im not 100% sure saying the spears right now are fine but for me they feel okay and they don't need a buff
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Spears are too overpowered
- Thread starter Morow
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- @nerfspear
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Should he post a video of thrusting his spear into a guys shield for 2 minutes instead? Surely that will better show how theyre OP and their many issuesThat is what I mean like every single guy that says "spears are op" post video of themselves stabbing people in the back with a spear or stabbing people who arent blocking and they be like "sPeArs aRe oP" and thats their reasoning?? I understand that the animation might need tweaking (which it most likely will) but other than that its fine?
Maybe I will demonstrate how shields are OP by not blocking at all and letting people cut me up
How about you stop ignoring everything thats an actual argument and then claiming there were no proper arguments?
I'll say it again, add me on steam, I'll beat you in 1v1 with a shield/spear combo, you pick whatever you like.
Also, if you don't believe us, why don't you contact the person that made the spears are too underpowered thread? Read their edit, you might be surprised
Anyone that thinks spear and shield is OP has probably never gone up against a 1h + shield combo. Assuming the players are equally skilled, you're not going to win against the sword. Good luck shield bashing that guy. Good luck getting any damage in other than glance damage.
Any generalizations to weapons in this game is an awful argument from right off the bat. Spears are ONLY good right now with caveats. By themselves in a 1v1 they're absolute garbage against anyone that can block even 1 or 2 attacks.
In TDM with lots of players, yep, you're right, spear and shield is very, very good. But that's only because you have teammates to cover for you and you have a shield. In fact I'd say the shield is the problem here, not the spear. Spears do pretty awful damage most of the time if you're two handing them, and one handed you need a shield to do anything at all.
Also I don't know why no one has called out OP when he says that there's no glancing with a spear. Have you ever fought someone who walks directly up to you and hugs you? You will do precisely no damage to them. Maybe you're fighting people who play to your advantage (TDM is filled with people that are new or are distracted by other things going on) but the idea that spears and polearms in general in this game hit for full damage in the beginning of the thrust is wrong.
Any generalizations to weapons in this game is an awful argument from right off the bat. Spears are ONLY good right now with caveats. By themselves in a 1v1 they're absolute garbage against anyone that can block even 1 or 2 attacks.
In TDM with lots of players, yep, you're right, spear and shield is very, very good. But that's only because you have teammates to cover for you and you have a shield. In fact I'd say the shield is the problem here, not the spear. Spears do pretty awful damage most of the time if you're two handing them, and one handed you need a shield to do anything at all.
Also I don't know why no one has called out OP when he says that there's no glancing with a spear. Have you ever fought someone who walks directly up to you and hugs you? You will do precisely no damage to them. Maybe you're fighting people who play to your advantage (TDM is filled with people that are new or are distracted by other things going on) but the idea that spears and polearms in general in this game hit for full damage in the beginning of the thrust is wrong.
Pretty sure when most people say Spears are OP they are including javelins, which wont glance as much while someone is hugging. Otherwise they have learned to turn stab or something because actual spears glance like a mother ****er when someone hugs.
Wrong. Spear and shield is currently way stronger than 1h and shield. Play the game before talking.
That's what I"m talking about though, I know about turn spearing and it's not nearly as effective as it is in BL. Mostly because the damage isn't as high overall as in warband, but also because you actually both turn and move more slowly. Combine that with the fact that overhead turn thrusting usually doesn't even land a solid hit against light armor, and you have a predictable, slower, form of turn thrusting which again, will only work against players who are distracted or haven't seen it before. And sure, I can agree that javelins in melee can be pretty funny. But they're not OP, LoL. You sacrifice the one "good" aspect of spears, the length anyways.
...? Care to explain?
Javs in melee kill enemies with 4 hits, can stop cav doing 70 damage to horses and also do huge amount of damage when thrown.
How can they possibly not be op?
Are you guys playing with your eyes closed?
How can they possibly not be op?
Are you guys playing with your eyes closed?
I never said they were funny, they are quite effective. The length is what lets people glance hits, that isnt a problem with javs.
...? Care to read the thread, watch the videos and play the game?
In single-player, if spears were powerful historically, then the aim should be to try to replicate faithfully within reason.
Whereas for the sake of multiplayer, all weapons, including spears, should continually be balanced to some degree. However the game has an asymmetrical balancing system, so some spears may be, and perhaps should be, quite strong. Respawn cost and troop numbers tend to balance out strong gear, so maybe rather than trying to buff or nerf spears, they get scaled into the troop tiers instead.
Whereas for the sake of multiplayer, all weapons, including spears, should continually be balanced to some degree. However the game has an asymmetrical balancing system, so some spears may be, and perhaps should be, quite strong. Respawn cost and troop numbers tend to balance out strong gear, so maybe rather than trying to buff or nerf spears, they get scaled into the troop tiers instead.
