[research] Celtic Tribes

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Germanic Celt

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Seek n Destroy said:
Some will change, I've been taking notes from some French books about Gallic language.
Sounds good. Anyway, I have some images from EB II that I found online (since I'm not great at taking screenshots). Not sure if these are references or even helpful in any way. In any case, I might as well post them since EB is well known to be accurate.

They're all of Bataroi. That reminds me: is the montefortino helmet used by the Romans and Etruscans currently accurate for Celtic use? I've seen quite a lot of re-enactors as well as me seeing it in EB on Celtic units.
 

rgcotl

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well since we started to make celtic clothes and idea is to split celtic tribes to the ones with existed in 300BC
we got an problem with the clothe pattens

so if anyone had any good source or idea how to attach one or another celtic clothe pattern to one or another tribe it would be good to hear it while we havent started to randomize thems

as always our priority celtic tribes near the itally or in italy like Senones, Boii, Veneti, Liguri...
 

Germanic Celt

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rgcotl said:
well since we started to make celtic clothes and idea is to split celtic tribes to the ones with existed in 300BC
we got an problem with the clothe pattens

so if anyone had any good source or idea how to attach one or another celtic clothe pattern to one or another tribe it would be good to hear it while we havent started to randomize thems

as always our priority celtic tribes near the itally or in italy like Senones, Boii, Veneti, Liguri...
All I know is that the Liguri would have more plain clothing. As for the others, are you sure that the cloth patterns would not be shared among similar tribes and not specific to each one? If it is the latter, then the only way I can think of it working would be based on archaeological evidence from the regions they inhabited. From what I've seen the Celts are often portrayed as all sharing similar patterns due to the same culture. Obviously there would likely be differences in the clothing patterns between the Britons and the mainland Celts, but that doesn't make a difference to the Cisalpine Gauls you're concerned about. The only tribe specific thing I can think of is the Boii perhaps having patterns more closely related to those of the Hallstatt kingdoms due to their closeness to that part of Europe.

I feel as though this post will get succeeded by matmohair1 or someone similar giving images and sources which relate exactly to what you're looking for.
 

Heinrik von Waiblingen

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Venetes and Liguri are NOT celtic tribes, this is a huge philological mistake. Ligurians were not indoeuropeans at all and Venetians were probably an italic tribe (Gaio Plinio Secondo, Naturalis Historia, III, 130).

But yes, they were really influenced by celts, etruscans and romans as well. The West-Ligurians were also really connected to the greek colony of Massalia for close-border question and mixed marriages (Giustino, Historiarum Philippicarum T. Pompeii Trogi Libri XLIV, 43, 3, 8-11). By the way the East-Ligurians - those others on the Appennines - were cultural influenced by Etruscans and Celts above all on religion and on panoply.

For venetians I recommend you this RTW II fan-made mod, I found this quite accurate: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=272975090&searchtext=veneti
I would change the bronze hoplite cuirass with something more "rough" and old, and I would also added more type of helmets but for the rest is a good starting point.

For ligurians another RTW II fan-made mod as well: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=279923583&searchtext=veneti
This is short compared to the first one but I guess it's difficult to re-enact many ligurian warriors because they were famous to be poor and to use "strange" weapons.
 

Eoforhild

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Gallic Noble & Infantryman, 4th-3rd century BC

Gaesaete, 3rd-1st century BC
Typical Celtic/Gallic warrior of the 3th-1st century BC. From "gae" (Generic for -"spear")
these were in general spear warriors, but in particular the kind of naked infantry described
by ancient authors like Polybius. Those from the Rhône valley in particular were famous mercenaries.


Gallic Ambactos, 3rd century BC(?)
Ancient elite client-warrior, driven from the warrior society, picked-up, lavishly paid and equipped
by a celtic war chieftain. Their devotion was absolute. They were equipped with the best gear available
-perhaps one grade below the "Soldurii". "Ambactos" means "servant" but in this context more like bodyguard.


Taurini Spathari, 5th-4th century BC
Ancient Celtic warrior from the northern Italy area (near Turin), armed with the longsword (spatha).
Gaes (javelins) were thrown before the charge. The highly pointed Marne-type helmet is typical from the Halstatt period (V-IVth Cent. BC).


Cingetos, 50 BC
Professional Gallic warrior, armed with a Lancia (spear) and a longsword in the time of Julius Caesar.


