Statement regarding Singleplayer IV

Users who are viewing this thread

Lesbosisles

Knight
agree, neither the intended system (daughters get culture form mother, sons from father) n
Prrsonally, I'd go with the tutor system with the choice between mother and father's cultures. This would allow player to wisely distribute the governer heirs among the fiefs with different cultures, thus, compensating a governor's culture penalty which is win-win.
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
Armor Effectiveness: This has been a topic of passionate discussion and we are happy to let you know that we are close to releasing an adjustment aimed at making armor more effective. This will not adopt the warband system, but it will go towards stronger protection.
This is really good to hear. Although it will not adopt Warband system, I hope it will be closer to Warband state then the current state we have.
Instead, you will be able to change the perks of your characters and clan members as you play.
Not gonna lie, this is not good to hear. I mean it is like hard decision to make bc you can not turn on that decision and it gives certain sensation of real life. Do not treat you players like a child, please.
For this purpose, we are exploring marriage, mercenary and vassalage offers.
Oh god, thank you. Please add this. When I got vassalage offers in Warband, it gave a feeling that I am in a living world.
The all knowing encyclopedia is not just a challenge to immersion, but also inconsistent with our scouting mechanic. To address this, we are working on similar limitations to the encyclopedia that will create a form of “Fog of War ” for those that are outside the reach of the player or their agents.
Just great. Although I loved the new encyclopedia in Bannerlord, it being google is unimmersive as hell.
 

dannazgu

Sergeant at Arms
The current (bugged) system is that children always inherit the culture from their mother. Before this bug was introduced, the sytem was that daughters inherit the culture from their mothers and son from their fathers.


I agree, neither the intended system (daughters get culture form mother, sons from father) nor the current bugged one make that much sense. E.g, if Derthert marries a Empire noblewoman, why would their daughters be educated in Empire culture rather than Vlandian? They are Vlandian princesses after all.

As dannazgu states, the Crusader Kings system would (imo) be the best. For Bannerlord this means that children would inherit the culture from their clan (=father, unless child is part of its mother's dynasty/clan). Maybe also with the option to educate a child in a specific culture, potentially with some requirements (like a qualified tutor - could be a charm perk that allows characters to educate children in their culture)
I know it's different games and would understand if never would be a thing in game, of course (tutor - changing culture, etc), but I'd like them to save the children from being born in "wrong" culture or taking just one side, makes all children the fathers culture or like was before as some ppl claimed: the boy (father) girl (culture)

because can be a way to cheat win on a game the player already beats AI, so i don't have hopes on that. but, seem all changes they inted do i'm happy and fixing bugs

i'm just happy they'll implement Main hero death (sorry, Duh, the time i was on the forum and nagged you many times about that, but thnks for considerate)
 
Last edited:

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
I read your initial statement as "I am unable to give formations orders in sieges". What you are describing here seems like a different issue, which I will bring up internally.
Thank you very much for bringing it up!
I don't list medicine here (the future plans post is a separate, older announcement), because it currently has not received changes to its progression. I think this would be one of the items that will be further investigated after the first batch of changes hits.
That's surprising. Over a year ago we had a little discussion on this topic and it seemed it was being investigated:
Yes, I am investigating new ways (some of them peaceful) options to improve the medicine skill. I will try to balance the current experience gains (by increasing) as well.
Also, for some of the other skills, we are analyzing their current situation with @Duh_TaleWorlds, hopefully, this will give more insight into skill experience gains and their effects.
However, I understand many things change and I'm not trying to say there is anything wrong with changing course or priorities. I just want to re-state that Medicine, or rather enhanced survivability of troops is a very useful and rewarding ability to have and having it take literally the entire game to reach high levels is not a good progression rate. It needs to be there BEFORE the bulk of the player's battles to be effective. Furthermore, the requirement to have defeated units to raise medicine is just not appropriate as the sole means to raise it as the player strives for little or no losses.
Occasional offers by mercenary minor factions may be a good idea, but they are not currently being worked on.
I brought this up before but: The AI spends zero campaign time to hire mercs and can even hire them remotely while in prison (and get married or receive new vassals...). If mercenaries are supposed to be for the player too we need a proactive way to hire them like a messages system or representative in our court (that doesn't exist yet). Or, you could remove the cheat of letting the AI hire them (and recruiting clans or getting married) remotely and instantly. It would actually be really good if the AI had to STOP and waste it's campaign time just like the player to do all these things.
 

black_bulldog

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
  • Sieges
    • Sieges represent one of our most complex gameplay experiences and we continue to polish the many pieces that make up this puzzle. To give a recent example, we overhauled the way that both AI attackers and defenders use troop transfers (between formations) in sieges. This was done to reduce transfers at inconvenient times, in quick succession or with poor overall oversight, which could lead to large numbers of soldiers being transferred from opposite sites unnecessarily.
Any improvement is welcome because sieges are still horrible.

