Scrap the "main story"

[Apocal]

Interesting I knew none of this. That would certainly make the game a bit deeper -would love to know more about this

Yes, Bannerlord isn't great at presenting its mechanics to the player.

The way it works now, without getting into technical details:
Certain actions push your character's trait in various directions. Doing honorable things -- like upholding your agreement to do something -- on a consistent basis will eventually lead to your character being treated (by the game) as an honorable fellow. This follows with the other traits. For the majority of the traits, these pushes are done through quest decisions for right now, but certain actions merit as well. For the most part, they are common sense: fleeing or retreating from battle obviously sets you up as a coward and raiding villages constantly marks you as cruel, while destroying bandit hideouts aids in your rep as an honorable person.

People with the same trait get a very modest boost to relations, while those with the opposite trait take an equivalent penalty. It is possible to gain multiple traits: you can be Cruel, Honorable and Cautious at the same time or both Daring and Devious. Other than that, a few other effects -- the increased chance of bandit surrender to Daring lords, an increased chance of being executed for being Devious (possibly the only chance) -- just about sum it up.

Right now though it is clearly a work-in-progress.

 

[Bannerman Man]

Do these play into the game/story in any meaningful way?

The game uses npcs' traits all over the place, such as affecting how they vote in kingdom decisions. The player's traits are used too, but in fewer places, e.g. what Apocal said. As far as being used in the story, I have no idea, but probably not yet. Here's also an incomplete/outdated list of how you can gain/lose trait xp to get the gist.

Do things you do actually effect these traits and peoples reactions to you?

Aside from npc traits being used for various mechanics, they feature heavily in the dialog system (which is different from the persuasion mechanic) by way of "Conversation Tags." This influences what dialog lines are chosen when npcs talk to the player. I made a comment outlining the basis of the system here.

 

[NPC99]

The game uses npcs' traits all over the place, such as affecting how they vote in kingdom decisions. The player's traits are used too, but in fewer places, e.g. what Apocal said. As far as being used in the story, I have no idea, but probably not yet. Here's also an incomplete/outdated list of how you can gain/lose trait xp to get the gist.

Aside from npc traits being used for various mechanics, they feature heavily in the dialog system (which is different from the persuasion mechanic) by way of "Conversation Tags." This influences what dialog lines are chosen when npcs talk to the player. I made a comment outlining the basis of the system here.

Great insight into the conversation system. Clearly, we only see the tip of its iceberg. I hope it is built upon to enhance dialogue in scenes. Giving precedence to the earliest listed dialogue of the same weight is a concern as it automatically favours a smaller subset of available speech and reinforces repetitive selections.

 

[Mount On Blade]

I voted to remove the story until the game is finished. I like the idea of having a story in M&B but I feel like it's too much of a distraction for the devs. More work should be put into side quests and making them as good as possible.

As someone who sunk way too many hours into M&B since the first game, I never liked how stale quests felt.
By far the most outdated feeling part of the game are these throwaway quests that ultimately have no impact on how the game plays.
I know voice actors aren't exactly affordable for TW but even something resembling a hollowed out Fallout New Vegas would be much better than the way M&B has done quests since the start.

 

[Affliction]

I voted to remove the story until the game is finished. I like the idea of having a story in M&B but I feel like it's too much of a distraction for the devs. More work should be put into side quests and making them as good as possible.

As someone who sunk way too many hours into M&B since the first game, I never liked how stale quests felt.
By far the most outdated feeling part of the game are these throwaway quests that ultimately have no impact on how the game plays.
I know voice actors aren't exactly affordable for TW but even something resembling a hollowed out Fallout New Vegas would be much better than the way M&B has done quests since the start.

Agreed.

 

[Androme1]

Well it's more it's against the forum rules you realise?

So you are angry but you can't be bothered to explain why you are angry? You hate the story - but you can't offer a single feature you would rather see worked on?

also double posting is against the forum rules by the way...

Are you one of those people who pretend that no solutions have been offered because I don't bother typing it out for the hundreth time when many well-written threads have been made over the past few months detailing said solutions to the letter? If you wanna simp for Taleworlds make a new Steam account and buy another copy of Bannerlord.

TW clearly targeted BL to a new audience, and audience used to have quick solutions, able only to read meme-like texts, who likes to be taken by the hand and catered all the way through the game (archers are OP, nerf the bows, how do I make money, how do i play the game etc etc).
Think of how many games have issues because the tutorial is not enough "tutoring".

Business-wise TW made the right (short term) decision, the results of this survey are clear, they attracted masses of new players.

Where do we stand as lovers of true sandbox RPGs? We are in minority nowadays, collateral damage....

You are likely right. Low-standard consumers are also not bothered by bad design decisions, hence an acceptance for a completely and utterly shallow main storyline.

Are you having a bad day?

Yes, the games future looks bleak.

 

[stevehoos]

I voted to remove the story until the game is finished. I like the idea of having a story in M&B but I feel like it's too much of a distraction for the devs. More work should be put into side quests and making them as good as possible.

