Solo Characters versus Partying

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My first character, Abraham, was a well rounded fighter/bowman with good charisma. I always carried several horses to keep up the speed of a good sized party of about thirty medium to knight level men. I enjoyed the game quite a bit, and was satisfied by ordering around my men and taking the reigns of a small army to conquer foreign lands. Combat was less personal but large scale, yet i felt like my actions still mattered in keeping my men alive. When i was present in battle, we'd get maybe a death or two every few battles. When I chose "order your mean into battle", we always lost several men no matter the enemy. I enjoyed fighting because I felt like a real leader, like I was sustaining my group and saving lives, almost. Friendly lives, at least.

This weekend I started a new character with a totally different, much more specialized purpose. I chose to be a Court Lady specializing in polearms. Right from the first time i left Zendar, I knew that, with my absurdly fast spirited courser, I could survive for excessively long periods of time in combat on my own. So i decided to build on this and made a character who can take out entire groups of 30 Dark Hunters/Knights and Khergit without getting hit.

I'm finding the game experience is entirely different now - I don't feel excessively powerful, because it's still easy to get killed if i am careless at all or make a wrong turn somewhere. However, combat isn't about saving my comrades' lives or getting a few kills, it's about surviving an immense gauntlet of enemies totally crazed on killing me, and only me. It's ridiculously frantic, yet the sweeping horse battles are almost beautiful and graceful. Actually, alot of these horse battles play out more like dogfights. I always have enemies on my tail, and others making maneuvers to get a good strafing shot at me. I'm constantly trying to get speed while turning into the enemies to make big passes where I get several hits.

Coming out alive after any of these bouts is more satisfying than anything I've ever done in Mount and Blade. Not only do I get absurdly good inventory catches after those huge battles, but I gain thousands upon thousands of experience points, and levelling is faster than ever. Also, since I'm soloing, I can travel at speeds exceeding 10 almost constantly, provided I have some extra horses to ease the load of my inventory. (I find that speed is everything in both combat and on the map.)

I'm surprised that playing solo is so much fun. Yes, it can be extremely frutrating when you don't pick your battles well - you can lose all your items and lots of money - but the feel of taking on so many men all at once and all by yourself is worth the trouble.

Does anyone else play solo?
 
I play on the hardest difficulty with athletics, throwing weapons and a two handed heavy great axe. I put a ton of points into Tactics to reduce the number of enemies I fight at once and I'm pretty awesome. I can kill a horse with one throwing axe, or if I feel like it I can land a head shot on the rider with one. I can kill up to three or four (forcefully) dismounted men at once with my axe.

Arrows hurt bad, but that's the cost of one hit kills with a giant axe. :cool:
 
That sounds challenging and fun to me. Haven't dared taking on Dark Knights solo yet. River Pirates are quite easy though.

A side question is whether it's worth having extra heroes or not? They do take up 1 slot which is annoying but they also provide good extra skills for training etc. Unfortunatelly as been said before, they fight badly.

Btw, how do you kill more enemies than one with an axe? My axe/sabre allways gets "stuck" in enemies if there are more than one in a row.

BM
 
Bluesman said:
That sounds challenging and fun to me. Haven't dared taking on Dark Knights solo yet. River Pirates are quite easy though.

A side question is whether it's worth having extra heroes or not? They do take up 1 slot which is annoying but they also provide good extra skills for training etc. Unfortunatelly as been said before, they fight badly.

Btw, how do you kill more enemies than one with an axe? My axe/sabre allways gets "stuck" in enemies if there are more than one in a row.

BM

I had a lance rider one game and it's not very difficult, but it is exciting and unpredictable. Most battles consist of you circle riding around groups of enemies and you only dying when you take the stray sword to the head for 70 damage.

You have to be really fast with block and know when to attack. You also have to backpedal when there are more than two enemies and "push" (causing them to backpedal) when there are two or less. The thing is, if an attack hasn't hit you yet, you can still block it. You can block at any time, even when you're in the middle of attacking. Use that to your advantage. If I have more than two enemies on me I backpedal and take them out one at a time. Two or less, I move at them swinging and blocking which causes them to backpedal.
 
