Suggestion: Please add proper widescreen support

[Helmut_AUT]

As per this topic:
http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?topic=76651

Right now in 1.011 - and per Darkness' tests, even in Warband - Mount&Blade does not properly support widescreen resolutions. What happens is that using 16:10 or 16:9, you get LESS vertical view than on 4:3, and the same horizontal view. Basically you are seeing less of the total scene than a 4:3 screen user, a kind of "zoomed in" scene. For years standard widescreen implementation has meant to keep the vertical FOV the same and EXPAND left/right (horizontal) field of vision, which makes sense since most widescreens have more horizontal resolution at the same vertical resolution than comparable 4:3.

To get a better idea what the problem is, please read here: http://www.widescreengamingforum.com/wiki/index.php/Vert_-

To counter this, a good start would be allowing the player to set FOV himself. By selecting a wider FOV (usually 108 degrees instead of the most common 90 degrees) we could get the vertical screen area back that 4:3 offers, and wider area left/right. I know that right now there is a hack to set FOV, but it involves changing values in game memory during runtime, and that to me is too complicated. It's also not very future-proof, since these values change with every new release, Anti-Virus Scanners interfere with memory hacks and Win7 might too interfere with such things.
Instead, please simple put a numerical value for FOV in some scripts file which the user can edit.

I'm really surprised this has escaped attention so long, seeing that these days most screens you see everywhere are either 16:10 or now even 16:9 (which would make the effect even worse). Obviously the engine has actually no problem to change FOV on the fly (you can even zoom in) so all that needs to be done is to change default FOV based on screen ratio.

 

[Egbert]

This is very important to me. I have a 1680x1050 screen and can't use the first person view in combat because I can't see enough to know which way I'm facing, especially when mounted.

 

[Letum]

/signed

 

[Darkness]

I get a 404 error clicking the link you linked at the top. Here are the pics showing this:

隐藏: 800x600

隐藏: 1920x1080

I agree, I think widescreen support should be an option.

 

[Mercenary88]

In the second ss it's clear that the FOV is simply been compressed vertically to compensate for the increase in width, the FOV remains the same. I know that many other games do "support wide screens" in that they actually provide a wider FOV for wide screens. My question is: Is this fair? Is it fair to provide a clear game-play advantage based simply on hardware?

 

[silentdawn]

Hardware advantages are inevitable having a faster PC your game will run smother and you will do better and with higher visuals you can catch important details that could help in game.
Having a faster connection helps a lot. I have had countless times in any online game where I know I did what I needed to do at the right time but my opponent with a faster connection beat me to it.
Having a mic is also a clear advantage so much so in this game because communication is so important to the way this game flows.
There are also a lot of gaming accessories you can get that can improve your game.

Also to flip things around is it fair for those with a wide screen to have a clear disadvantage?

 

[SteveO]

My question is: Is this fair? Is it fair to provide a clear game-play advantage based simply on hardware?

Maybe not, but other people have 20 pings and I'm stuck with a 100, so I'll take any advantages I can.

 

[Giledhil]

Anyway, the "View outfit" key permits to look around in any situation...

 

[Helmut_AUT]

In the second ss it's clear that the FOV is simply been compressed vertically to compensate for the increase in width, the FOV remains the same. I know that many other games do "support wide screens" in that they actually provide a wider FOV for wide screens. My question is: Is this fair? Is it fair to provide a clear game-play advantage based simply on hardware?

Honest answer? I don't care.

But not to be provocative: For most of my computer gaming time, I'm playing offline. In fact M&B until Warband was a pure offline game, as we all know. The little I play online I play with friends who don't care.

So, for a game that used to be mainly played offline (and likely many will remain mostly offline in the future, since the amount of offline players for any given game always excceds online players) it really isn't worth to wonder about "fair" when the only thing you are fighting against is the AI.

For online play, the question could be reversed: Is it fair that 16:10 users see less of the scene? If you go out and buy a new screen today, 16:10 or 16:9 is what you are going to get, unless you look very specifically for 4:3 ratios. Why punish people with newer equipment when releasing a new game?

The matter is simple that most widescreens today have more resolution than 1280x1024 (the most common 4:3 ratio). 1680x1050 is the smallest you will find on any 20" or 22"  inch wide, I use a 27" with 1920x1200, many a 24" with the same resolution or play on their LCD-TV which does 1920x1080.

It makes no sense to "compress" the same scene on such a high resolution, when by widening the FOV you could actually get the same amount of detail per degree of FOV, but with a wider FOV.

Besides, it is simple wrong: The natural viewing angle of a 16:10 screen is about 108 degrees with your eyes. Making it 90 means you have the player look trough a magnifying glass, it's not a natural representation of the way our eyes see things.

Anyway, the "View outfit" key permits to look around in any situation...

This has nothing to do with proper widescreen support. But it reminds me that I should also suggest implementation of TrackIR.