  • Battles
    • While combat is certainly one of the game’s strong points, there are always things to be improved upon - and one of them is the way in which reinforcements enter the battlefield. Specifically, we have been working on means to prevent cases of “spawn camping” and troops suddenly appearing in the middle of an active fight.
Thank god imho this is long overdue.

  • Armor Effectiveness
    • This has been a topic of passionate discussion and we are happy to let you know that we are close to releasing an adjustment aimed at making armor more effective. This will not adopt the warband system, but it will go towards stronger protection.
I'm cautiously optimistic about this. I doubt Taleworlds will get it near where I feel it should be but if armor is better and higher tier troops can outlast lower tiers then it's a good change.
  • Combat Mechanic Improvements
    • We have gone over the combat mechanics for knock down, dismounting and push back and removed the random factor to allow for a more reliable and predictable experience for players. Among other things, we also introduced a new resistance variable that is derived from character skills. This allows us to make some troops and heroes less vulnerable to these mechanics and will allow players to develop their characters to become less vulnerable as well.
Rng sux having a reliable to push back, kd etc is appreciated.
  • We also don’t like peacetime armies.
So say all of us.
  • “Party Templates”
    • The idea of parties that reflect their leader’s preferences has gone through some iterations since we originally shared it. Nonetheless, we still intend to pursue the approach that weighs recruitment and upgrading according to this preference. The initial, releasable implementation is close to completion and we hope to soon evaluate it further based on player feedback.
?
  • Crafting Unlock Overhaul
    • With this broader pool of crafting pieces, we also had another look at how crafting works. We don’t really like that all crafting pieces are unlocked from the same source. Instead, we want to provide more of a sense of specialization. Thus, future smiths will, for example, need to craft axes to unlock axe pieces.
While this is a step in the right direction please please please get rid of random unlocks as I said before rng sux and makes game play tedious.
  • Recruit balance
    • Calradians have seemingly always been happy to join a good fight. However, recruits are not just plentiful but oftentimes overly powerful. This has been raised in the community before and we also recognize it as an issue and have made according adjustments to the way notables develop their troops.
I agree recruits too powerful but they're way too plentiful.
  • Child generation
    • Despite our previous adjustments to the adult population, there was still a problem with an initial generational gap. To address this, we will likely generate additional children with different ages at the start of the game for any clans that fall under a given member limit. As an extra, this should also make such clans more viable.
Good
  • Character Respeccing
    • With the multitude of perks that the game offers, it can be difficult to find the character setup that is just right for you. Fortunately, it will soon no longer be required to wait for your heir to take over or to start a new game to try out another character build. Instead, you will be able to change the perks of your characters and clan members as you play.
Wow not this is unexpected and but a welcome change. I think most veterans have a pretty good idea of how to spec their character but companions needed this badly. This also helps new players how find they either don't like how they've speced their character or find it doesn't work so really nice change.
  • Skill experience gains
    • Character development is an important aspect of the game that follows the principle of learning by doing. While this generally works, we feel that some skills don’t yet offer an adequate progression. Fortunately, the aforementioned economy changes should help with trade. Additionally, we have also been working on more tailored adjustments for all combat skills, leadership, roguery and engineering. We look forward to your feedback on this.
You need to look at medicine too because having to suicide tons of troops just to level up medicine is bass ackwards.
  • Immersion & Quality of Life
    • Party Management Options
      • Clan members can, at times, be a hassle to track down and manage. To address this, we have been exploring new options to send, recall and exchange them.
Can we also get a way to message other lords and mercenary clans because it's kind of bs the npc lords can do it but we can't.
  • Civilian Scenes
    • Our towns and castles have a range of NPC characters that can partake in numerous activities to give the location life. However, castles, in particular, were still a bit underpopulated. This should be improved in future versions of the game as we increased the population and their use of animation points in a number of settlements.
This is great but just filling the castles with npcs isn't going to change anything for the player. You need to give players a reason to go to castles, like special quests or a random trader who stops by that has rare or unique merchandise or maybe a really good potential companion can be recruited if you're able to get to them in a few days. Castles aren't worth the time it takes to upgrade them, they need to be a constant but not large source of income because all they are now is a drain on resources and I'm not talking about upgrades.
A ways ahead

