Slings

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Ok, so I admit they were no longer really used in warfare in the time period of M&B, but am I the only one who still thinks they would be cool to have?

If so, maybe we should make a mod about the early roman era, perhaps the conflict between greeks and romans. Hoplites versus legionaries, and of course with Balearic slingers as mercenaries!
 
It would be quite cool, but I also have an idea.

Stones are a throwing weapon, but let them have a second use, missiles for the slingshot! Maybe if the slingshot allowed them to do a bit more damage. Meh, it's just my crazy brain at work.
 
Aren't the stones quite large? I remember that Roman military used lead as a material for sling bullets (heard somewhere).
 
Sling stones could be pretty big. Saw an interesting show on the History channel that mentioned them. Bigger, double-fist sized rocks would be used for long range, arcing shots. Fist-sized or smaller stones for low trajectory direct fire. You could make shot out of lead, but I'm sure there'd be plenty of good ammo laying around.
 
There were two kinds of slings. The traditional "shepher's sling" and a stave sling, which, I understand, was used more commonly in warfare. A stave sling is like a sling at the end of a long length of wood. These had much longer range and could use larger pellets, and were therefore far more dangerous. A trebuchet is basically a big stave sling. Like Nairagorn said, the stave slings were used for arcing long-range bombardment, with lead pellets as ammo. The shepherd's sling was more accurate, but limited in range and damage.
 
Well, the show I saw (I think that Dale Dye dude was narrating) only talked about the shepard-type sling, but I'm sure you're correct about the staff sling giving greater range and power.

Would be cool to see these in the game. I imagine the shepard sling would pose some problems animatin-wise, but the staff sling probably wouldn't be too hard to impliment.

::edit:: only slight off-topic, but I'd like to see if an atl-atl could be done as a throwing weapon.
 
Atl-alt is a little more complex than just a javellin. If you look at the back, there is a throwing board, that part you hang onto and use it to throw the spear. I've tried to make one before, but never could get it to actually throw, the nose always dipped way too much. :sad: So to do properly you would have to add something to the guys hand all the time, and animate it properly. Doable, but a little more work than just switching models.


But as for slings, that IS something I've used fairly well. Never had much luck with a stave sling, just didn't get the hang of setting it.

A problem with stave slings is they have a set range, so if someone is charging you, you would have to keep resetting the range, but if there are a group massed somewhere and holding ground, they are great as you can zero in your range and rain hell down on them. I don't think stave slings would work very well in this game, unless you ignore how they really work and just treat them like an oversized sling with more power/speed.

For the simple sling, those things are great I love them. Wish I still lived where I did before, as its a 2 hour drive to a place I can actually use one, unless I want to invest in lead shot. :sad: its all very light, soft sandstone here that just doesn't work with slings.

As for shot size, there are references (I forget which, never seen them, just read about them) showing Egyption IIRC soldiers throwing headsized rocks at short range. I use to be able to hit a mark at about 75 paces or so, they're very good weapons and almost better than bows in some points. Cheap ammo is a great point to them, and as long as you're fighting near a river, you have almost unlimited shot.
In a pinch they can be used as a hand to hand weapon. Put a large stone in it and use it almost like a club.
Shot, even smaller than an egg, thrown from a sling packs a LOT of force, and can easily dent 14gage cold rolled steel. Just for the fun of it I made a mockup of the side of a barrel helm (Not very scientific, but gave me a vague idea of the damage that can be done) put some weight inside it and tied it to stump. One shot from about 50 feet caved it in enough to maybe kill a man, but atleast put him out of action for awhile.

Oh, and a side note to anyone that wants to try playing with a sling. be VERY careful, they are NOT toys. You are much more likely to kill yourself or a friend than you do with playing with firearms (Unless you are playing shooting at each other, but people tend to deserve what they get in those cases) I strongly suggest getting youself a good kettle hat style helmet made with moden metals and properly padded. (Think modern combat helmet with a wide brim) This will help to keep from braining yourself if you choose to try. But you're better off playing with a longbow.
 
Slings: Definitely. I wants it! They were not so much used for warfare by the middle ages but were used extensively by shepherds and so on still. They didn't fall out of use because they were ineffective (Cretan slingers could send a projectile farther and harder than a longbow -- almost certainly with a stave sling, though) but because they are incredibly difficult to learn to use properly, when compared with a bow.
Stave slings would be hard to implement, and I couldn't really see them working realistically in the game. All in all, not good.
 
Slings would be great fun. Make its attack be piercing and it should be rather how I feel it should be.
 
Well what I have seen the only difference between blunt and piercing is that blunt makes you occasionally fall (is it the damage type or the weapon dunno). So the piercing would be more fitting, even if it sounds silly.
 
ilex, you're way off there. There's a big difference.

Blunt damage is invariably nonlethal, it's impossible to kill someone with a blunt weapon in M&B.

Piercing damage, on the other hand, only suffers a halved armor penalty.

I'm not sure, but I don't think the knockdown effect is related to damage type, I think the chance of it happening is weapon-related. I could be wrong, though.
 
All right, but there's still the matter of blunt damage only knocking a guy unconcious. I'd say if the people in M&B can survive having their skull cracked open with a mace or warhammer, a sling pellet should be no different. It's a blunt object.
 
okiN said:
All right, but there's still the matter of blunt damage only knocking a guy unconcious. I'd say if the people in M&B can survive having their skull cracked open with a mace or warhammer, a sling pellet should be no different. It's a blunt object.

You need SOME way to knock them unconcious :razz:

Mabye if it was a random chance of Knockout/kill?

And extra gibs for headshot :razz:
 
Nah, that'd be too complicated. Also, it'd piss me off if my quest to capture a noble ended with his cranium caving in, even though I only gave him a slight tap on the noggin with my military hammer. As long as the sling (If added) deals blunt damage, it's fine by me.
 
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