So, how could the main quest be salvaged?

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stevepine

Knight
I was thinking, everyone knows that the main quest is pretty awful....

So, what could be added or altered to make it.... have meaning? (without completely scrapping it and starting again - which Tale Worlds are highly unlikely to do).

What tweaks and adjustments would stop it feeling so uninspiring and irrelevant?
 
The crazy goose chase to talk to all the lords is handy for new players to explore different parts of the world. If that wouldnt be in, most players would stay in the kingdom they spawn in.

So the idea is good, but the execution is boring as hell. Its just a goose chase.

If every lord had a quest related to its kingdom, culture and with a link to the main storyline. And you had to first complete that quest in order for him to spill the beans and point you to the next person you'd need, then it'd contribute something to the story.

But maybe that'd be too much for a sandbox experience.
 
The crazy goose chase to talk to all the lords is handy for new players to explore different parts of the world. If that wouldnt be in, most players would stay in the kingdom they spawn in.

So the idea is good, but the execution is boring as hell. Its just a goose chase.

If every lord had a quest related to its kingdom, culture and with a link to the main storyline. And you had to first complete that quest in order for him to spill the beans and point you to the next person you'd need, then it'd contribute something to the story.

But maybe that'd be too much for a sandbox experience.

That sounds pretty good. A quest from each one that explores a different part of the game. Like Aserai would ask you to acquire a certain item through trade. The Empire factions to build a watchtower/mini castle/camp, the Battanians to hunt some aninmals (these two are nice features the game could have in the future), the Vladians to recruit some villagers and battle the looters until enough have been promoted, etc.
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
The crazy goose chase to talk to all the lords is handy for new players to explore different parts of the world. If that wouldnt be in, most players would stay in the kingdom they spawn in.

So the idea is good, but the execution is boring as hell. Its just a goose chase.

If every lord had a quest related to its kingdom, culture and with a link to the main storyline. And you had to first complete that quest in order for him to spill the beans and point you to the next person you'd need, then it'd contribute something to the story.

But maybe that'd be too much for a sandbox experience.

this would be very good man, it would also encourage the player to spend a bit of time in each faction doing one (or a few) thematical quests for them that could explore more of the faction's lore to help you decide which to support later on, it could be tied with gainning the thust of the monarchs before they would open up with you or something like that treating each faction as a questhub tied with the mainquest kinda of like they do in the elder scrolls series.

My main grip with the mainquest is the repeatability of it all, it boils down to talk with this x amount of npcs (the dialogue bits are good and i hope they would expand more on npcs talking about the lore) and go clear these bunch of generic hideouts, atleast in warband you only cleared a generic hideout ONCE in the initial quest, they should add more lore and quests tied to the mainone exploring it, some dramatic cutscenes and political backstabs that would spice up the mainquest and fit nice in the theme of the game.

maybe something like you decided to support X faction with the banner then there is an attempt murder on the monarch that you foil (or not) and it reveals to be made by a claimant to the faction that starts an invasion on it or something like that, right now the mainquest is go find your simblings on these generic hideout quests, talk to all monarchs to read a bit of interesting lore, MORE GENERIC HIDEOUTS and simply recreate the battle of pendraic by either destroying the empire or have the empire dominate and all factions unite against it once again..
 
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Dr-Shinobi

idk why its there to begin with. Should be just an short introduction so you can get in to the game a bit if you choose so just like in warband then the rest is your story. Theres better things to be worked on then a story driven campaign play thru in my opinion
 

paladinx333

Sergeant at Arms
idk why its there to begin with

Same here. I don't want to reform the empire. I want to crush what's left of the empire beneath my expensive and finely crafted boots.

There is this idea today that all games need to have a story. I think that TW may have caught wind of that so they stuffed a small story into the beggining of the game. I have never done the main quest other than rescuing my family. To be honest the game would be better if there were a clean start option as the story really forces you to do things. Things that you may not want to do and things that may not be in your best interest.

I do not want or need a main quest and I honestly don't care if the pieces of the dragon banner are ever reunited.
 

