RIP MP

KSHMR

Recruit
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Most of the people on this thread have no idea what they are talking about tbh..
 

Tork789

Knight at Arms
WBNWWF&SM&BVC
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Lovely, a semi-decent discussion turning into another 'who can hate Tork the most' contest, let's get back on topic, we'll be having no more of the hate towards Tork; discuss his opinion and not Tork himself.
C'mon Fietta, we can have different opinions and a little banter here and there but we don't actually hate each other.
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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I completely disagree Younes. The issue is because the player base is split across multiple beta versions right now - I haven't touched MP recently not because I don't want to but because as I'm in 1.4.1 I can't play on the 1.4.0 servers. As such I only play SP. As soon as the game releases, the beta branch goes or there is a new push on MP (new modes, maps whatever) then people will flood back. As it stands I have 400 hours on the MP alone so I'm happy to give it a break.

Also can you stop saying your opinion is a fact and everyone else is wrong/lying because they disagree? That's not how debate or discussion works.

Honestly I gave this forum a break because it has just become a place for 10-15 of the same people to complain about the same things 100x over... I see nothing has changed.
By multiple beta versions you mean two of them right? I tried going to the beta branch and i kept getting errors just to connect to the servers each time i tried. There is not enough players so sustain the two branches.

Yes those are well established facts with the multiple polls we have done which concluded that people dislike the class system for the very least.

You last point is completely wrong. Most people from the beta have stopped caring about the game, i'm talking about people like Gibby, gab, noudelle, piconi, ... who have all stopped suggesting anything and as seen by the thread the forum is now flooded with recruits who also agree the class system does not work. Which again proves my point that people dislike it. You left the forums and assumed things without looking at the facts.


Here is my take on the class system we have now vs what we had for Warband.

Class system is just an updated version of what we had for the warband game. In warband, yes you could choose what gear you wanted but more often than not, lots of players went for the heavy armored tank guy with 2H weapon. Whats different then working your way toward that goal than working your way towards that same goal but in a class system this time? In reality, there isnt much difference. It was simply the illusion of choice vs this is what you get now.

And yes, until private servers get added or TW actually adds a dedicated siege map with the ability to switch teams or join with more than 6 friends than MP is broke as hell for now and these Duel servers they add are a waste of time IMO
Your take on the class system is a bit wrong. While it works in a similar way the progression you have in bannerlord is completely ruined. In warband you won't be able to pick the best weapon from the get go or after dying 2 times. It took a lot of effort to afford things.

The illusion of choice you describe is false. There was choice that's a fact.
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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Tork actually made a good point. The current class system prevents hard snowballing.

People keep complaining about being matches vs full premade teams, imagine what that would be like if it was Warband class system :razz:
Skirmish and captain were designed with the new class system in mind.

Also a new gold system would be needed for a remake of the class system in bannerlord from warband.

Just read this topic to debunk the snowballing
 

AxiosXiphos

Squire
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
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By multiple beta versions you mean two of them right? I tried going to the beta branch and i kept getting errors just to connect to the servers each time i tried. There is not enough players so sustain the two branches.

Yes those are well established facts with the multiple polls we have done which concluded that people dislike the class system for the very least.

You last point is completely wrong. Most people from the beta have stopped caring about the game, i'm talking about people like Gibby, gab, noudelle, piconi, ... who have all stopped suggesting anything and as seen by the thread the forum is now flooded with recruits who also agree the class system does not work. Which again proves my point that people dislike it. You left the forums and assumed things without looking at the facts.
If you assume most people are signed up to the beta branch which by your own statement doesn't work very well on MP then that is a dramatic reduction of people who could be playing MP. I myself am not playing MP currently because of this exact reason.

Popular opinion (especially in a vacuum) does not create a fact. Donald Trump won the US election - does that make him the best possible person to be president?