Keever - I thought about using tactics, but decided that I specifically enjoy taking on 20 horsemen at once. I have a tactics level of 0.

Bluesman - well, I lied a bit. I "solo" combat, but I keep borcha with me because of his pathfinding and tracking bonuses. I either tell him to dismount and hold position at the start of combat or even make him wait on the map before I fight though.

As far as slots go, since I play without raising men, I can use the slots openly for Borcha and Marnid.
 
I've actually put this game off to play other games until some more features are added (Two of which I want badly are indoor combat and more heroes) but I still love it and check the forums every now and then. When more heroes are added I'm going to have a party consisting JUST of them and give them very good gear. It'll be a band of warriors taking on armies similar to "Fire Emblem"
 
I have TRIED to put this game down, so far failing :smile:. I used to play NWN for my CRPG fix but this is my favourite now.

BM
 
yeah iv also put the game down. After mowing waves of dark knights with my one hit kill axe, it gets kinda repetative. what i wanna see are town/castle battles and an expanded skill/stat system.
 
Well. For a 0.6+ game it has a surprising amount of replayability. It's more addictive than most of my 1.0+ games (or 2.0+ too).

Every little patch seems to add something so I wont put this game down anytime soon.

BM
 
Yeah, once youve got some decent skills and equipment AND the timing down, its hard to lose. Basically its time to start a new character. Soloing all the time probably does make less room for error though. I also would like to try just 5 or 6 heroes against the world (once a few more get added).

I think one of the most important game elements to add is higher level challenges.

like, ummmm..

duels with powerful warlords (with crazy stats)
an endgame quest for the throne of vaegir or swadia
..ran out of ideas...heh

I like the natural wind down of your career in pirates! where your reflexes run down as you get older. Eventually you are too old to win fights and take care of business so you click the retire button and get an end game screen showing your history.
 
I definatlell think this game needs a layer of power politics to give it the real long term power.

A type of War of the Roses scenario would be perfect for this game, already hinted that in suggestions a few times :wink:.

bm
 
I'm a soloist. One of my greatest battles was when I was about level 14 (or there-abouts) taking on 20 - 30 Khergit Bandits or Dark Hunters (the tough ones - I can never remember which). The map I was on was perfect, it had a really high hill that I could get up but the bandits had difficulty with it. I'd get up the top, wait for one of the bandits to make his way up as the others circled down below and then kill the one at the top. Sometimes I'd charge down and see if I could slay one or two as I passed before running off, circling around and heading back up the hill with everyone on my tail. It's a pity you can't save replays. It was a great battle.

Another particularly great solo battle was later when I made a stupid mistake and had my horse taken out. I backed up a hill and was just far enough away to swing a few times and take out some of the guys that were after me. A horseman was coming towards me and I timed it beautifully. Lopped and off the horse he came. I mounted his horse and went back into battle but lost the horse soon afterwards. Backing away again, I managed to take out another horseman and steal his horse. I lost that one though as I think it was pretty damaged (probably from me) and when I was taken down that time I couldn't get away from the 4 guys that were chasing me.

I'm now toying a bit with raising a party seeing as the stats seem to have a limit of 8 and you can't raise them any further? Seriously lamenting the fact there's no town raiding. Go to the barracks at a town, get a Siege weapon or three, take your army to another town and knock down the door for some fat loot.
 
Well after running around with 43 swadian knights and killed any dark knights party without any significant casualty (i did 90% of the killing) on my side it really gets boring. I'm starting to think those army of mine arent that great since they would die alot if i ask them to charge by themselves without me.

Heck whats the purpose of having an army if i'm doing most of the work?

I fired my entire army except Borcha (he has nice path finding and tracking) and marnid (high trade skill) and went out attaking any fools unlucky enough to cross our path.

Woot 75 men dark knights with 50 prisoners, talk about the chance to be a hero ! Yee haa ! Chargee !

Borcha and marnid knocked unconscious in the first wave. I killed 70 and 5 knocked unconscious. Somebody give me a challenge please !