I also recommend the artwork done by Vincent Pompetti, as he has done quite a few celtic related works. Feel free to visit his deviant art for a wide selection of intricate illustrations.

http://pegasusandco.deviantart.com/gallery/48658785/Celtic-and-Roman-world​
 

matmohair1

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Déorláf said:
Gallic Ambactos, 3rd century BC(?)
Ancient elite client-warrior, driven from the warrior society, picked-up, lavishly paid and equipped
by a celtic war chieftain. Their devotion was absolute. They were equipped with the best gear available
-perhaps one grade below the "Soldurii". "Ambactos" means "servant" but in this context more like bodyguard.

:grin: interesting and brilliant, thanks!

 

vaso

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thanks for this mod!
may be it be interesting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sz_0EDjDIIc
 

matmohair1

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D: RAETIA, NORICUM & ALPES
1: Auxiliary infantryman of the Lepontii; Raetia,


"Graves at Giubiasco give us good archaeological evidence for
the early auxilia recruited among Celtic Alpine peoples for the
army of Augustus, including the spear, sword and scabbard,
and Celtic shield with an umbo applied over its central
reinforcing keel. The bronze helmet is of Negau Alpine
typology of the Castiel group.
"

Roman Army Units in the Western Provinces (V.1)
31 BC to AD 195 - (Osprey Men-at-Arms 506) 2016


so it seems a lot of earlier items and equipment may
have survived in use for longer than previously thought!
here are more armor styles for comparison
and unit diversity inspirations...



 

matmohair1

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statuette in the Museum of Brittany, Rennes,
probably depicting Brigantia/Brigid: c. 1st century AD,
with iconography derived from Roman statues of Minerva


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BTW :grin: I've noticed something interesting regarding Earlier Hallstatt archeology ...




a lot of the equipment acquired in Central Europe,
seem to reflect that of other Mediterranean societies,
for example.... far left: Villanovan Italy / far right: Iron Age Greek


Corinthian helmet from Baux-de-Provence, France (mid 6th c. BC)

:arrow: https://www.academia.edu/4457711/Le_casque_corinthien_des_Baux-de-Provence



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so its interesting to emulate the same situation within
the context of the 3rd century BC. For example, providing
some Celtic elites with both Etruscan and Roman equipment...

 

Heinrik von Waiblingen

Sergeant at Arms
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matmohair1 said:


statuette in the Museum of Brittany, Rennes,
probably depicting Brigantia/Brigid: c. 1st century AD,
with iconography derived from Roman statues of Minerva


------------------------------------

BTW :grin: I've noticed something interesting regarding Earlier Hallstatt archeology ...




a lot of the equipment acquired in Central Europe,
seem to reflect that of other Mediterranean societies,
for example.... far left: Villanovan Italy / far right: Iron Age Greek


Corinthian helmet from Baux-de-Provence, France (mid 6th c. BC)

:arrow: https://www.academia.edu/4457711/Le_casque_corinthien_des_Baux-de-Provence



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so its interesting to emulate the same situation within
the context of the 3rd century BC. For example, providing
some Celtic elites with both Etruscan and Roman equipment...

That is absolutely great, wonder how that corinthian helmet ended up in Provence.
In any case your last point is really true and interesting, people used to trade, and everyone was aware of the other improved technology on armors and weapons. Having nobilities and high-ranked soldiers dressed up with some foreign piece of armor would really improve the immersion in my opinion.
 

matmohair1

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Updated...



Bronze statue of a naked Celtic warrior with horned helmet and torc.
Northern Italy, 3rd Century BC,  Antikensammlung Berlin (Berlin antiquities collection)



Celtic helmet crests






details from the Gundestrup cauldron








Glanum mausoleum helmets

:arrow: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glanum#Mausoleum_of_the_Julii

:arrow: http://world4.eu/gallic-gallo-roman-helmets/










Arch of Orange, helmets and equipment











Bronze helmet with cutouts for ears and attachment points for horns, 300 BC,
found in Rhine river near Düsseldorf. German National Museum, Nuremberg

:arrow: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:GNM_-_La_T%C3%A9ne_Helm_2.jpg


Celtic equipment on roman coins
Caesars Gallic wars - notice the wolf-head axe


Arch of Carpentras  :arrow: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arch_of_Carpentras


Le Trophée augustéen de Saint-Bertrand-de-Comminges
(restitution proposée par Emmanuelle Boube), 13-10 av. n. ère.

:arrow: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Collections_du_Conseil_d%C3%A9partemental_de_la_Haute-Garonne

:arrow: https://mastersfdl.hypotheses.org/232


Saddle reconstruction


mail shirt, reconstruction


Nesactium situla  :arrow: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nesactium



Žerovnišček statuette of the god Mars

:arrow: av.zrc-sazu.si/pdf/60/AV_60_Laharnar.pdf