As the attentive reader will surely have noticed, there are some topics that we haven’t covered yet. In our future plans, we spoke about Banner Bearers, Claimant Quests, Sally Outs and Vocalization. These are all areas that we are still pursuing, but they will require some time yet. Once we have made more progress on them and other topics, we will be happy to share further details.
I'm glad to see this kind of stuff hasn't been tossed by the roadside. It may seem insignificant but can greatly help make the world seem more immersive.
This is the kind of update I've been hoping to see. I just hope that Taleworlds doesn't take another 2+ years to finish ea because if you guys keep moving at the same rate I might be dead before it's fully released.
 

Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
The Hero Death would be great and also really make a line of succession more important. Combined with the character respeccing is just *chef's kiss*.

And I guess the poll with a 150 to 1 for armor effectiveness won it. I hope @MRay won't be too bummed about it, it was a neck and neck race after all.
 

Duh_TaleWorlds

Developer
Hmm, does that include any random events a player can interact with (alley robbery, drunkards at taverns, etc.) or was it meant that simply more scenes animations will be added?
It concerns purely cosmetic improvements. From my understanding, it is castles, in particular, that will benefit from it.

Also, In the previous 'Future plans' topic I remember there was a point of adding more bandit hideouts. I cannot see this point mentioned here and I also can't remember any new hideouts being added during the 1.7.0-1.7.2 period. Was it dropped or does the team continue their work on that?
While I noted this in the OP
Over the course of development our focus shifted away from smaller locations and more towards ensuring greater variety and quality in core gameplay areas. As such, we have been working hard on creating the remaining town scenes, which will offer new siege challenges, as well as additional battle terrains to cover further regions of interest. Naturally, we also continue to improve our existing scenes.
It is not entirely impossible for some additional scenes in this regard. However, it is too early for me to really say much on that.

Not gonna lie, this is not good to hear. I mean it is like hard decision to make bc you can not turn on that decision and it gives certain sensation of real life. Do not treat you players like a child, please.
It will be your choice to use it or not.

That's surprising. Over a year ago we had a little discussion on this topic and it seemed it was being investigated:
It is being looked into and I don't think it unlikely that we will see adjustments. Thanks for raising it again!

Can we also get a way to message other lords and mercenary clans because it's kind of bs the npc lords can do it but we can't.
From what I remember, AI clans also need to be within a certain range of whoever they wish to interact with. So it's not quite a universal line. I don't think we will get a direct messenger system, but maybe a solution/improvement for mercenaries can be found.

And I guess the poll with a 150 to 1 for armor effectiveness won it. I hope @MRay won't be too bummed about it, it was a neck and neck race after all.
The decision to work on and make adjustments to armor had been made (and communicated iirc) before the poll was created.
 

MRay

Developer
And I guess the poll with a 150 to 1 for armor effectiveness won it. I hope @MRay won't be too bummed about it, it was a neck and neck race after all.
Oh I'm devastated ? /s

You can guess I was aware of the changes and discussed it with @Duh_TaleWorlds before that thread. We both like the new calculations(at least it's better than before) and I think you guys will like it too.
 
I brought this up before but: The AI spends zero campaign time to hire mercs and can even hire them remotely while in prison (and get married or receive new vassals...). If mercenaries are supposed to be for the player too we need a proactive way to hire them like a messages system or representative in our court (that doesn't exist yet). Or, you could remove the cheat of letting the AI hire them (and recruiting clans or getting married) remotely and instantly. It would actually be really good if the AI had to STOP and waste it's campaign time just like the player to do all these things.
100%. AI factions being able to hire mercs from anywhere on the map while the player has to meet them in person is obvious artificial difficulty & objectively bad game design. We shouldn't have to ask repeatedly for a fair system for months on end, good designers would've made it fair from the start.
 

epil

Recruit
Thank you for the detailed statement regarding singleplayer.
Is it safe to assume we will have a major diplomacy overhaul in the future (/near future)?
No. The post explains most of the major items that we are working on. For additional details, you may refer to the future plans post.

