Suggestions for Implementation within the Mod

[HitZoor]

I don't mean bugged in gameplay, but many of the weapons won't show on the character and small things like that just make me think it's better to only use perfectly functional items. Another little thing is that for instance there are atleast 2 items that's called Rusty Sword, one with a good texture that is actually rusty and one that is not rusty at all. Why not remove the one that does not have a rusty texture and only use the proper one? Also the broken swords are waaaay to good. You buy them for like 1 k in the shops, and it's better then most of the low priced swords. After all, a broken sword is a broken sword and a cheap sword should easily be better then a broken sword.

 

[Jinnai]

I don't mean bugged in gameplay, but many of the weapons won't show on the character and small things like that just make me think it's better to only use perfectly functional items. Another little thing is that for instance there are atleast 2 items that's called Rusty Sword, one with a good texture that is actually rusty and one that is not rusty at all. Why not remove the one that does not have a rusty texture and only use the proper one? Also the broken swords are waaaay to good. You buy them for like 1 k in the shops, and it's better then most of the low priced swords. After all, a broken sword is a broken sword and a cheap sword should easily be better then a broken sword.

As mentioned in the known bugs thread all price issues are known and will be fixed shortly.  And I'm asking you what weapons won't show on a character?  In my opinion if I'm supposed to have a weapon equipped and am attacking with it and see nothing, that's a bug.  But no one has mentioned this yet.  If a weapon is sheathed and I don't see it... Well, that depends on the weapon, but a lot of Native weapons were like that.  As for the rusty modifier, that's a game modifier.  If there is an alternate texture available for the modifier the game will use it.  Not all the new weapons have that alternate texture in the first place.  We didn't create the new items and textures, we're simply using packs released by other people.

We'll look at the stats for the broken swords again.

EDIT:  I found the exact swords you were talking about.  The only weapons named simply "Sword" are default to Native.  Some of them have rusty textures and some don't.  So this particular complaint is a complaint for Native, not for our mod.  We try not to use duplicate item names except when appropriate.

 

[DarkInsight]

Good job on the patch, it is really great.

Shield bash is cool,but is it intended to swing the weapon and the shield together?

Shield wall is awesome, but isn't it a little strange that one just crosses his spear in front of his shield? I thought you are suppose to point your spearhead forward? Anyway, correct me if I am wrong. not exactly learned in medieval warfare stuff.
And ,btw does the npc have the same animation when they are entering shield wall stance? or does it just look like they are holding position?

And lastly, a hotkey for shieldwall command toggle will be cool.

 

[HitZoor]

I don't mean bugged in gameplay, but many of the weapons won't show on the character and small things like that just make me think it's better to only use perfectly functional items. Another little thing is that for instance there are atleast 2 items that's called Rusty Sword, one with a good texture that is actually rusty and one that is not rusty at all. Why not remove the one that does not have a rusty texture and only use the proper one? Also the broken swords are waaaay to good. You buy them for like 1 k in the shops, and it's better then most of the low priced swords. After all, a broken sword is a broken sword and a cheap sword should easily be better then a broken sword.

As mentioned in the known bugs thread all price issues are known and will be fixed shortly.  And I'm asking you what weapons won't show on a character?  In my opinion if I'm supposed to have a weapon equipped and am attacking with it and see nothing, that's a bug.  But no one has mentioned this yet.  If a weapon is sheathed and I don't see it... Well, that depends on the weapon, but a lot of Native weapons were like that.  As for the rusty modifier, that's a game modifier.  If there is an alternate texture available for the modifier the game will use it.  Not all the new weapons have that alternate texture in the first place.  We didn't create the new items and textures, we're simply using packs released by other people.

We'll look at the stats for the broken swords again.

EDIT:  I found the exact swords you were talking about.  The only weapons named simply "Sword" are default to Native.  Some of them have rusty textures and some don't.  So this particular complaint is a complaint for Native, not for our mod.  We try not to use duplicate item names except when appropriate.

Well, you could simply remove the Rusty flag from the "Sword" in the itemeditor. Shouldn't be hard.

 

[Tismanu]

I think Hitzoor is talking about the animation glitch with the jeweled sword and maybe some of the other sword. The weapon shows up in your hand when your attacking but it does not show up anywhere on your body when shealth and such.