MauledByABeer

Sergeant
Besides rescuing my siblings, I've never really bothered with it. It seems like a decent enough tutorial but I'd personally rather have a pure sandbox mode with a more customizable background than a more in-depth main quest.

Aside from that, I've thought for awhile now that instead of having a "main quest" it might be nice to have a selection of story scenarios with their own branching quest chains. It would be an easy way to add the occasional bit of extra content and if they paired it with a mod tool to make new lines of story quests and upload them to the Steam Workshop (or wherever) there could be a steady stream of new quests for players who like a little more direction or story than the traditional Mount and Blade sandbox experience.
 

black_bulldog

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
Same here. I don't want to reform the empire. I want to crush what's left of the empire beneath my expensive and finely crafted boots.

There is this idea today that all games need to have a story. I think that TW may have caught wind of that so they stuffed a small story into the beggining of the game. I have never done the main quest other than rescuing my family. To be honest the game would be better if there were a clean start option as the story really forces you to do things. Things that you may not want to do and things that may not be in your best interest.

I do not want or need a main quest and I honestly don't care if the pieces of the dragon banner are ever reunited.
My guess is someone decided that they needed your character to have heirs in case he dies before he gets married so they probably came up with the idea of incorporating it a main quest. But most open world games have difficulty with main quests because the freedom to do anything vs the idea of following a quest are complete opposites and most developers have problems combining the two. The last really good open world game with an excellent main story I can remember is Morrowind.
 

froggyluv

Grandmaster Knight
NW
So after laying Bannerlord down till it gets some semblance of something -decided to finally give Viking Conquest another chance. Never really got into it before -probably mostly due to the names of ..well everything. "Ruire del Aethel-Fwack Cul ef Duire" -type people -a brother cant follow that. Watching Last kingdom has helped me as now i just latch on to like 3 letter of the name "Red" for AethelRed and now its cake.

Anyways this DLC is how an opening story for a sandbox is done correctly. You start off on a boat at sea (already a novel idea) quickly get a combat tutorial when you get overwhelmed with the very cool effect of enemy Viking ships closing in and overwhelming you with top tier viking infantry. Next you awaken in unknown town and the first town you enter has alot of action going on around you - men racing horse, kids running, people fencing in the street etc.. Next the plot quickly takes you between an arrogant local danish Lord and the Church -a riveting type situation. The local beach town is also in danger of an ominous incoming invasion by the very viking who killed your mother -you now need to find a way to raise a strong enough army to fend off these marauders as well as exact vengeance on the man who killed your mother. problem is your ina very isolated area with not many resources so youll have to gather what you can and start travelling in search of men and money.

Comppare that to Bannerlord - your Brother and you need to help find your what brothers, kids taken by someone somewhere what?? That storyline evaporates quickly in confusion and next your kinda thrust (too powerful a word really) into the main plot of Nezxees Jollies -yeah track 10 lords down so they can tell you some convoluted tale about some battle that happened one day long ago from 10 different points of view so you can get some cloth of a banner...WHAT??!!? Who thought this was riveting storyline to follow?? Who thought that another lame Bandit Camp raid was a good way to start this flagship game apparently of the NexGen variety?

I just dont get it. In viking Conquest i am now far away in Ireland from my origin in denmark and it actually FEELS like a different land - and now im caught up in their politics. theres variety on the map and im also always aware i need to get back to my homeland to help that villaage at some point -so there is in game tension and interest -i want to save those people and i want to exact my revenge.

Taleworlds please revamp your whole storyline -hire the Brtynwalda team if you must -but its just so stale and boring its an utter shame.
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
So after laying Bannerlord down till it gets some semblance of something -decided to finally give Viking Conquest another chance. Never really got into it before -probably mostly due to the names of ..well everything. "Ruire del Aethel-Fwack Cul ef Duire" -type people -a brother cant follow that. Watching Last kingdom has helped me as now i just latch on to like 3 letter of the name "Red" for AethelRed and now its cake.

