBNW
Hi Redleg, I don't know what would be a realistic attire for a eastern province female but I would like it more if it have the natives of the other factions (swadian, nord, vaegir, rhodok).
I found out about the PBOD options a couple of days after I made my latest post. What I was thinking originally was that if you had the lower tier footmen equipped with other weapons instead of spears then there would be better balance even with this setting turned on. But since the bonus can be turned off, whatever.
Forage and Morale have become more manageable for me now but that's because I have become super strong and rich.

One irrelevant question, can the custom troops be customised by the player in-game?
 

Redleg

Sergeant Knight at Arms
Hi Redleg, I don't know what would be a realistic attire for a eastern province female but I would like it more if it have the natives of the other factions (swadian, nord, vaegir, rhodok).
I found out about the PBOD options a couple of days after I made my latest post. What I was thinking originally was that if you had the lower tier footmen equipped with other weapons instead of spears then there would be better balance even with this setting turned on. But since the bonus can be turned off, whatever.
Forage and Morale have become more manageable for me now but that's because I have become super strong and rich.

One irrelevant question, can the custom troops be customised by the player in-game?
Yes you can customize the custom troops. They come with a default set up. Once you recruit them, click on the troop in your troop viewer and ask him to look at his equipment. You will be able to choose from many weapons and armors.

Regarding the spears, I am loathe to take away spears from lower-tier troops since spears were the most commonly used weapons of the early to middle middle ages. Swords were quite expensive during that period and only the nobles and professional troops were likely to have good swords. Spears are more effective in my mod because I buffed their damage and added an additional spear strike animation that allows bot two different directions of attack. This is helpful to the player as well.
 
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