And for shield wall, yes your suppose to point your pike and such in forward or brace with your shield in front while resting a part of your spear on the shield or near it. I think its just that they did it with the normal "block" animation to make it easier since the skill itself is a test to see if it works correctly and such. They can probably code it to make the animation look correct later on but I don't think its that big of an issue.

Side note: How come sometimes your guys big update seems to be smaller then a previous release? Like the one before this was 112 or so mb and this was only 98mb. I know it could be that you took stuff up but 20mb+ worth of stuff is alot O.O Just curious to see a smaller release when the previous one didn't have much issues IMO.

 

[Jinnai]

Good job on the patch, it is really great.

Shield bash is cool,but is it intended to swing the weapon and the shield together?

Shield wall is awesome, but isn't it a little strange that one just crosses his spear in front of his shield? I thought you are suppose to point your spearhead forward? Anyway, correct me if I am wrong. not exactly learned in medieval warfare stuff.
And ,btw does the npc have the same animation when they are entering shield wall stance? or does it just look like they are holding position?

And lastly, a hotkey for shieldwall command toggle will be cool.

Yeah, shield bash moves the whole body so it's weapon and shield together.

Thanks for the compliments on the spear wall.  I agree, it should point forward rather than across, but I work with what animations I have.  The only animations that have hold patterns are the defense ones.  Yes, I know holding attack holds you in the attack pose, and I would've loved to use that one, but that hold is apparently hard coded into the game and my attempts to fake that looked like the player was having a seizure.

Do you mean a toggle for the player?  Or for NPCs?  It'd be easy to add for the player, but I didn't see a need since doing pretty much anything pulls you out of it.  As for the NPCs...  Tell em to hold position and they'll do it automatically if they have the right weapon.  I might add a command that tells them to use spears if they have them but are using swords or something else instead.

 

[Jinnai]

Well, you could simply remove the Rusty flag from the "Sword" in the itemeditor. Shouldn't be hard.

We don't use the item editor as we're working with the Module System.  And yes, we could remove the rusty flag from it.  But why would we?  Swords can get rusty.  Again, what you're complaining about here is something in Native and wasn't touched by this mod.  Yes, we're editing things from Native, but in this case we don't have a texture for that sword as rusty, swords can get rusty, and it was good enough for Native and we don't really see a need to do anything to it...

 

[Jinnai]

I think Hitzoor is talking about the animation glitch with the jeweled sword and maybe some of the other sword. The weapon shows up in your hand when your attacking but it does not show up anywhere on your body when shealth and such.

And for shield wall, yes your suppose to point your pike and such in forward or brace with your shield in front while resting a part of your spear on the shield or near it. I think its just that they did it with the normal "block" animation to make it easier since the skill itself is a test to see if it works correctly and such. They can probably code it to make the animation look correct later on but I don't think its that big of an issue.

Side note: How come sometimes your guys big update seems to be smaller then a previous release? Like the one before this was 112 or so mb and this was only 98mb. I know it could be that you took stuff up but 20mb+ worth of stuff is alot O.O Just curious to see a smaller release when the previous one didn't have much issues IMO.

Do you mean if you're just walking around with the jeweled sword in hand you can't see it in hand?  Or is it only when you're walking around with another weapon you can't see it?  If it's only when you have another weapon out, that's not really a bug.  A lot of Native weapons also don't show up on your body when not actually in hand.  But, we'll probably go through and add pieces that have them hang off your hip or the like for most of the new weapons since I agree, it would make them look better.

EDIT: Forgot to answer your question about the size issue.  It's a combination of removing files we're not actually using and using a different compression program.  Sorry if it made you nervous.   We're hoping to be able to just do patch releases for some of the smaller changes.

 

[Chaotic Evil]

I think Hitzoor is talking about the animation glitch with the jeweled sword and maybe some of the other sword. The weapon shows up in your hand when your attacking but it does not show up anywhere on your body when shealth and such.

And for shield wall, yes your suppose to point your pike and such in forward or brace with your shield in front while resting a part of your spear on the shield or near it. I think its just that they did it with the normal "block" animation to make it easier since the skill itself is a test to see if it works correctly and such. They can probably code it to make the animation look correct later on but I don't think its that big of an issue.