If you do have specific suggestions though, they can be taken into account.
Could you please elaborate why diplomacy won't get necessary attention before the release? As I can tell, we only got 3 minor changes regarding that section since EA started:
1)Kingdom creation is implemented (it was possible via storyline missions before this implementation)
2)Declare war & make peace options are implemented
3)Tribute system is implemented.

I observe that most of the players still think (including myself), current kingdom management and diplomatic interactions in this game are very shallow, unbalanced and oversimplified. I speculate that overwhelming majority of players would prefer a decent diplomacy overhaul rather than features like battle terrain system.

I'm following development of this game since it's announcement in 2012 and I and most of the Warband players excited and hoped that this game would surpass Warband in terms of kingdom management and diplomacy, since it's a sequel and development updates before the EA release indicated that. But I think most of the players would agree with me that, Bannerlord didn't surpass Warband in that regard and some Warband features regarding diplomatic interactions are still missing in Bannerlord (They've been stated numerous times in this forum.) I, personally thought that Bannerlord would "at least" consist features in Warband Diplomacy mod (like Alliances, Trade agreements, Non-aggression pacts etc.)

If you do have specific suggestions though, they can be taken into account.

Specific suggestions about diplomacy + kingdom management are persistently suggested by playerbase in this forum since the start of EA but I personally never seen developers attending these discussions (except @mexxico ). Since start of EA, both diplomacy section of this game and discussions about this section are neglected by developers, with the exception of @mexxico, who left TW previous year. Despite improved diplomacy and kingdom management being one of the most anticipated features of the Bannerlord by players since it's announcement, I don't understand why developers wouldn't do anything about it.
 

Duh_TaleWorlds

Developer
Could you please elaborate why diplomacy won't get necessary attention before the release? As I can tell, we only got 3 minor changes regarding that section since EA started:
1)Kingdom creation is implemented (it was possible via storyline missions before this implementation)
2)Declare war & make peace options are implemented
3)Tribute system is implemented.
There were other changes such as adjustments to war & peace logic, abdications, turning companions into lords, war priorities, granting a fief to one of your vassals, ability to hire mercenaries, etc. but regardless of that, the ultimate reason for these decisions, in my view, is scope & opportunity cost. That isn't to say that these topics (like Alliances, Trade agreements, Non-aggression pacts etc.) may not be explored in some other form in the future, but they are not part of the (current) plans for the base game.

Naturally, if you do have a specific suggestion (other or more detailed than the above), I may be able to respond to it more specifically.
 

Bjorn The Upset

Grandmaster Knight
WBVCNWWF&SM&B
It will be your choice to use it or not.
I do not know. Most probably, I will never use this but there will be always a voice in my head that "hey, you can change this if you do not like". You could add this as an optional choice in the start of the campaign like other optional features.

Regarding diplomacy, what will be the choices in the diplomacy tab when we are bartering with the lords. 2 years passed and we still know nothing about that greyed out diplomacy tab.
 

Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
The decision to work on and make adjustments to armor had been made (and communicated iirc) before the poll was created.

What are you doing?! Stick to the script! You worked together in this EA with the community and couldn't have done it without their input.
rowan-atkinson-mr-bean.gif
 

murtega

Sergeant Knight
  • Scenes
    • Over the course of development our focus shifted away from smaller locations and more towards ensuring greater variety and quality in core gameplay areas. As such, we have been working hard on creating the remaining town scenes, which will offer new siege challenges, as well as additional battle terrains to cover further regions of interest. Naturally, we also continue to improve our existing scenes.
    • As this concerns a particularly large body of work, it won’t all drop at once but there will be continuous updates.
Is there a plan to eventually make all locations (castles, villages, etc) unique or only towns?
 