Anyways this DLC is how an opening story for a sandbox is done correctly. You start off on a boat at sea (already a novel idea) quickly get a combat tutorial when you get overwhelmed with the very cool effect of enemy Viking ships closing in and overwhelming you with top tier viking infantry. Next you awaken in unknown town and the first town you enter has alot of action going on around you - men racing horse, kids running, people fencing in the street etc.. Next the plot quickly takes you between an arrogant local danish Lord and the Church -a riveting type situation. The local beach town is also in danger of an ominous incoming invasion by the very viking who killed your mother -you now need to find a way to raise a strong enough army to fend off these marauders as well as exact vengeance on the man who killed your mother. problem is your ina very isolated area with not many resources so youll have to gather what you can and start travelling in search of men and money.

Comppare that to Bannerlord - your Brother and you need to help find your what brothers, kids taken by someone somewhere what?? That storyline evaporates quickly in confusion and next your kinda thrust (too powerful a word really) into the main plot of Nezxees Jollies -yeah track 10 lords down so they can tell you some convoluted tale about some battle that happened one day long ago from 10 different points of view so you can get some cloth of a banner...WHAT??!!? Who thought this was riveting storyline to follow?? Who thought that another lame Bandit Camp raid was a good way to start this flagship game apparently of the NexGen variety?

I just dont get it. In viking Conquest i am now far away in Ireland from my origin in denmark and it actually FEELS like a different land - and now im caught up in their politics. theres variety on the map and im also always aware i need to get back to my homeland to help that villaage at some point -so there is in game tension and interest -i want to save those people and i want to exact my revenge.

Taleworlds please revamp your whole storyline -hire the Brtynwalda team if you must -but its just so stale and boring its an utter shame.

I'll have to agree here, Viking Conquest really spoiled me as a good example of a well made mainquest meshed in a sandbox game, it feels real and gives you enough reasons to travel around and make a name/fortune and rise an army for yourself, the companions you get along the storyline are also one of the parts of it.

bannerlord goes like we were moving towns with your family for...reasons, slavers attack kill your dad and mommy and kidnap your younger siblings, from there you quickly forge a fake family name for yourself and become a kingmaker either supporting or destroying the empire as the legendary "bannerlord", it jumps too much too quickly to feel real or give you enough reasons to really care, atleast you can get your siblings back and that is the best part of the quest for now that i hope will be expanded with more dialogue atleast, Varic and Alda don't even know who you are the first time you speak with them lol
 
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Timmortal

Knight at Arms
I dont think its about changing, i think its about adding...
The talk with 10 nobles should lead to you being able to join one of them in rebellion (similar to the rebellion you could help the claimant do in Warband) or support the king when the other lord rebels, would be a great way to introduce players to a rebellion mechanic.
The sibling quest just need to continue and work as an introduction to you building up your clan, joining a faction, starting your noble house, finding a wife, getting a nemesis, maybe add a few "named" companions, like the bandit you can choose to execute or let go, the let go option would lead to him joining you. You should meet other companions like this aswell.
 
One of the few things Warband did better was the main quest. There wasn't one, you just had the optional tutorial with the merchant. Otherwise you did what you wanted. More sandbox, less restriction, not Bannerlord.
 

danEN

Banned
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
I don't think there's anything they can do without completely changing it, at no point ever will trying to find 10 lords who can be anywhere on the map feel engaging.

The idea of a tutorial like main quest would be to give new players actual direction.
 

Timmortal

Knight at Arms
One of the few things Warband did better was the main quest. There wasn't one, you just had the optional tutorial with the merchant. Otherwise you did what you wanted. More sandbox, less restriction, not Bannerlord.
you can ignore the quest in Bannerlord aswell, so whats the difference?
 

Cpt. Nemo

The Wurst
Section Moderator
M&BWB
It's super dumb, boring, and horribly written. It should've just been a very basic gameplay tutorial like in Warband.
 
you can ignore the quest in Bannerlord aswell, so whats the difference?
Not really once you choose to skip the tutorial you miss out on part of the story. Then once you get your clan built up you get forced into aiding the bandit leader in rescuing your family. After that you still have to deal with the banner thing and always have a quest marker on your brother who goes back to the town you completed the build your clan objectives, you have family now too with a younger sister and brother to deal with on top of your other brother. Its annoying you can't escape it. Ignoring it won't work in the end. In Warband you just choose not to help the merchant. That's it, now its time to go do whatever. No more forced main story type of junk.
 