Side note: How come sometimes your guys big update seems to be smaller then a previous release? Like the one before this was 112 or so mb and this was only 98mb. I know it could be that you took stuff up but 20mb+ worth of stuff is alot O.O Just curious to see a smaller release when the previous one didn't have much issues IMO.

Do you mean if you're just walking around with the jeweled sword in hand you can't see it in hand?  Or is it only when you're walking around with another weapon you can't see it?  If it's only when you have another weapon out, that's not really a bug.  A lot of Native weapons also don't show up on your body when not actually in hand.  But, we'll probably go through and add pieces that have them hang off your hip or the like for most of the new weapons since I agree, it would make them look better.

EDIT: Forgot to answer your question about the size issue.  It's a combination of removing files we're not actually using and using a different compression program.  Sorry if it made you nervous.   We're hoping to be able to just do patch releases for some of the smaller changes.

Its not really a bug and,yes, the native also had the same problem where some of your weapons wouldnt show up in the character screen or in battle,unless you had them drawn(like the lance for example,which was really frustrating to see my knight in shining armor without a weapon in the character screen).In this mod the knightly sword is not shown unless drawn as well,and others too.Its does not cause any problems in matter of efficiency,its a matter of enjoying seeing your character with a weapon sheathed.But I suppose you have so many things on your mind for this mod,making this just a small detail,so forgive me for the nuisance.

Anyway,the patch is excellent.Good job.Keep rockin'.

 

[Tismanu]

Oh it just doesn't appear when you don't have it in hand, its no biggie to me personally but it makes me forget sometimes if I have already equip someone with a weapon or not(My usual me+companion load out is a weapon+shield+bows/arrows) I notice that if you have a weapon that slung on your back along with a bow, only one of the weapon shows up. Again, its not a big deal.

Oh the size issue just makes me wonder if you guys were a bit too happy with the delete key and accidently remove a troop or feature that was in the previous release.

And dear god Jinnai, 3-4 posts back to back?!  Lol

Edit: Oops forgot a minor detail that I wanted to ask for a while now. With merc increasing the character's initial level to 2 and upping the starting stats, it puts us at a slight skill point disadvantage. I think intel was increase from like 8(for a female) to like 14 or so but you still start out with 8 skill point to put wherever you want. Can you increase the skill points a bit to match the intel?

 

[Jinnai]

Edit: Oops forgot a minor detail that I wanted to ask for a while now. With merc increasing the character's initial level to 2 and upping the starting stats, it puts us at a slight skill point disadvantage. I think intel was increase from like 8(for a female) to like 14 or so but you still start out with 8 skill point to put wherever you want. Can you increase the skill points a bit to match the intel?

Very good point and something I noticed as well, I just never got around to correcting.  I'll add code to give you more starting skill points.

 

[Deadly Dick]

Great mod by the way, easily the best for 1.011

I just have one comment about the new weapons. For some reason I find that when I use one of the new weapons like the jeweled sword, the damage that I am able to inflict is considerably less than I typically do with a supposedly less powerful sword such as the bastard sword or great sword.
Maybe I am mistaken but it seems like its harder to kill people with these weapons despite them having much higher damage and speed values.

Also another issue is with the crossbows, maybe this is also the same in native but i find that when you shoot a guy with a masterwork seige crossbow at close range in the head (with supposedly 70p damage) it does way less damage than a crappy nomad bow would do, even though my crossbow skill is way high.

Just wondering if anyone else has noticed this?

 

[HitZoor]

Well, you could simply remove the Rusty flag from the "Sword" in the itemeditor. Shouldn't be hard.

We don't use the item editor as we're working with the Module System.  And yes, we could remove the rusty flag from it.  But why would we?  Swords can get rusty.  Again, what you're complaining about here is something in Native and wasn't touched by this mod.  Yes, we're editing things from Native, but in this case we don't have a texture for that sword as rusty, swords can get rusty, and it was good enough for Native and we don't really see a need to do anything to it...

Well, reason for removing the rusty flag from 'sword" would be because there is already an item that does that.

 

[Jinnai]

Great mod by the way, easily the best for 1.011

I just have one comment about the new weapons. For some reason I find that when I use one of the new weapons like the jeweled sword, the damage that I am able to inflict is considerably less than I typically do with a supposedly less powerful sword such as the bastard sword or great sword.
Maybe I am mistaken but it seems like its harder to kill people with these weapons despite them having much higher damage and speed values.

