Siege Bug ?

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bizzarrooo

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Old Guard
hello guys, ive searched everywhere about it and didnt find a clue, heres come my question , when the defenders sally out (because low number of troops sieging) , its normal to my archer units losses all his arrows  when i tell em to stay round or hold position:?: its really been  :evil: making me anry since my best units are ranged and i use a few to tank the enemy's and rain them down!

thx for the greatest "mod" (its almost a new game) ever...
 
I've experienced the same, though I'm not playing on the newest version yet. Only way around this for me has been to just let the archers shoot away, however inefficient it will be.
 
This is not a bug. It's a feature.

If you come to a siege and the defender thinks that it would be best to sally forth because the attacker has too many ranged troops (or the attacker is too outnumbered), then they will sally forth and the player's units will all get a random number of arrows between 0 to 5 for each unit. This means that some of your units will be lucky and have more than 3 arrows/bolts and some will be unlucky and have fewer arrows (even 0 if they are very unlucky). This includes companions and the player.

In a regular siege the defender has unlimited arrows and the attacker (player) has a full quiver. In Sally Forth the computer defender will have a full quiver and the player troops will have between 0 to 5.

Why is this?
Because the player will need to think more strategically and tactically when he risks a sally forth if he brings too many ranged troops to a siege. Sally forth battles become more tactical too if you only have a limited amount of ammo and they become a bit more favorable for the AI.

If you defeat the AI decisively in the sally forth, then the AI won't try another sally forth in the whole siege, but if you don't defeat the AI decisively then the AI might sally forth again.
 
i c... thx, but thats totaly the oposite of nicotin "new player post" where he says about sun tzu , of quality being better than quantity , anyway it stills kinda odd and unrealistic, "ok since we are in less number than they,lets use only 0-5 arrows since they have 5 times more manpower than us.." really sound's like sun  :lol: tzu. 
no way to turn it off? with all respect i kinda think it is unrealistic and stupid to have only 0 arrows(yes i'm very unlucky)
(or maybe i should just spam some baddass fierdsvain melle power and take it over lmao).
 
bizzarrooo said:
i c... thx, but thats totaly the oposite of nicotin "new player post" where he says about sun tzu , of quality being better than quantity , anyway it stills kinda odd and unrealistic, "ok since we are in less number than they,lets use only 0-5 arrows since they have 5 times more manpower than us.." really sound's like sun  :lol: tzu. 
no way to turn it off? with all respect i kinda think it is unrealistic and stupid to have only 0 arrows(yes i'm very unlucky)
(or maybe i should just spam some baddass fierdsvain melle power and take it over lmao).
Click to expand...

stupid perhaps... unrealistic probably not, what General would bring just "ranged units" to a siege battle, without having infantry troops to back up their lines for when it's time to siege the walls. Last I checked, the infantry wins the day, not the ranged troops. Naturally, players like to take advantage of a deep Warband flaw of just bringing "archers" to the table in a siege, and we just feel that's a cheap tactic, and that's why we have our feature as is.

Sorry buddy, but it's not as a bad you think, just bring a more balance army to the fight and you'll be fine! :smile:

MP
 
bizzarrooo said:
i c... thx, but thats totaly the oposite of nicotin "new player post" where he says about sun tzu , of quality being better than quantity , anyway it stills kinda odd and unrealistic, "ok since we are in less number than they,lets use only 0-5 arrows since they have 5 times more manpower than us.." really sound's like sun tzu. 
no way to turn it off? with all respect i kinda think it is unrealistic and stupid to have only 0 arrows(yes i'm very unlucky)
(or maybe i should just spam some baddass fierdsvain melle power and take it over lmao).
Click to expand...

Ah, mp was ahead of my post, but I'll send mine also. :smile:

It's not possible to turn this feature off. Also keep in mind that it is a valid extrapolation considering that a defender gets unlimited ammo in a siege battle and the player gets a full quiver.

Also, when you sneak into a town you get a pilgrim disguise and a staff instead of your standard equipment. In this scenario the defender will take advantage of your bringing too many archers to the battle and the Sally forth is therefore set up like this.

