Should armor be more effective?

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DDDIIIIEEEEE

Recruit
I really wish armor felt more impactful. It feels really bad getting all the best armor in the game and still getting killed in a few hits, where it seems like this level of armor should make you an absolute tank. Similarly it feels bad to kill high armor enemies with easy. Ofcourse any change to armor could cause a massive balancing issue, but I had some ideas.
The simplest way would be to increase armor values across the board, but this may make certain enemies a nightmare to deal with. My idea was to make armor more effective at blocking damage but add a durability bar to each individual piece of armor, similar to shields. Each time armor is hit it loses some durability, and the less durability armor has the less protection it provides. This way armor gets to be extremely impactful to the survivability of a unit, but it can be worn down so high armor units wouldn't be completely unstoppable. Could even add fun thing like helmets getting knocked off once their durability runs out.
However this would probably add to much strain on battles, but I can dream.
 
Yes, for higher tier units anyways and speed bonus needs to be capped and adjusted. It's fine for cheap fodder units to to go down in 2 hits though.
Durability is a an auto-no because it adding another mechanic.
 

Rush09

Regular
Yes, for higher tier units anyways and speed bonus needs to be capped and adjusted.
Agreed but not just speed bonus but hitboxes for legs and arms need to be off the 1 hit KO. The amount of times you go from 100% to 0% health with good armor because some peasant just happened to clip your toenail when you were cruising the field on your horse its infuriating.
 

hruza

Knight at Arms
I really wish armor felt more impactful. It feels really bad getting all the best armor in the game and still getting killed in a few hits

Can you please specify how many hits is "few" for you and in what kind of armor? Also weapon that hit you is something that is interesting to know, because they have substantially different effectiveness against armor.

When I am using top tier armors, I don't experience situations where I am going down in "few" hits against standard attacks by non blunt weapons. Even mid tier armors give substantial buff to survivability against non blunt weapons.
 
My idea was to make armor more effective at blocking damage but add a durability bar to each individual piece of armor, similar to shields. Each time armor is hit it loses some durability, and the less durability armor has the less protection it provides. This way armor gets to be extremely impactful to the survivability of a unit, but it can be worn down so high armor units wouldn't be completely unstoppable. Could even add fun thing like helmets getting knocked off once their durability runs out.
By putting HP in the armor you partially solve the problem.
Less good armor has few HP and therefore after going to zero HP it does not protect the limb they cover, instead good quality armor would protect the covered limb for a greater number of hits.
If an enemy is wearing similar armor parts, you should hit the same point several times in order to break it and do full damage.
The idea is good, although it runs the risk of becoming repetitive and spammy towards a particular hurtbox.

Basically the idea is better than the current system.
I too had proposed an idea about the amor system which in a certain sense is similar to yours, although the condition of the equipment I consider it in a separate thread from that of the armor system itself.
I leave you the link in case you want to read it.
In relation to your idea, for me it is a big yes.

JOINT HURTBOXES and ARMOR HURTBOXES: an armor system that provide a way to balance factions warfare and make more deep the combat system(suggestions)
 
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CrazyElf

Veteran
Agreed but not just speed bonus but hitboxes for legs and arms need to be off the 1 hit KO. The amount of times you go from 100% to 0% health with good armor because some peasant just happened to clip your toenail when you were cruising the field on your horse its infuriating.

I very firmly believe that armor needs a MAJOR buff. There needs to be better survivability against arrows especially, as archers right now remain very powerful even after some of the nerfs.

For now, consider mods like Realistic Battle Mod or Drastic Battle Mod.
 

Antaeus

Sergeant
My thoughts are mixed.

When I get one hit in game I always go "stupid armour" But in game currently, the only time I am one hit is with a glaive or couched lance. And then it's still more likely to take a couple of hits.

But I don't want to play in a universe where I feel invulnerable. There should always be room for a lucky arrow shot - in the real world that might be the fragment off a splintered arrow that hits a rider in the eye or such like - but coincidence is hard to programme - perhaps every arrow has a small % chance of dealing extra damage. That way the player might be able to flirt with archers, but will always have to be on guard.

And there should always be a way for a mounted noble, charging at 30kmph to die in one hit - particularly from a lance coming - either through sustaining direct or injury from being unhorsed (if their horse dies or they're unseated) because a fall from horseback at 30kmph comes with all sorts of injury risks.

And this game has no mechanic for dealing with impact injuries like broken arms, broken legs, or crush injuries from blunt impact weapons, severe but not fatal cuts, stabs, arrows in the arm or leg or through a hip bone or a dagger wedged an inch into me but anchored in place by being stuck in my armour, all of which might partially incapacitate my character, or render their continuing difficult, but possible with disability. The player is either alive and operating at 100%, or they're knocked out - there is no dragged busted leg, or limp shield arm that has an arrow through the shield causing significant disability. I have screenshots where my character has 8 or 9 arrows in it - causing 90% damage to my character's health, yet I can still run happily or ride as if I was uninjured... In reality if I was so badly injured so as to be operating at 10% capacity, I'd be dragging myself along the ground in pain, or sitting in a tent at the rear waiting for my surgeon to cut off my arm or leg after being dragged to the rear by a comrade or something like that. Without this kind of mechanic to temper the player as a battle wears on, invulnerability just isn't right.