Also another issue is with the crossbows, maybe this is also the same in native but i find that when you shoot a guy with a masterwork seige crossbow at close range in the head (with supposedly 70p damage) it does way less damage than a crappy nomad bow would do, even though my crossbow skill is way high.

Just wondering if anyone else has noticed this?

I think it depends on who you attack.  A lot of troops are pretty well armored and a lot tougher now.  Compare one of the new items with one of the native items but both in this mod.  You'll probably see lower damage all around until you gain levels.  The Native looters were pretty weak with almost no armor.  Mercs now are pretty well geared.  There also seems to be a modifier to damage based on the difference in levels of the attacker and defender, but I can't prove that.

Well, reason for removing the rusty flag from 'sword" would be because there is already an item that does that.

I don't think you understand how the game creates rusty items.  Rusty is a modifier for weapons.  There is no "Rusty Sword" item.  There is only "Sword" item that occasionally (and randomly) gets the "Rusty" modifier attached to it.  There happen to be two "Sword" items in Native, and since they are both swords they both can end up with the "Rusty" modifier.  Only one of the items actually has an optional rusty texture.  The other does not, so the game will use the default texture for rusty and not rusty.  However, even though they share the same name they are two completely different items.  Does this make sense?  Nowhere are we specifically creating a "Rusty Sword."

 

[Halcyon]

now that we have shield wall,and since halberd can't perform shield wall, it would be cool if rhodok have 2 infantry lines :2h polearm and 1h polearm +shield

It would be interesting to also have a spear wall by having the brace for 2h polearms, but at the moment its quite pointless, or not worth it.

 

[Jinnai]

Spear wall will probably get added to 2 handed polearms as well.

 

[DarkInsight]

suggestion: give spear wall stance a "cooldown" period. i.e, if a defender successfully dismount an enemy, the defender is stunned for a short time(use the shield bash animation). In this way, if there is too many riders, the defender will be overrun.

right now, it seems the defender only need to enter spear wall stance , and all the enemy will automatically fall off horses...

 

[Halcyon]

Spear wall will probably get added to 2 handed polearms as well.

Thats great, and for that you can use the animation it has while you carry a 2h polearms, just that in a more static way. Also i may be in over my head, since i dont know how animations work, but if they were in frames, or sets of code, technically speaking couldnt you 'copy' one moment or frame of the animation?

EDIT: Also maybe for the spear wall, using the animation for attacking with a spear+shield would fit better? Then you could do the same thing with the 2h polearms but with their animation.

 

[Jinnai]

I understand what you're getting at, and I actually tried using only certain frames of the attack animation, the problem was it made it look like the character was having a seizure or it slowed the game to a crawl (and I have a pretty powerful computer.)

The problem with the NPCs is that I can set their animation, but I can't do much about their AI stance.  As soon as the AI decides to attack or do something else it'll pull them out of whatever animation I have set, even if I try to loop it.  The formation system has a similar problem.  Ever notice that when the enemy is fleeing in terror on occasion they'll stop fleeing and decide they want to try to cut your head off?  Yet after a few seconds another flee message pops up and they start retreating again?  That's because the formation system brute forces it.  Given the timing issues involved with detecting when a horse gets close to a troop I can't use the same brute force method.  Would people be happy with a message showing up any time a horse dies to a spear wall set by anyone?  (Indicators tell which side of course.)

 

[Halcyon]

I understand what you're getting at, and I actually tried using only certain frames of the attack animation, the problem was it made it look like the character was having a seizure or it slowed the game to a crawl (and I have a pretty powerful computer.)

The problem with the NPCs is that I can set their animation, but I can't do much about their AI stance.  As soon as the AI decides to attack or do something else it'll pull them out of whatever animation I have set, even if I try to loop it.  The formation system has a similar problem.  Ever notice that when the enemy is fleeing in terror on occasion they'll stop fleeing and decide they want to try to cut your head off?  Yet after a few seconds another flee message pops up and they start retreating again?  That's because the formation system brute forces it.  Given the timing issues involved with detecting when a horse gets close to a troop I can't use the same brute force method.  Would people be happy with a message showing up any time a horse dies to a spear wall set by anyone?  (Indicators tell which side of course.)

If it makes the spear wall animation better i wouldnt mind that at all.