Just shows that people think spear and shield is good, and not much else. As a side note, you'll notice the only time you ever get solid hits with your spear is when your opponents are walking into your attack. I'm not sure what this video is supposed to prove other than your opponents are literally giving you solid hits throughout the video. In fact every single attack that did more than 20 damage involves your opponents walking into your swing. I don't know what to tell you here. Just to drive the point home (lol), in the first 40 seconds I count 4 attacks, 2 of which were where you got kills, where your opponents literally walk into your thrust. Can't make this up, indeed. You didn't even attempt to feint or anything, you just get free hits on them for some reason.
That's fair, I myself wish we had less throwing weapons overall so we can agree that throwing weapons are in a strong position, if for different reasons. I dislike that every single class in the game has a ranged weapon of some kind, javelins / jereeds included. However in a pure melee engagement, I would never, ever go with shield and javelin as a first option. In TDM or Skirmish where teammates can cover for you, sure, I can see a weapon that is versatile as the ash throwing spear being OP. However the thing is, Jereeds don't do as much as that weapon. You won't one shot someone with a jereed or javelin like you would with a throwing spear, and the throwing spear in melee is still better than most spears. Case in point, look at the video that was posted here. You'll notice that when faced with an opponent with a spear and shield and a 2h axe, the guy switches to a sword. I wonder what his reasoning is?
Why do you need to be so hostile? You're not even arguing, you're just being abrasive and counterproductive. If you're on a forum you might as well attempt to make a conversation you know?
The entire freaking thread is people telling you guys that Spears are indeed op as they super strong in teamfights, 1v1s and Xv1s. There's plenty of explanations and videos. Even a guy telling you 'hey add me on steam and I'll show you' and all you keep doing is say no it only works because they play against bad players. Lol. No counter arguments, no Video evidence showing what you think makes spears bad. Nothing. But you argue and demand buffs to them. You're making the games combat even worse than it is now. If you don't know what you're talking about because you're quite new with only barely double digit hours of playtime that's ok. But then be quiet.
No, it's not the only time at all. For pretty much the entirety of the video I was hitting the heaviest armour in the game so 20 dmg hits (although often much higher) is no surprise, nor is damage the only issue with spears. Walking into my thrust adds speed bonus hence damage, good job you figured it out, and the damage can become insanely high with the right conditions. I have feinted throughout the entire video as well, if it appears that they just "got hit" it's either because they thought I'd target switch, or I held the attack, or I feinted very subtly (something you can do due to the spear animations), or I hit them instantly very early in the animation. Why do you think that everyone in the video is using spears? For fun? "I'm not sure what your video is supposed to prove", meanwhile every single infantry in the very same video using spears for the vast majority of the match. Imagine what would've happened if I started using a sword the entire time. You don't even have to imagine. Being forced to get closer, I'd simply get outranged by one of the spears in the groupfight and die, especially since from a distance they'd have an easier time getting around my shield.
No stun on blocked thrusts means they can easily spam thrusts even right up in my face and I have no way of punishing them, putting my guard down to hopelessly try fighting one of them would mean getting stabbed by another one on the side, since there's no stun they don't have to play carefully and can keep spamming thrusts from any distance and waiting until they either land good hits or their other spear teammate helps them. This essentially eliminates any 1vsX potential because the single player has no way to counter a spear as there's no stun to give him a window to punish him, and the spear player doesn't need to pay attention to his movement or timing and can instead freely spam. Other than that they can pretty much deal an instant hit right in your face simply by slightly turning the spear for a brief moment during the release animation when the spear isn't yet moving to aim their hit and land a solid tip thrust regardless of how close they are to you. Essentially while you might glance with a spear when using it against someone right in your face just because you're bad, someone who can actually aim it and time it correctly won't glance, and can even deal a hit so early in the animation that you barely have time to react (for very good damage too). They also have very fast delivery, and upper thrusts make it essentially effortless to land head hits for much higher dmg, combined with speed bonus for more dmg you could get really high dmg hits on the heaviest armour very quickly and all of it risk free.
tl;dr you don't know what you're talking about.
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The problem with "1v1 me and I"ll show you" should be self evident though. There's skill difference, experience in the use of and tactics to counter the spear and shield (or spears in general), ping, and a few other factors I could mention, like there being no dedicated duel server and the fact that these "duels" likely happen in a distracting environment with other stuff going on. I already replied to the video that is woefully rife with issues if used as evidence that spears are OP.
Anyways, my steam is Seldkam, I"m curious nonetheless. I'm always willing to be proven wrong. Whoever here wants to show the power of the combo I"m down to see what it's all about.
@video guy, your response is literally just "if I fight 3 people who outrange me with a sword I lose." I agree!