All i do now is finish every quest given by Count of Halmar (I have a rank of knight) but god there is not much variety in the quest, its either supply horses or armor or hunt down raiders or deliver this letter to count A, B, C. Rinse and repeat for every promotion.

Solo all the way for me, no purpose of keeping and paying an army when i'm doing most the work dont you think?



:wink:
 
liek09 said:
Well after running around with 43 swadian knights and killed any dark knights party without any significant casualty (i did 90% of the killing) on my side it really gets boring. I'm starting to think those army of mine arent that great since they would die alot if i ask them to charge by themselves without me.

Heck whats the purpose of having an army if i'm doing most of the work?

I fired my entire army except Borcha (he has nice path finding and tracking) and marnid (high trade skill) and went out attaking any fools unlucky enough to cross our path.

Woot 75 men dark knights with 50 prisoners, talk about the chance to be a hero ! Yee haa ! Chargee !

Borcha and marnid knocked unconscious in the first wave. I killed 70 and 5 knocked unconscious. Somebody give me a challenge please !

All i do now is finish every quest given by Count of Halmar (I have a rank of knight) but god there is not much variety in the quest, its either supply horses or armor or hunt down raiders or deliver this letter to count A, B, C. Rinse and repeat for every promotion.

Solo all the way for me, no purpose of keeping and paying an army when i'm doing most the work dont you think?



:wink:

Singlehandedly defeating 75 Dark Knights and taking 5 prisoners? Wow. I don't think I'll ever be that good. If I were I'd doubt the AI's effectiveness first rather than think I'd become a superhuman killing machine!

I just lost a battle against a dozen Dark Knights and I had three Hired Blades, 3 Sword Sisters, and Borcha, plus my level 16 horse archer character.

Borcha, almost needless to say, was in Dream Land within the first minute. And though the battle was intense they knocked my archer out and took the surviving party members prisoners. It was both amusing and irritating to see my Sword Sister and Hired Blade listed as prisoners when the Dark Knights moved off.

Could use some advice on developing a character that strong. Obviously, I'm allocating my character attributes, skill and weapon points inefficiently.

What level are you? What weapons are you using? How did you allocate your skill points? Your weapon points? Looking for tips. :smile:
 
JS, do you have good leg armor for your character & Borcha? It's important for mounted characters and you'll live a lot longer.
 
JohnathanStrange said:
Singlehandedly defeating 75 Dark Knights and taking 5 prisoners? Wow. I don't think I'll ever be that good.
With a bit of practice you will be. You're only a level 16... What's your equipment like? If you're not on a Spirited Charger ($40,000), wearing a full suit of black armour ($100,000 all up) and swinging a weapon that does at least 35 damage then "you're not there yet". I was seriously getting my head kicked in as a soloist at around the level 14 stage until I finally raised enough cash to get the black armour. You really notice the difference in the amount of damage you take (or don't take). Especially when all I was wearing before were rags.

The critiscism about doing all the work is my main disappointment about the game. The leadership skills and the like really should increase the effectiveness of your men. I think keeping your men alive a lot longer also helps as they level up but even then, one wrong move and they're dead. Even now, at level 46, one wrong move on my horse and I'm very easily taken out even though I've got 94 hit points. If I get off my horse and try and take some guys on on foot, I'm really screwed. While I can ride past and take out a 100+ Swadian War Party (with a bit of effort mind you), the minute I get off my horse I can't even take out 5 peasants because even though I'm hit for very little damage (if any) my attacks keep getting interrupted.

JohnathanStrange said:
What level are you? What weapons are you using? How did you allocate your skill points? Your weapon points? Looking for tips. :smile:
This is me right now. This is my inventory.
A few things to note. The skills that aren't any higher that 8? That's seemingly the maximum any skill can go. Admittedly a little disappointing (boy was I looking forward to having a level 20 power strike skill before I hit level 8 :sad: ).