All the polls in the world doesn't make something factual and never will. The only fact is the data of the poll itself (as in that many people voted). Besides as has been pointed out many-many times this forum is far from representative. Indeed I have 20 something friends on my friends list who play bannerlord and only about 2 of them know or care about the forum (or any Mount&Blade forum/social media).
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
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If you assume most people are signed up to the beta branch which by your own statement doesn't work very well on MP then that is a dramatic reduction of people who could be playing MP. I myself am not playing MP currently because of this exact reason.

Popular opinion (especially in a vacuum) does not create a fact. Donald Trump won the US election - does that make him the best possible person to be president?

All the polls in the world doesn't make something factual and never will. The only fact is the data of the poll itself. Besides as has been pointed out many-many times this forum is far from representative. Indeed I have 20 something friends on my friends list who play bannerlord and only about 2 of them know or care about the forum (or any forum).
I didn't claim most people are signed up for the beta branch. But from my experience of reading what people have been experiencing there is a lack of players to run any siege at any time during the day.

Here we go again, you say they are not representative because they go against your opinion. The difference between Donald trump being the best possible president and a poll on a forum is that there is an actual freaking poll you cookie.

There is no vacuum, there are just people who deny facts when its presented to them because they are in denial.
 

Maroon

Grandmaster Knight
WBWF&SNW
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Round 504 of the same discussion, this time featuring Axios again! Great.
All the polls in the world doesn't make something factual and never will.
So then how about the OP's point? MP has far fewer players than it did a month ago. Nobody is playing Siege anymore. Multiplayer is downright boring for most people. That is a fact that you cannot deny. Bannerlord's multiplayer retention is garbage, as we've warned Taleworlds would happen since July.
Now, you can keep saying that 90% of the forum is wrong when they agree that a combination of crashes, poor combat parameters, and the class system is to blame for that, whatever. But multiplayer is still dying. As we said it would be.
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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What is more likely, that some people here are wrong,

or there is a conspiracy against bannerlord


****ing get real with yourself you bunch of lunatics
 

AxiosXiphos

Squire
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
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Round 504 of the same discussion, this time featuring Axios again! Great.

So then how about the OP's point? MP has far fewer players than it did a month ago. Nobody is playing Siege anymore. Multiplayer is downright boring for most people. That is a fact that you cannot deny. Bannerlord's multiplayer retention is garbage, as we've warned Taleworlds would happen since July.
Now, you can keep saying that 90% of the forum is wrong when they agree that a combination of crashes, poor combat parameters, and the class system is to blame for that, whatever. But multiplayer is still dying. As we said it would be.
You make it sound like I started this... I am not the OP of this thread....? If no one said anything you would take that as evidence of being correct yet at the same time I'm begrudged for providing my own opinion?

Hmmm I guess Warband Multiplayer must have been terrible; as the multiplayer player count was FAR lower then the singleplayer; and has been for years? No - I believe crashes are certainly a big part of it; never denied that and I think there are aspects of the combat that could certainly use work. My only argument is that blaming everything on the class system - again - is fruitless and biased. Certainly it should also be clear that there are additional reasons why player count would be low; the game is not released, MP is quite small at the moment, the beta branches are dividing the player base, most people are enjoying SP - especially after having a MP beta for a year beforehand. These are all true and should be accounted for.

What is more likely, that some people here are wrong,

or there is a conspiracy against bannerlord

****ing get real with yourself you bunch of lunatics
A conspiracy what..? No I just think there are a number of people who individually have never liked the class system, never will and will blame all the woes of the game on this one small part.
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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Conspiracy what..? No I just think there are a number of people who individually have never liked the class system and never will and will blame all the woes of the game on this one small component.
As i have stated several times before on the forums, both can live side by side. I said repeatedly that the class system works for skirmish and captain while it needs some significant changes on some aspects.

There was a time it was agreed on a compromise to have them live side by side, which would bring out the best out of both the gamemodes but no.
 

AxiosXiphos

Squire
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
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As i have stated several times before on the forums, both can live side by side. I said repeatedly that the class system works for skirmish and captain while it needs some significant changes on some aspects.

