Religion Thread

[Dryvus]

 

[kurczak]

隐藏

I'm a topical nihilist. I believe that there is no real topic here, that there is no such thing as possibly contributing to it and it is definitely meaningless.

Then piss off? 

Existential nihilism is either a con to hit on college chicks or depression. In case of the latter, seek professional help.

I've identified as an existential nihilist since high school, and I never tried to hit on college chicks. I was also depressed for a good period of time, but as I went through the process of receiving professional help, my therapist helped me realize that my belief in existential nihilism was instrumental in pulling me out of that depression. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yeah, sorry about that. I don't remember what that was really about on my part. I still think nihilism is meh, at best, but even for me, the phrasing was at least unnecessarily belligerent. It was probably the husband's fault. Somebody else's, at any rate

Hey people. Need some help about pre-reformed Christian churchs. And opinions.
>Why not Assyrian Church, Coptics? But Orthodox and Catholic?

Hypostatically anathema. Do they even Jesus?

 

[Moose!]

隐藏

I'm a topical nihilist. I believe that there is no real topic here, that there is no such thing as possibly contributing to it and it is definitely meaningless.

Then piss off? 

Existential nihilism is either a con to hit on college chicks or depression. In case of the latter, seek professional help.

I've identified as an existential nihilist since high school, and I never tried to hit on college chicks. I was also depressed for a good period of time, but as I went through the process of receiving professional help, my therapist helped me realize that my belief in existential nihilism was instrumental in pulling me out of that depression. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yeah, sorry about that. I don't remember what that was really about on my part. I still think nihilism is meh, at best, but even for me, the phrasing was at least unnecessarily belligerent. It was probably the husband's fault. Somebody else's, at any rate

No worries, it's not like there aren't nihilists who act like that. I'm not committed to existential nihilism because I think that it will always lead to good outcomes for people (clearly, it doesn't in all cases). I simply think that it's the most accurate description of our external reality, and that it can lead to positive outcomes for individuals (and potentially societies) under certain circumstances (namely, by allowing individuals to identify and adhere to value systems that work best for them in their current circumstances).

Circumstances.

 

[Eктωρ]

I'm a tropical nihilist, it's heat and mosquitoes all the way down.

 

[Calradianın bilgesi]

So apparently some christian denominations believe God does not punish you for your evil deeds.
I presume many members of these denominations also believe in retributive justice. It seems odd to me that these people think it's just to punish people for the sake of retribution when even God doesn't do that? How do they resolve this tension?

 

[kurczak]

Are you talking about the general of concept of absolution or something more niche like predestination or something very niche apokatastasis?

 

[Calradianın bilgesi]

No this one:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_fide
Am I incorrect in interpreting this as 'all sincere believers go to heaven and all disbelievers go to hell'?
I am told some denominations do not even allow for different degrees of heaven in which case believers are not punished retributively in any way?

 

[kurczak]

I wouldn't say that sola fide means that God doesn't punish for evil deeds. It's that men are assumed to do evil deeds all the time due to mankind's fallen nature. But some men are spared the righteous retribution on account of their faith. Retribution, the gangsta Old Testament way, is the default and it will happen to a plenty people.

In everyday life the faith spontaneously manifests itself in good works, but you are not saved because of the works (which can be done by irredeemed unfaithful too), the works are just a byproduct of what really saves you - faith. At least that's the most sense I can make of the doctrine.

As for degrees of heaven, that question is out my league

 

[pentagathus]

Well as long as God doesn't forbid retributive justice then I don't see why these people wouldn't seek it - it's a natural human impulse and it is probably necessary for maintaining a society.

 

[Calradianın bilgesi]

But some men are spared the righteous retribution on account of their faith. Retribution, the gangsta Old Testament way, is the default and it will happen to a plenty people.