Weapons proficencies go up as you use them. Even though you don't have the weapon master skill to raise them, by using that fat sword a lot, your skill goes up and up and up, even beyond the 300 maximum that you can raise it (as you can see). Even then, spending weapon points on skills above 100 is a waste of time really. You can dump 10 points into a skill and barely get 1 point increase. Much better to spread them around once they get they high and simply let them increae by using your weapon of choice a lot.

You'll see my dexterity is higher than my strength. That's because dexterity adds to your weapon speed. There comes a point where you don't really need to be that strong because even though it does increase the damage you do, you're much better off being able to swing faster. One of the things you notice about the game is the minute you let anyone get close to you because you either stop moving or run into a tree or are on foot, you're dead. You can't take on 50+ bandits on foot.

That's also why I use a Sword of War, simply because of its range. If I ever do end up on foot, guess what? I use the lance! It's range of 200+ makes it the best weapon in the game to keep enemies at a distance. Simply walking back slowly and lancing is usually enough to keep them off me and for me to get out of there. One other thing you'll notice... Take on a peasant or a river pirate on foot. Just a lone one. The last man left standing. Even as a level 46 and a 35 dexterity, I can't get a swing in (well, I can but usually after a whole boat load of effort - especially against someone with a shield). Why? Every hit you take, even if it does 0 damage, your attack is stopped dead in its tracks and you're open for another attack. Your only choice is to block, block, block but rather annoyingly, that often simply puts you in a stalemate situation where you can't do anything (admittedly, not so tru against 3 peasants and usually you can kill them but when fighting three bandits or so, definately not a good idea on foot on your own). Especially against 3 or more enemies, even peasants.

I prefer the two-handed sword because on a good run through, I can take out usually as many as 3 bandits, sometimes up to 5 or 6. Get your enemies out on flat, level terrain (and preferably not in water - though water can be fun). Run away, slow down, turn, circle back and face them, charge. Swing, swing, swing through. Your best bet if your target has a shield up is to slightly knock your target a bit and then swing. The knock from the horse makes them drop their guard (even if its a 0 damage horse charge) and opens them up for you to take their head off (well, not really but you get the idea). Sometimes a slow circle around a group of 5 guys can take them out easily too. Just keep swinging, they'll follow you around like a bunch of idiots. Time the swings. If they've got a shield up, you can either keep hacking away until you break it or, simply wait until they mvoe to strike you. If you time it right, you can swing in just before they get their swing in and because their defenses are down, you kill them. Also, look over your left shoulder and press attack to attack on your left side. Look over your right shoulder and then press and hold attack to attack from your right side. Master it. Running into the middle of a group and looking left, swing, looking right, swing, looking left, swing can net you a whole lot of kills. This doesn't work on foot. On foot, whatever swing you get is entirely random (major suckage when you want some nice sweeping swings rather than a thrust or overhead hack - the game really should borrow a thing or two from the Thief sword combat system).

As you can see, I'm the occasional horse archer too. I've got 3 lots of those Large Bags of Bodkin Arrows. If I run out (which you often will fighting so many people), run back to your inventory and get more. Whenever you enter battle, try and memorise where you're inventory is so you can find it. I've often lost it on a hill slope or behind a mountain. Plenty of times I've lost it completely in the dark of night.

NEVER GET OFF YOUR HORSE! The game goes from an insta-kill slaughterfest on your behalf over to an insta-death for you. If you ever fall off, back away and retreat. You'll get your horse back and you can run away and fight again. Also, when attacking especially large groups (Swadian War Parties of 100+), it's a good idea to use the "leave battle" after one of the rounds when you're down to less then half health. Then simply run away on horse back with them following you. Keep running around the World Map in circles with them after you until your health is back to a reasomable level and then go in for round two.

By the way, don't let the level 46 fool you. I've been solo-ing since I was level 1. With the right tactics, you'll often find you won't take that much damage. You only ever get damage when you make a stupid mistake, such as charging too slowly into a group of soldiers and then having them hack you to pieces or being too busy looking over your shoulder firing arrows and then running into a tree... Particularly keep an eye out for rocks and trees. :smile: Pick flat open terrain with a clear path and no objects near the soldiers so you can run through, hack and then once passed them slow down and circle back. If you hit a tree out there, they're usually too far away to get you.

