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Balbor

Recruit
The stewarding Perk Hands is currently one of the most, if not the most powerful in the game, especially when coupled with smithing.
The descriptions says that discarded weapons (including shields, arrows bolts etc) gives XP to troops. By crafting high level two handed swords or slashing pole weapons the player can very quickly turn T1 recruits into T5 soldiers in minutes without them ever fighting a battle. I believe the XP is 50% of the value, given across troops in your party that would take them up to their next level. I have not tested the Armour equivalent of this perk which won’t suffer from the boost smithing gives it, although some suggestions could apply to both.

suggestions for improvement to stop this being over powered.
1 Give all items a set value (say 100xp), or a value based on the item tier (25, 50, 100, 200, 300 for example).
2 Exclude Crafted items from counting towards XP. However maybe adding an ability to a smithing perk to allow them to be donated. Maybe a secondary effect of experienced smith or artisan smith, or add a new perk called Military Smith at L200 (this could also increase the chance of finding better quality items on the battlefield.
3 Have only T0, T1 and T2 troops gain XP from donated weapons, meaning it can only be used to upgrade to T3. T3+ troops are seen more professional who would not make do with looted weapons.
4 Noble Units are not effected for similar reason as stated above.
 

Aurex

Regular
WB
I won't even tell you what I misread the topic's title as.
I agree that the perk is a little bit overpowered at the moment. They might give it a cooldown, but I do agree with all your points nevertheless! (Aside from maybe the noble units, I'd keep them upgradeable that way but with VERY expensive weaponry and armor)
 
I think the best way to balance this perk is the same as what they need to do to balance smithing.
Warband did not have smithing so the only way to have strong weapons without the player being able to get them until late game was to make them worth an absolute load of money.

Now that we have smithing, there is really no reason to have weapons be worth so much. Make it so the highest tier of weapon you can buy is say tier 3 and reduce the cost of those weapons down to say 5k. The higher tier weapons can only be made thru smithing, so either you have the smithing level to make them, or you can commission them to be made by another NPC. With this system, there will be no need for any weapon to be worth more than say 10-12k. Players will still be preventing from getting the best weapons early due to not having the smithing skill, or the money to commission a weapon from an NPC, and smithing wont nearly be as much of a money machine because even the best weapons wont sell for more than 5k or so, rather than the 100k+ they do now. As donation xp is based on the value of the item, this would also balance this perk.
 
Smithing is a broken feature - sadly. It feels unfitted whatever we do with it.

Players will still be preventing from getting the best weapons early due to not having the smithing skill, or the money to commission a weapon from an NPC

Alot less money is needed - the nerf does not do anything to balance crafting/gear economy - you can still commision the armour you want from smiths for the money you earn from Smithing.

The only solution is to massively reduce the sell-price for crafted items - Say like 80%! That and a few perks along smithing to improve the sellprice. Last 25% could be unlocked at skill 225 - "Sigill of the master". Just because you can produce weapons does not mean you are a respected artisan.

We can still reduce all prices of gear if we want. But that alone does not solve the Smithing OPness.
 
Perks to improve the sell price will Not only continue the problem, but it would simply make smithing even more essential. Now you can just put a few points and smithing And make infinite money. Then you would have to go all in to smithing but the money you would make would still far exceed anything else in game so you would still feel forced to do so. Also just reducing the value of crafted items wouldn’t make sense once you get to late game and you are crafting legendary items that Are worth a fifth of what they’re worse counterparts are.
 
Perks to improve the sell price will Not only continue the problem, but it would simply make smithing even more essential. Now you can just put a few points and smithing And make infinite money. Then you would have to go all in to smithing but the money you would make would still far exceed anything else in game so you would still feel forced to do so. Also just reducing the value of crafted items wouldn’t make sense once you get to late game and you are crafting legendary items that Are worth a fifth of what they’re worse counterparts are.

Then we are back to
Smithing is a broken feature - sadly. It feels unfitted whatever we do with it.
 

murtega

Knight
Among all the unreasonable mechanics in the game, this one is probably the worst so far. How are my troops gaining experience when I dump some junk on the floor? I suppose they pick up the garbage and abuse smiting like player does? I'd like to know the thought exercise TWs had before deciding to implement this.

If you're unhappy with loot making so much money, thus encourage player to abandon it, then make stuff cheaper or give less loot after battles.
If you're unhappy how long it takes to tier up peasants without battling looters, either boost those perks that give your troops passive XP or implement more.

This perk is plain stupid.
 
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Among all the unreasonable mechanics in the game, this one is probably the worst so far. How are my troops gaining experience when I dump some junk on the floor? I suppose they pick up the garbage and abuse smiting like player does? I'd like to know the thought exercise TWs had before deciding to implement this.

If you're unhappy with loot making so much money, thus encourage player to abandon it, then make stuff cheaper or give less loot after battles.
If you're unhappy how long it takes to tier up peasants without battling looters, either boost those perks that give your troops passive XP or implement more.

This perk is plain stupid.
I think the point of the perk Is to help the player amass replacement armies quickly in the later game, especially that training is no longer a skill in the game.
 
The stewarding Perk Hands is currently one of the most, if not the most powerful in the game, especially when coupled with smithing.
The descriptions says that discarded weapons (including shields, arrows bolts etc) gives XP to troops. By crafting high level two handed swords or slashing pole weapons the player can very quickly turn T1 recruits into T5 soldiers in minutes without them ever fighting a battle. I believe the XP is 50% of the value, given across troops in your party that would take them up to their next level. I have not tested the Armour equivalent of this perk which won’t suffer from the boost smithing gives it, although some suggestions could apply to both.

suggestions for improvement to stop this being over powered.
1 Give all items a set value (say 100xp), or a value based on the item tier (25, 50, 100, 200, 300 for example).
2 Exclude Crafted items from counting towards XP. However maybe adding an ability to a smithing perk to allow them to be donated. Maybe a secondary effect of experienced smith or artisan smith, or add a new perk called Military Smith at L200 (this could also increase the chance of finding better quality items on the battlefield.
3 Have only T0, T1 and T2 troops gain XP from donated weapons, meaning it can only be used to upgrade to T3. T3+ troops are seen more professional who would not make do with looted weapons.
4 Noble Units are not effected for similar reason as stated above.
I agree with all of this, good thinking. Another option is locking the tier of weapon to the tier of unit, e.g recruit only needs stuff like a hatchet while a t3 troop needs a t3+ weapon to get XP.
 

csefff

Recruit
The intention of this perk is for the player to decide between cash or xp once they've completed a battle - ergo the current effect of being able to supply your own items into the calculation is an unintentional side effect. Only items flagged as generated from battle should enter the calculation. Most other options seem to be complicating the feature and/or minimising the exploit, but not removing it.
 

svelok

Sergeant
The intention of this perk is for the player to decide between cash or xp once they've completed a battle - ergo the current effect of being able to supply your own items into the calculation is an unintentional side effect. Only items flagged as generated from battle should enter the calculation. Most other options seem to be complicating the feature and/or minimising the exploit, but not removing it.
I honestly think the perk should be scrapped, and the function should be made into a universal post-battle dialog option.
 

csefff

Recruit
I honestly think the perk should be scrapped, and the function should be made into a universal post-battle dialog option.
I'd agree with that, but I think in general the player progression system is really bloated. Off specific topic, but there are a mix of modifiers and mechanics - I tend to spend most of my time working toward one mechanic or another. Would be better if they were taken out and connected more to roles that players wanted to explore on their playthrough (so probs mutually exclusive for most immersion/replay), or as you say, common mechanics outside of player progression

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