 

[Giledhil]

Anyway, the "View outfit" key permits to look around in any situation...

This has nothing to do with proper widescreen support. But it reminds me that I should also suggest implementation of TrackIR.

Tsss... I meant that the FOV change would not be a great advantage for Widescreen players since you can look around with outfit view.

 

[Helmut_AUT]

Sorry, I got your argument in the wrong way then. Apologies.

Still wouldn't compare it, though - the normal FOV you have, you have when fighting, riding, whatever you do. The "look around" view can not be used for anything else but looking around.

I was actually worried BEFORE even posting the topic that the "unfair advantage" discussion might pop up. Which in some ways is painful ironic given that I for one will not buy Warband because it offers MP, but because it offers different SP and better graphics.

 

[UzeroK]

My question is: Is this fair? Is it fair to provide a clear game-play advantage based simply on hardware?

My questions is: Is this fair? Is it fair to provide a clear game-play disadvantage based simply on hardware?
You would certainly agree that this game runs smoother on a high-end machine than on a low end office
machine. It's just a matter of perspective.

The actual situation is a disadvantage for widescreen users, it forces you to play windows at a lower resolution
or with crappy pixel interpollation in fullscreen mode when you want to see the whole FOV.


Devs please adress this topic, widescreen displays are become more and more popular in the future I think.

 

[Helmut_AUT]

Like I said in the other widescreen thread - not directed at anyone in particular, just to bear in mind:

I hope we can continue to see improvements to M&B without every time it being a question of "is this fair", since by and large M&B is and likely will remain a single player game, and the AI doesn't care what screen you use. Most games I play these days have been designed without multiplayer in mind, and it shows in a very well-done SP experience. Would be a shame if adding the option of MP to the mix reduces the overall quality of the product just because of a mindset that doesn't want to lose.

 

[Darkness]

In the second ss it's clear that the FOV is simply been compressed vertically to compensate for the increase in width, the FOV remains the same. I know that many other games do "support wide screens" in that they actually provide a wider FOV for wide screens. My question is: Is this fair? Is it fair to provide a clear game-play advantage based simply on hardware?

Is it fair that 4:3 views can see more (height wise) than 16:9 or 16:10? Thus giving people with older monitors a clear advantage in being able to see a horse coming from farther away or an enemy trying to get the jump on you before people with widescreens do?

I think it would be balanced if FOV was implemented. 4:3 get to see more high and low, 16:9/10 would get to see more wide (left-right).

Edit: Changed wording to avoid confusion

 

[UzeroK]

I think it is balanced. 4:3 get to see more high, 16:9/10 get to see more wide.

Actually with a widescreen it's more like you play with a 4:3 and a higher resolution having cut top and bottom of your FOV
to emulate a widescreen.

 

[Darkness]

I think it is balanced. 4:3 get to see more high, 16:9/10 get to see more wide.

Actually with a widescreen it's more like you play with a 4:3 and a higher resolution having cut top and bottom of your FOV
to emulate a widescreen.

Er, yes, that is exactly what happens. But people were questioning the fairness of having a wider-FOV. So I was saying, 4:3 you get to see more top and bottom and if we had more FOV, widescreen would see less top and bottom but more right and left. Sorry for the confusion, ill change it a bit

 

[UzeroK]

I think it is balanced. 4:3 get to see more high, 16:9/10 get to see more wide.

Actually with a widescreen it's more like you play with a 4:3 and a higher resolution having cut top and bottom of your FOV
to emulate a widescreen.

Er, yes, that is exactly what happens. But people were questioning the fairness of having a wider-FOV. So I was saying, 4:3 you get to see more top and bottom and if we had more FOV, widescreen would see less top and bottom but more right and left. Sorry for the confusion, ill change it a bit

That would be agreeable.

 

[Helmut_AUT]

If we had more FOV, we (widescreeners) would see the same top and bottom AND more left and right. You can't change one without the other.

There is just no way to make different aspect ratio screens show the same exact image. The best solution might be the user-customizable FOV I mentioned earlier, since everyone could pick himself what suits him - and going super wide out is not actually an advantage either.

BTW, right now 1st person players have less FOV than third person players (90 to 97 degrees). No one would think that a problem.

 

[brunoxyz]

I don't think the difference between wide screen and the regular one is that big...    I do not see it as an advantage over other players really,

but it bothers me visually, specially the interface and menus which all look stretched and unprofessional, no offense intended. I just wish they fixed this issue,  I am pretty sure most people or a good portion are using wide screens. I mean, you can hardly find the old format in stores anymore.

 

[Amotea]

Damn spoiled kids these days with their 100 gigawatt hard drives, in my days we payed $2000 for a Commodore with 64 kilobytes of memory and only used a fraction of that. Why did they ever create this bloaty software that uses more than 10 kilobytes .