One last thing... Watch out for Swadian Crossbowmen (or archers in general). Ever taken 70 damage? You will. If you see an archer pulling back on a bow, get in there and charge for him. Pick your target. Line him up and get in there and take him out ASAP.
 
Toolsong said:
JS, do you have good leg armor for your character & Borcha? It's important for mounted characters and you'll live a lot longer.

Oh, yes, definitely. Not only very good leg armor, but also a chainmail suit and heavy duty helmet (+19). And a spirited armored warhorse (+33 armor). For weapons, I carry a nomad bow, shield and balanced scimitar.

I've also equipped Borcha with the same or better weapons and armor.

I don't try to fight up close to the enemy as I'm good at the quick arrow shot on the move but I'm flexible as to melee or ranged fighting.

Maybe defeating so many Dark Knights solo requires a very high level character? (I'm only lvl 16, I think)

Anyway, I don't know if I would enjoy knowing that I couldn't lose. Where would be the challenge? I still want to learn some tips though.

Thanks.
 
JohnathanStrange said:
Anyway, I don't know if I would enjoy knowing that I couldn't lose. Where would be the challenge? I still want to learn some tips though.
Never think you can't lose. Even at the high levels, you make one wrong move and you're screwed. Mountain bandits with axes can easily and will quite happily hit you for 22+ damage. You don't need many of those to be taken out. Unlike most other RPG-type-things, level increases don't automatically grant bonuses in Hit Points so unless you really, really bump up your strength, you're never going to be all that uber.
 
JohnathanStrange said:
Could use some advice on developing a character that strong. Obviously, I'm allocating my character attributes, skill and weapon points inefficiently.

What level are you? What weapons are you using? How did you allocate your skill points? Your weapon points? Looking for tips. :smile:

Level 39

I'm using Sword of war (Two handed Weapon)

My status:

STR: 17
AGI: 16
INT: 16
CHA:16

Weapon points:

One hand weapon: 209
Two handed weapon: 315

Equipment:

Full set of Black armor (yes that means from helmet to boots) and level 5 full armor horse (Charger)

Strategy:

Run straight (full speed) at enemy and use right hand side attack first then left (rinse and repeat). When i'm surrounded i just turn my horse to right side then draw my sword to back and cut down any enemy near and make a circle movement doing so. Believe it or not that tactic work againts dark knights too. Just stand still with your horse and use your left or right side to cut enemy throats when they get close enough. (Doesnt work againts moving riders though)

Key element of this game is timing. Once your eye and hand coordinations grasp the right timing to attack. Its like a walk in the park. Doesnt matter how many enemy i have to fight, its not like they can level up and increase their skill points like me. Heck one swing of my sword can cut through dark knight's black armor.


:twisted:
 
:smile:

Thanks for all the tips. I'm definitely going to be referring to them as I play.

DarkUnderlord Very interesting and informative post. It was a pleasure to read and I'm certain I will be working on two-handed sword skills, sounds insanely effective and amusing.

Yes, I agree that at times it feels as though I'm "doing all the work" as you say, because our friendlies die so fast at times. It is disappointing that top-grade troops like knights and hired blades still fight clumsily. Ironic that commanding low-level footmen to "hold position" keeps them together and more effectively supporting each other. Ordering elite units to wait seems wasteful but it helps.

Having your own attack interrupted, as you note, can be an effective weapon against you. I've had stones bounce off my armor with 0 damage but more importantly my arrow shot or sword thrust is lost.

Great battle tactics that even lower level characters like mine can profitably use. Thanks.

You've got an awesome set of gear there and some "mad skillz" so you are your own killing machine.

liek09 Thanks for the info and the stats. I certainly have my work cut out for me if I'm going to approach that level of experience.

It's more understandable how solo characters are able to beat the odds once you develop both the character's skills and your own. I'm nowhere near that level. Too much tavern time for me, certainly.

Good point about the key to combat being timing. It's definitely not an arcade type click and try anything. So I'm going to practice a bit more and try to work my way up to the Dark Knights.

Thanks all.
 
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