yeah I do agree. MP has clearly been low priority for them for a long time. Regrettably lower numbers now will only convince them to stick to their SP drive.
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Reminder that even with an overwhelming negative response to the MP, Taleworlds won't change any fundamental design decision.
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All they have to do is release server files, honestly i don't care about the native anymore and so does 99% of the community who knows you play mount and blade not for the native, but for the mods. My favorite MP mods are being delayed for months if not years because TW does not know how to put their priorities right.
Considering the absolute horrid performance of the Native Servers right now I second the release of custom server files. It can't be worse than what we have right now.
A more equipment-based system allows balance through changing item stats and gold cost. You can only balance through stats at the moment. Though you can somewhat mimic this by swapping perk spot from 1st "major" perk to 2nd "minor" perk option.
Another issue is that you still get redundant items. (If I want to use jareed in melee mode and just drop the flyessa)
With equipment based system you can introduce very minor perks that do minor stuff. For example; upgrading shield to have spikes. It would make shield more heavy, but give you pierce (?) (I can't remeber what dmg type bash currently has) and higher base damage.
If you wanted to implement this in the current system, people would, rightly, complain that their range of viabe options went down.
Another issue is that you still get redundant items. (If I want to use jareed in melee mode and just drop the flyessa)
With equipment based system you can introduce very minor perks that do minor stuff. For example; upgrading shield to have spikes. It would make shield more heavy, but give you pierce (?) (I can't remeber what dmg type bash currently has) and higher base damage.
If you wanted to implement this in the current system, people would, rightly, complain that their range of viabe options went down.
No my in game name has more letters.
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DainMorgot
Sergeant
Warband SP is crap compared to BL, yes. Warband SP was all about mods. It was barren when it came out and it stayed barren. Mods fixed that. Is BL Inferior to WB mods like Pendor? Also yes.
You post this same picture every time someone says the Bannerlord servers are empty. You post it despite there being analytical, definitive proof that Bannerlord servers are empty. Until you can show us ANYTHING that proves that these people are playing native multiplayer (they arent), you are only proving to yourself that everyone is playing singleplayer.By that logic DainMorgot;
And warband is often on sale for a few quid; whereas Bannerlord remains expensive. Not even to mention players might be prohibited from playing bannerlord due to system requirements. As you said "the Numbers do not lie"....
....
Is Bannerlord singleplayer 3x better then warbands? ... or is there perhaps more going on....?
Maybe taking a picture of player counts doesn't really get to the detail of why bannerlords MP retention is so low. I would never suggest that bannerlords increased SP player count makes it directly superior to Warband as it stands.
What does this picture actually add to the conversation that Bannerlord multiplayer is empty? If anything this picture supports that Bannerlord multiplayer is a disappointment compared to its predecessor, because when combined with the pictures showing the games server lobbys side by side it proves that proportionally a larger majority of players are playing warband for its multiplayer rather than singleplayer.
The fact that Warband has more people on its multiplayer servers despite having 12000 less people physically in game is an absolute death blow to the optics of Bannerlord multiplayer.
There is nothing wrong with the pictures you posted, but trying to spin them into a narrative that Bannerlord multiplayer is somehow doing better than it is is just not correct. In a vacuum, you could definitely look at the numbers and suggest that people could come back to Bannerlord multiplayer due to the playercount already being there. Unfortunately this is march of 2021 and not march of 2020. Theyve had a full year to work on multiplayer (2 including the alpha, where we originally outlined every single problem they currently have) and the only content that they can really point to would be 3? (4?) new maps and a clan battle system which would be 0% necessary if they allowed custom servers to work the way everyone was hoping. I guess pike bracing as well? Point is people are 100% justified to not be confident anymore. People have a right to be excited about Duel and Battle coming, but when it takes them a year and a half to develop 2 gamemodes that most people assumed would be in the game at launch it really doesnt paint a good picture for the timeline of future content.
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I wasn't doing any of this. Indeed I have myself said many times today that MP retention is abysmal. I was just trying to say stop this type of weird hypocritical statement;
You can't just link a picture showing more people playing Warband MP as proof Warband MP is better; while at the same time see a picture showing more people playing Bannerlord SP and say Warband SP (albeit with mods) is better...
None of these individual statements are necessarily false but this logic doesn't work.
Context is everything.
DainMorgot
Sergeant
Mate, the servers have pin point accuracy on members playing at the given moment. SP does not. You can argue that some people are making in matchmaking but we both know the number ain't big. It's solid enough proof that WB is being played by more people. And on top of that, BOnline has 4k at nearly all times. Not sure why you defend the MP, it's trash. Want more proof? Constant 3v3 skirmish matches.
I dont mean to call you out specifically about it, but seeing people point to the number of people in game, with no context regarding the amount actually in multiplayer and even partially suggest "look! multiplayer fine!" drives me up the wall like nothing else.
We can literally see exactly how many people are in-game right now.... Just saying more people play x is not a justifiable argument.
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord - Steam Charts
An ongoing analysis of Steam's player numbers, seeing what's been played the most.
More people play Bannerlord SP; that doesn't make it better.
I'm absolutely not saying MP is fine. I just don't think think generalisations are good - especially when they can be used to "prove" the opposite about SP. If it's okay for DainMargot to use that as evidence against the BL MP; can I use the same logic to defend the BL SP? I don't think either works.
Bannerlord having more SP players then Warband - does not by any margin make it automatically better in every respect.