And then there's the gaming factor - I'd find a half an hour battle where people just bludgeon each other without real impact for extended periods of time boring. I want battles in game to be fast. So I have to take the hits to get the speed.

So in balance, I'm ok with armour not being quite as good as it could be.
 
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DDDIIIIEEEEE

Recruit
By putting HP in the armor you partially solve the problem.
Less good armor has few HP and therefore after going to zero HP it does not protect the limb they cover, instead good quality armor would protect the covered limb for a greater number of hits.
If an enemy is wearing similar armor parts, you should hit the same point several times in order to break it and do full damage.
The idea is good, although it runs the risk of becoming repetitive and spammy towards a particular hurtbox.

Basically the idea is better than the current system.
I too had proposed an idea about the amor system which in a certain sense is similar to yours, although the condition of the equipment I consider it in a separate thread from that of the armor system itself.
I leave you the link in case you want to read it.
In relation to your idea, for me it is a big yes.
Wow you went alot more in-depth than I did. xD
I was trying to be brief, but ya I figure there are plenty of ways to deal with target spamming. In my experience attacks tend to land all over the place. If a player is particularly skilled they usually target the head anyway, so spamming already happens to a degree.
And like you were saying this adds another interesting layer to armor. Like you could have armor that offered higher protection but lower durability and vice versa (although I imagine these stats would typically go up in tandem), adding another layer to how you equip your character.
 

DDDIIIIEEEEE

Recruit
Can you please specify how many hits is "few" for you and in what kind of armor? Also weapon that hit you is something that is interesting to know, because they have substantially different effectiveness against armor.

When I am using top tier armors, I don't experience situations where I am going down in "few" hits against standard attacks by non blunt weapons. Even mid tier armors give substantial buff to survivability against non blunt weapons.
I know that there are alot of factors that go into how much damage you take. I've taken static one-handed sword strikes (not in tournaments, I know those do blunt damage) to the head that took about half of my health. Now I know a strike like that would still be most unpleasant, but with a helmet with a 54 armor rating I don't think I should be on deaths door. In real life a helmet of this quality would make attacks like this mostly inert. It's also distracting to drop 340,000 on a helmet just to still feel so vulnerable. I defiantly don't want armor to be god mode, but I think we could balance it out quite a bit with that durability thing.
 
Wow you went alot more in-depth than I did. xD
I was trying to be brief, but ya I figure there are plenty of ways to deal with target spamming. In my experience attacks tend to land all over the place. If a player is particularly skilled they usually target the head anyway, so spamming already happens to a degree.
And like you were saying this adds another interesting layer to armor. Like you could have armor that offered higher protection but lower durability and vice versa (although I imagine these stats would typically go up in tandem), adding another layer to how you equip your character.
Regarding the durability and how this affects the quality of the equipment I have written 2 threads.

One is focused purely on the deterioration of the equipment, on the timing and methods, on its consequences and on how to maintain the equipment of one's own and one's army; all with the second aim of giving greater depth to the smithing skill, which seems to exist only in order to exist and which serves no purpose other than to have the "legendary sword" to sell it for 200k and become rich ...
The other is more focused on the economy itself, takes into consideration the issue in relation to the logistics and management of maintaining the army and ties into the former.
In both, the use of the smithing skill helps the player to maintain the equipment.
In general my threads are related to each other and consider aspects that are complementary to each other.
In general in my profile (and also under my comments) you can see links to my threads.
I only linked these 3 to you because they are inherent to the topic you posed.

SMITHING SKILL, EQUIPMENT DETERIORATION and MAINTENANCE system, PRICE BALANCE.

ECONOMY, PRODUCTION, SOCIAL STABILITY, ARMIES MAINTENANCE and EQUIPMENT MAINTENANCE

If you are interested in my other threads or the way they are treated, you can find the links under each of my comments, in the profile.
 
Armor should do more yes. Currently it is very ineffective for its cost.

Please no maintenance, if you want maintenance add it in via a mod, oblivion sucked when you had to find Crystal's to power your magic items. This is meant to be a army /kingdom manager / RPGs not repair man 2.0

If I'm a noble lord I ain't maintaining **** my Smith is and that really doesn't need to be added to the game, just like we dont have to collect taxes for fiefs, they get collected by a magic tax collector...
 

zMasterofPie

Recruit
WBWF&SNWVC
Why the hell can't they just use the same formula they did in Warband? High tier armor was very good but not invincible, especially not at high speeds on horseback. Lance, heavy crossbow, or thrown spear could all end a knight quickly, but god damn rocks and rusty sickles couldn't even scratch it. And since warriors have more HP in Bannerlord everyone will last slightly longer on the battlefield, peasants aren't mowed down quite as quickly as they were in Warband so there is a bit more balance.
 

KSHMR

Sergeant at Arms
But in game currently, the only time I am one hit is with a glaive or couched lance. And then it's still more likely to take a couple of hits.
The facts are that you can get one shot by a lot more than that, even if you're a heavy infantry. For example the two handers
 
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