As someone who sunk way too many hours into M&B since the first game, I never liked how stale quests felt.
By far the most outdated feeling part of the game are these throwaway quests that ultimately have no impact on how the game plays.
I know voice actors aren't exactly affordable for TW but even something resembling a hollowed out Fallout New Vegas would be much better than the way M&B has done quests since the start.

TW has made a lot of money in the last few months, I think they could fit the bill for a few voice actors.

 

[Bannerman Man]

Giving precedence to the earliest listed dialogue of the same weight is a concern as it automatically favours a smaller subset of available speech and reinforces repetitive selections.

Agreed! It also makes it harder for modders to add varied dialog if there's already a line that fits a specific or similar criteria, which would get prioritized instead. You would need to know all of the combinations of tags and weights that might lead to a particular score in a given circumstance. Maybe they could randomize the line that's selected from all of the lines of dialog that have the same score.

On the flip side, if it's not possible to know exactly what dialog line will trigger under certain circumstances, you might end up with some non sequiturs if they don't plan carefully enough.

TW has made a lot of money in the last few months, I think they could fit the bill for a few voice actors.

Voice acting has been confirmed. They are planning on voicing greetings, companion introductions, and the main quest.

If you want to get an idea for how it will probably be done, you can read the top paragraph of the voice_strings.xml file. If I'm interpreting it correctly, they plan to use more than just a few voice actors... 32 to be exact.

 

[markp27]

If you want to get an idea for how it will probably be done, you can read the top paragraph of the voice_strings.xml file. If I'm interpreting it correctly, they plan to use more than just a few voice actors... 32 to be exact.

Seems a waste of resources as many voice actors can do multiple accents.

 

[Svang]

I'm fine with very limited voice acting, akin to Warband. No need for them to get too amibitious.

 

[froggyluv]

I voted to remove the story until the game is finished. I like the idea of having a story in M&B but I feel like it's too much of a distraction for the devs. More work should be put into side quests and making them as good as possible.

As someone who sunk way too many hours into M&B since the first game, I never liked how stale quests felt.
By far the most outdated feeling part of the game are these throwaway quests that ultimately have no impact on how the game plays.
I know voice actors aren't exactly affordable for TW but even something resembling a hollowed out Fallout New Vegas would be much better than the way M&B has done quests since the start.

The quests should be more tied into actual world events. So say for instance a Sturgian village's satellite town has just been conquered by another faction -the village leaders should talk about the war/takeover and how thats effecting them. If literal Bandits are high in their area -then talk about that. Let it happen organically rather than creating a Bandits Lair AFTER talking to a village elder- that just feels artificial.

 

[Apocal]

Let it happen organically rather than creating a Bandits Lair AFTER talking to a village elder- that just feels artificial.

That's the way it works currently. It searches for a suitable hideout before popping the quest. If there are none within range of a settlement (and this is a fairly wide range) then the quest won't pop.

 

[froggyluv]

That's the way it works currently. It searches for a suitable hideout before popping the quest. If there are none within range of a settlement (and this is a fairly wide range) then the quest won't pop.

Good to know. If they could tie in the current goings on war-wise -thats all the immersion i need with possibly a few side quests

 

[Apocal]

Good to know. If they could tie in the current goings on war-wise -thats all the immersion i need with possibly a few side quests

It's actually bad because you should've noticed. If you didn't, that's the game's fault.

 

[froggyluv]

It's actually bad because you should've noticed. If you didn't, that's the game's fault.

Well its my fault because i was so unimpressed with the dialogue i stopped paying any real attention. Im glad that actual bandit lairs are tied in -now just make the rest of the world react dynamically to goings on and ill be happy

 

[markp27]

It's actually bad because you should've noticed. If you didn't, that's the game's fault.

Well its my fault because i was so unimpressed with the dialogue i stopped paying any real attention. Im glad that actual bandit lairs are tied in -now just make the rest of the world react dynamically to goings on and ill be happy

I use the bandit lair quest to up my scouting. If a villager has the quest I save the game, then take the quest so it shows me where the lair is and then reload. Find the lair on the map and then go take the quest.

 

[Nodice83]

I read the comments, no doubt various oponions. Many "me want", "me think best is..", "i'd wish", "do this..scrap that", "me disapointed". Many viable viepoints but also one may get an impression at least few game developers gathered on this forum knowing exactly what has to be done.

Don't get me wrong i am far from glorifing TW for their current work and not saying critical view isn't needed but let them do their vanilla stuff as they see fit. I am glad they are trully intrested in our opinions and hopefully this will lead to something exceptional. IMHO little storytelling never hurt anyone. Unless it is not invasive to "sandbox character" of the game (which many pointed out so far) i see no problem with that. As everybody else here i wish i can spend some more entertaining hours with that game as i want..and with possibly as many different approaches as possible

P.S. Just a little side comment.. Any comparison to Total War game is a pitiful joke. Not even close to the genre... but this is not even the case. Every year same buggy sh*t with tons of exploits, no interest in what community has to say, and so on.. And 1212 AD is a Attila MOD - great one btw. but it is still a pure fanmade modification. One of the best Total War game that CA has never created...