There was a time it was agreed on a compromise to have them live side by side, which would bring out the best out of both the gamemodes but no.
I don't disagree to the above but two things are also clear;

1) The class system isn't going anywhere (for good or bad TW have made this very clear).
2) There are considerably more reasons why MP numbers may have reduced.

As such why even debate it? We could argue all day about what colour the sky would look best in; still going to be the same colour as always tomorrow.
 

Shatti

Veteran
WBWF&SNWVC
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I don't disagree to the above but two things are also clear;

1) The class system isn't going anywhere (for good or bad TW have made this very clear).
2) There are considerably more reasons why MP numbers may have reduced.

As such why even debate it? We could argue all day about what colour the sky would look best in; still going to be the same colour as always tomorrow.
i agree,
we should discuss better-ing the current class system
of course i preferred warband, but i will try to suggest helping the game as much as i could
that what we can discuss now because we "lost" the argument about class system from the devs perspective
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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I don't disagree to the above but two things are also clear;

1) The class system isn't going anywhere (for good or bad TW have made this very clear).
2) There are considerably more reasons why MP numbers may have reduced.

As such why even debate it? We could argue all day about what colour the sky would look best in; still going to be the same colour as always tomorrow.
The problem is people suggested some really good things to improve the system. But can you give me an example of something someone suggested on the class system that was added?
 

Sundeki

Sergeant Knight at Arms
M&BWB
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A conspiracy what..? No I just think there are a number of people who individually have never liked the class system, never will and will blame all the woes of the game on this one small part.
I am among said people. While it is indeed true that unbalanced and buggy games are simply better with more player agency, I don't think anyone has said that the terrible premade Class System is the sole, or near-sole reason as to why the game is dying. But given the overwhelmingly negative response to the premade class system every time the issue is brought up, it's clear that premade classes are among the top 4 reasons as to why the game is dying, like we all said it would. Constant crasing, no custom servers, broken combat system, and premade classes would be the core reasons as to the decline. As to the statistical order of game-ruining they can be arranged in; nobody can say. My preferences *for why I don't want to play the game would be Broken Combat, Premade classes, with no custom servers and crashes being equal third.

The idea that someone like me that reviles the premade class system more than anything else in this game, is blaming the decline solely on this terrible class system, is a ridiculous strawman. I have yet to meet a single person that has said anything of the sort. And if they do exist, they're so small in number as to be completely irrelevant.

*edit
 
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DainMorgot

Regular
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Okay first of all I can see English isn't your first language so I will try to account for that. Some of your sentences don't make sense...

"Initially I was laughing at your defense of the game but I guess i have to write an essay to understand simple and obvious sarcasm."

This implies that you had to write an essay so you yourself could understand it...? I don't think that's what you meant...

Could you please provide evidence to support your claim that is the cause of people not playing MP?

Also I think the easiest solution for this would be if you could provide your own steam profile so we can see how many hours you have?

Also FYI;

2239 hours and not even 80/80 achievements and still bad in melee, thats an achievement. 60/80 now. congrats.

If you did not understand what is the meaning of the bolded line you quoted, then the problem is not english, believe me. see you on skirmish :*

edit: i'd tell you my profile but then i'd have to kill you.

final edit: class system is an excuse for bad players to find comfort in a system that removes player freedom because they got destroyed by naked 2 handers in warband. Those who defend the system are nothing more than bad players who wish ill upon those who are legitimately better players. snowballing is worse than warband's, its most evident if you actually play the game.
 

Younes123

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
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It doesn't matter if you have 2.2K hours Axios.

It just shows that even if people have absurd amount of hours in warband, they don't know what made the multiplayer great on so many levels.
 

DainMorgot

Regular
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Regarding our transition from internal to beta and beta to live, we decided against that this week. This Tuesday and next week's Monday and Tuesday are national holidays in Turkey. We didn't want to take an unnecessary risk by releasing a larger patch when there would be fewer developers to address potential problems. Of course, this just means that the content will be bundled into another update and not a halt of production.

RIP MP for real this week.