Duh_TaleWorlds

Developer
Is there a plan to eventually make all locations (castles, villages, etc) unique or only towns?
I think this covers it:
Over the course of development our focus shifted away from smaller locations and more towards ensuring greater variety and quality in core gameplay areas.
There may be some additional village or castle scenes, but the focus has shifted elsewhere.
 

epil

Recruit
Naturally, if you do have a specific suggestion (other or more detailed than the above), I may be able to respond to it more specifically.
I had some specific suggestions in different threads about diplomatic interactions + kingdom management since 2nd April 2020 in the threads like: Kingdom and Diplomacy suggestions, Dynamic factions instead of 'no snowballing'., Strong King status + Return of Marshall status + Longer truces + Feasts and Lobbying.

Of course I know that game passed the point which these suggestions could be implemented and is near to the release period so I don't persist my old suggestions but for specifically talking, I would like this game to have at least:

1)Alliances between factions + Alliances trough marriages between clans
(
This is two different type of alliances):
*Feature of alliances between factions could fulfill the mission of coalition against stronger factions. Weak factions would ally with each other against snowballing faction in order to stop the snowballing.
*Alliances between clans trough marriages would fulfill the historical meaning of medieval marriages. This feature can be implemented like this:
a)If allied clans are in the same faction, they tend to support each other in votings + they tend to support each other when their settlements are under attack.
b)If allied clans are in different and hostile factions, if they're not the faction leaders, allied clans would tend to ignore each others settlements and tend to not pursue each other when they're leading an army in campaign map, as a favor to their allies.
c)If allied clans are in different factions and both of the parties in allied clans are the faction leaders, these factions would tend to not declare war on each other.
d)If a clan is allied with ruling clan in the same faction, it increases other clans attitude towards voting in favor of them when succession occurs.
e)It should be way harder to conduct marriage with powerful or ruling clan's family. Ruling clans tend to marry their family with other ruling clans or powerful clans.

2)Non-aggression pacts: Factions would strategically need it in necessary circumstances. Especially when their economy and military is shattered or when they're losing wars, factions could seek non-aggression pacts with some of it's neighbors in order to avert multi-front wars. When factions sign it, they will unable to declare war on each other for specified period of time (like 3-5 years).

3)Trade agreements: Friendly factions could boost the trade between them for common profit and increasing relations.

4)Border disputes & events which causes wars between factions (I liked this feature in the Warband. This feature is a small work but it's adding such a good immersion that player thinks wars are not popping out of nowhere. But in Bannerlord, wars are randomly declared, without a pretext so it lacks the immersion.)

5)Courts & faction capitals (game currently lacks meaningful faction capital and kingdom court mechanisms, where state affairs would be handled. Courts with ministers exists in Warband.)

6)Persuasion overhaul (actually persuasion mechanism in Warband was more immersive, in this game it's like a rolling dice because player can see outcomes and possibilities in given percentages.)

7)Renouncing the tribute Tribute paying faction should be able to renounce the payment obligation after certain period of time without having to declare war on receiving faction. This option would nullify the tribute situation between factions and receiving faction would have option to instantly go to war with renouncing faction to overrule the decision. If receiving faction is in a dire situation with other factions and attacking the renouncing faction isn't plausible in terms of military situation, receiving faction would have to tolerate the renouncement decision.

This feature would allow paying factions to nullify their tributes without having to declare war on receiving factions. This feature would solve the cycle of war between factions which declare wars in each other in order to become the receiving side of the tribute rather than paying side, because game currently lacks mechanism to nullify the tribute payments between factions once the first war starts.

That isn't to say that these topics (like Alliances, Trade agreements, Non-aggression pacts etc.) may not be explored in some other form in the future, but they are not part of the (current) plans for the base game.
This is good to hear. I understand that TW wants to release this game in short period of time so management doesn't want to complicate the balance by extending the diplomacy right now but if these features are to be added after the full release, it's a positive thing in my opinion.
 
Last edited:

Akka

Sergeant at Arms
Oh I'm devastated ? /s

You can guess I was aware of the changes and discussed it with @Duh_TaleWorlds before that thread. We both like the new calculations(at least it's better than before) and I think you guys will like it too.
I hope so, but honestly I don't understand how the first formula existed in the first place. It's incredibly convoluted and unintuitive to, in the end, give most unsatisfactory results. I really don't get why you didn't just go for a much simpler and easy-to-grasp one that would have simply done the job better.

So I admit I'm a bit wary of what the minds that thought the initial version was good, to the point of resisting any change for two years, will end up chosing.
Though I'd be happy to be proved wrong.
 
Top Bottom