Revverie

So after laying Bannerlord down till it gets some semblance of something -decided to finally give Viking Conquest another chance. Never really got into it before -probably mostly due to the names of ..well everything. "Ruire del Aethel-Fwack Cul ef Duire" -type people -a brother cant follow that. Watching Last kingdom has helped me as now i just latch on to like 3 letter of the name "Red" for AethelRed and now its cake.

Anyways this DLC is how an opening story for a sandbox is done correctly. You start off on a boat at sea (already a novel idea) quickly get a combat tutorial when you get overwhelmed with the very cool effect of enemy Viking ships closing in and overwhelming you with top tier viking infantry. Next you awaken in unknown town and the first town you enter has alot of action going on around you - men racing horse, kids running, people fencing in the street etc.. Next the plot quickly takes you between an arrogant local danish Lord and the Church -a riveting type situation. The local beach town is also in danger of an ominous incoming invasion by the very viking who killed your mother -you now need to find a way to raise a strong enough army to fend off these marauders as well as exact vengeance on the man who killed your mother. problem is your ina very isolated area with not many resources so youll have to gather what you can and start travelling in search of men and money.

Comppare that to Bannerlord - your Brother and you need to help find your what brothers, kids taken by someone somewhere what?? That storyline evaporates quickly in confusion and next your kinda thrust (too powerful a word really) into the main plot of Nezxees Jollies -yeah track 10 lords down so they can tell you some convoluted tale about some battle that happened one day long ago from 10 different points of view so you can get some cloth of a banner...WHAT??!!? Who thought this was riveting storyline to follow?? Who thought that another lame Bandit Camp raid was a good way to start this flagship game apparently of the NexGen variety?

I just dont get it. In viking Conquest i am now far away in Ireland from my origin in denmark and it actually FEELS like a different land - and now im caught up in their politics. theres variety on the map and im also always aware i need to get back to my homeland to help that villaage at some point -so there is in game tension and interest -i want to save those people and i want to exact my revenge.

Taleworlds please revamp your whole storyline -hire the Brtynwalda team if you must -but its just so stale and boring its an utter shame.
The writing was great on that story, SO engaging! Bannerlord wasn't as interesting or cool as that one was. Very poor writing indeed, I was genuinely excited for Bannerlord main quest when I heard one was being made because I thought it was going to be like VC but no, it's very infuriating seeing such bad ideas unfolded into the game, I bet my ass the writer doesn't even play videogames at all
 

NLCRich

Squire
In order to salvage the main quest, much work is needed. If it were me, I might scrap it and start over, but I don't think TW has the time. So here is what they can do. First part, they need to flesh out Radagos more. Give us a little history on this guy. Give him a valid motivation behind his actions and endear this Radagos to us slightly. Perhaps there is some noble reason he is kidnapping people, and we just happened to get swept up in it. The main characters in the story are those that need voices. Radagos needs a voice IMO.

When we're asking these nobles for bits of the story, give us some more incentive to proceed with this quest. It's really quite a chore as it is. I rarely get through this part in my games. Perhaps some relation gain with the NPC for the story telling session. Open up more of the clan leaders to tell story, and give the player a reason to try and find certain people so they can get the relation gain. The quest itself needs more incentive for doing it. Starting a kingdom and dealing with some weird conspiracy timeframe constantly updating in your log... It's just more fun to do it without the main quest right now. Maybe turn the dragon banner into a sweet polearm weapon that is actually useful. Now we have some incentive to acquire this banner.

If this banner is so powerful and supposedly gives the player claim to rule the land, why don't any clans come to support the main character? Perhaps the character gets the benefit also of the support of a couple clans for acquiring this banner. Now they can actually get themselves a good starting point via the story for the next stage of the game. There is a lot more they can do of course. The writing could really use a lot more character. In a lot of places it comes off rather bland. It has improved some, but more work needs to be done.
 
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