DainMorgot
Sergeant
We can literally see exactly how many people are in-game right now.... Just saying more people play x is not a justifiable argument.
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord - Steam Charts
An ongoing analysis of Steam's player numbers, seeing what's been played the most.steamcharts.com
More people play Bannerlord SP; that doesn't make it better.
Bannerlord SP is better than warband's, because it has the same freedom and more features. Even with if not fully finalized SP is extremely playable and allows customization to whatever ends you want. MP on the other hand, is trash. The numbers dont lie, the servers are empty for a reason and scream 'fail'. You might want to continue to live in denial that bannerlord has a healthy population and that's up to you, really, but the numbers are against you, in the extreme sense. Literally less than 200 people play bannerlord native MP right now out of those 16k peak you posted.
DainMorgot
Sergeant
But I am not a white knight, because Bannerlord's SP IS better than Warband's. From weapon variety, armor variety, diplomacy, barter, smithing, commands on troops, shops. Everything is better than the barren game warband's SP is. It's very evident. Also, what else is evident is that people ignore the multiplayer aspect of native because it's an unenjoyable cluster**** with forced classes, bad combat, horrible optimization on servers and barren gameplay. Even one of the main aspects of the character creation which is height, is bugged. The higher your character, the more animation-skipping you have. They could not even fix that. There's 0 flavour in MP, nor personalization, nor interest, nor engagement.
More items for perks/more perks would really help the class system I think, like more armor(medium/heavy/extra for the heavy inf), much more weapon choices so you can customize your loadout to your liking and to what the situation requires more accurately.
Correct me if I'm wrong but if we added the same amount of weapons/armor as warband had to Bannerlord for each class wouldn't it be very similar to Warband's system, or maybe even, because there would be much more choices per class, it would actually surpass Warband?
Correct me if I'm wrong but if we added the same amount of weapons/armor as warband had to Bannerlord for each class wouldn't it be very similar to Warband's system, or maybe even, because there would be much more choices per class, it would actually surpass Warband?
I think you absolutely can use that logic to defend Bannerlord SP. Bannerlord SP is objectively better than Warband SP with more features, better graphics, great music and immersive environments. The combat problems which plague multiplayer dont really effect SP that much, in fact I have a thread about how the basic combat in SP actually feels better than MP. Unlike MP, the problems with SP can be pointed at content which simply hasnt been added yet, rather than monumentally bad design decisions which completely kill the future of the game.We can literally see exactly how many people are in-game right now.... Just saying more people play x is not a justifiable argument.
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord - Steam Charts
An ongoing analysis of Steam's player numbers, seeing what's been played the most.
More people play Bannerlord SP; that doesn't make it better.
I'm absolutely not saying MP is fine. I just don't think think generalisations are good - especially when they can be used to "prove" the opposite about SP. If it's okay for DainMargot to use that as evidence against the BL MP; can I use the same logic to defend the BL SP? I don't think either works.
And posting multiplayer screenshots of the active server numbers arent "generalizations" They tell a definitive story about which game players prefer. Its inexcusable that most people prefer Warband when the competitor is 10 years newer, a lot shinier, and in active development with (in theory) regular updates. The numbers really point to a lack of optimism regarding MP, which we can logically say is due to the design decisions we have pointed out.
The singleplayer, meanwhile, does not share that lack of optimism. Personally im downright excited for the future of Bannerlord SP.
if ur not tork 789, then stop posting those useless pictures about comparsion of the numbers and cut down the offtopic. bannerlord has higher amount of players across both: the sp and the mp, however the numbers of MP are higher in warband, which is easy to understand if you actually try to play Bannerlord, most of the skirmish matches are 3v3 atm, and I am not even mentioning BL:O online with their 4k people daily online. I honestly don't know how you can discuss this for 1 entire page LMAO
I confirm btw
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.... I have never disagreed with any part of this statement. ??
@AxiosXiphos It’s not constructive feedback that’s the issue, it’s your decision to use a combative tone and harsh stance towards criticism that irks members here
Warband currently has 4921 players (https://steamcharts.com/cmp/261550,48700) and 1281 are in MP (http://www.mnbcentral.net/).
Bannerlord has 16,428 players and estimated* 224 in MP (not counting BLO).
*Estimated 9 players in NA matchmaking (one captain 6v6, one captain 3v3) and 60 players in EU matchmaking (1 skirmish 6v6, 1 skirmish 3v3, and 3 captain 6v6, one captain 3v3) and 146 in custom servers.
I'd be interested to see what percent of Bannerlord players have tried MP at some point, and feedback on why they didn't continue playing it. The vast majority are "casual" players and their thoughts might not align with the common statements on the forums from dedicated players.
Bannerlord has 16,428 players and estimated* 224 in MP (not counting BLO).
| Total Current Players | MP Players | Ratio | |
| Warband | 4921 | 1281 | 26.03% |
| Bannerlord | 16428 | 224 | 1.36% |
*Estimated 9 players in NA matchmaking (one captain 6v6, one captain 3v3) and 60 players in EU matchmaking (1 skirmish 6v6, 1 skirmish 3v3, and 3 captain 6v6, one captain 3v3) and 146 in custom servers.
I'd be interested to see what percent of Bannerlord players have tried MP at some point, and feedback on why they didn't continue playing it. The vast majority are "casual" players and their thoughts might not align with the common statements on the forums from dedicated players.
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