Your best strategy is to have a balanced force of troops when sieging. That way you deny the defenders the opportunity to sally forth and you will have a good chance to win the siege without resorting to spamming arrows on the defender (who unfortunately can't crouch and therefore will be killed by your arrows if you outnumber him with ranged troops).
 
hm...very good replies (and fast) make more sense to me, still it incits the player to use more shielded melle to storm castles, but yet(in my opinion) 0-5 arrows is brutal penalty (even if some archers can fight well at mellee). theres a way to put it atleast 5-10?
btw does calvary count as infantary at siege as (trigger) pattern, or only infantary prevent it? my army is usualy of archers and cavalry mostly.

if so, that doesnt make dshar weaker than most factionS? "cav arch ,arch, weak inf"

great game , Superb comunitty

ps:sorry for mah bad ingrish (non-native speaker)
 
You can change it ... go to mission_templates.txt and find this segment:

0.000000 0.000000 100000000.000000  0  3 2133 2 144115188075856297 0 1 1 936748722493063669 1 3 936748722493063844 0 6

The bold  purple 0 is the minimum arrows and the 6 is the maximum (-1). So if you want to have 5 to 10 arrows you can just change the 0 to 5 and the 6 to 11.

Cavalry counts as infantry if it is melee cavalry. If it is archer or crossbow cavalry it counts as archers when the defenders are considering the sally forth or not.
 
They also sally forth if you ask the defender if they want to surrender. They sallyed on me 3 times in 1 seige battle. Too bad for them, I was using all hero adv. and pendor foot knights. ( that was in 3,301 though ).
 
bizzarrooo said:
i c... thx, but thats totaly the oposite of nicotin "new player post" where he says about sun tzu , of quality being better than quantity , anyway it stills kinda odd and unrealistic, "ok since we are in less number than they,lets use only 0-5 arrows since they have 5 times more manpower than us.." really sound's like sun  :lol: tzu. 
no way to turn it off? with all respect i kinda think it is unrealistic and stupid to have only 0 arrows(yes i'm very unlucky)
(or maybe i should just spam some baddass fierdsvain melle power and take it over lmao).
Click to expand...
yes but in some cases....archers/crossbowmen are overpowered in this game and there were various fixed exploits. What sane man would attack a fully stocked castle with only archers? sally forth is a nic feature, just get more infantry than archers....you can still have the first wave full of archers. you will understand why sally forth is needed in the future.

I don't understand why that is so unrealistic? the archers were puting up the ladders or carying the ram or maning whatever siege equipment and the defenders rush to attack them....they can't shoot more than a few arrows before they had to use melee weapons
 
NicotiN said:
bizzarrooo said:
i c... thx, but thats totaly the oposite of nicotin "new player post" where he says about sun tzu , of quality being better than quantity , anyway it stills kinda odd and unrealistic, "ok since we are in less number than they,lets use only 0-5 arrows since they have 5 times more manpower than us.." really sound's like sun  :lol: tzu. 
no way to turn it off? with all respect i kinda think it is unrealistic and stupid to have only 0 arrows(yes i'm very unlucky)
(or maybe i should just spam some baddass fierdsvain melle power and take it over lmao).
Click to expand...
yes but in some cases....archers/crossbowmen are overpowered in this game and there were various fixed exploits. What sane man would attack a fully stocked castle with only archers? sally forth is a nic feature, just get more infantry than archers....you can still have the first wave full of archers. you will understand why sally forth is needed in the future.

I don't understand why that is so unrealistic? the archers were puting up the ladders or carying the ram or maning whatever siege equipment and the defenders rush to attack them....they can't shoot more than a few arrows before they had to use melee weapons
Click to expand...

Don't forget that they too were caught off guard when the enemy came out to sally forth. So archers wouldn't of had enough time to grab all their arrows and quivers that would take hours of time to prepare to attack a fortified castle.
 
This is the dumbest mechanic I've ever seen, they should have nerfed the stupidly OP archers instead. Love the mod though.
 
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