But doesn't this 'some men' include all believers. That's a pretty big group that makes you question what the 'default' really is.

it's a natural human impulse and it is probably necessary for maintaining a society

That's not punishing people for the sake of retribution though. I would consider that as punishment for deterrence. I admit that God also doesn't forbid retributive justice, and there is no literal contradiction. But it looks like when we are dealing with a Christian evil-doer, some people believe both that:
a. Perfectly just God is not going to punish that person
b. It would be unfair if that person was left unpunished
That seems quite odd to me.

 

[kurczak]

But doesn't this 'some men' include all believers. That's a pretty big group that makes you question what the 'default' really is.

"True" believers, yes. It's the default in that had it not been for Jesus's sacrifice all humanity would be doomed. You're born with original sin and until it is cleansed by baptism, you're ****ed. Numerically, it is possible that the saved would vastly outnumber the damned. But chronologically, punishment and damnation is the default.

 

[pentagathus]

Fair points. I dunno, people are weird bro.

 

[rebelsquirrell]

Remember that time daniel predicted the world would end during the rein Alexander the greats successor kingdoms?

Good times

"He said, “Behold, I am going to let you know what will occur at the final period of the indignation, for it pertains to the appointed time of the end.

the ram which you saw with the two horns represents the kings of Media and Persia.

The shaggy goat represents the [v]kingdom of Greece, and the large horn that is between his eyes is the first king. 22 The broken horn and the four horns that arose in its place represent four kingdoms which will arise from his nation, although not with his power."

Lemme know how that end time thing panned out Christians imma go masturbate

 

[Calradianın bilgesi]

This post brought to you by 'my target audience is 0.001% of the human population' gang

 

[Bluehawk]

I expectorate at thee, vile knave. Taste hot phlegm and weep!

 

[kurczak]

An obviously wrong interpretation. The end of times happened in 70 AD.

 

[rebelsquirrell]

So a lot people know the part of the bible where Jesus claims to return "this generation".

Christians respond by saying he means the end time generation not the one contemporary with himself.

Most people don't know how to answer that, so allow me to do a public service.

*INHALES*

The prophecy is question is known as the "Olivet Discourse". It has three versions, Mark 13, Matthew 24, and Luke 21.

In the prophecy Jesus tells the Disciples that they are about to be persecuted, Jerusalem will be destroyed, and there will be a great time of suffering just before Jesus returns.

In Matthew's version Jesus tells the disciples to flee judea when they see the "Abomination of Desolation" that Daniel the prophet spoke of.

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT.

In Daniel 11 there is a king lives at the end time.

He kills a "prince of the covenant" and erects the "Abomination of Desolation" and he is attacked by the "King of the South" at the end time.

All of this takes place within the same generation.

Furthermore Jesus says

9 “Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 10 AT THAT TIME many will [d]fall away and will [e]betray one another and hate one another. 11 Many false prophets will arise and will mislead many. 12 Because lawlessness is increased, [f]most people’s love will grow cold. 13 But the one who endures TO THE END , he will be saved.

He literally warned his disciples that at the time there persecution begins that they will make it to see the end.


Everything Jesus says matches perfectly with the description of the reign of the end times king in Daniel 11



Therefore "this generation" is the generation alive circa 30ish ad

 

[Bromden]

Such a vague, generic prophecy would match perfectly with any moment in history or in the future.

 

[Anarion]

So a lot people know the part of the bible where Jesus claims to return "this generation".

Christians respond by saying he means the end time generation not the one contemporary with himself.

Most people don't know how to answer that, so allow me to do a public service.

*INHALES*

The prophecy is question is known as the "Olivet Discourse". It has three versions, Mark 13, Matthew 24, and Luke 21.

In the prophecy Jesus tells the Disciples that they are about to be persecuted, Jerusalem will be destroyed, and there will be a great time of suffering just before Jesus returns.

In Matthew's version Jesus tells the disciples to flee judea when they see the "Abomination of Desolation" that Daniel the prophet spoke of.

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT.

In Daniel 11 there is a king lives at the end time.

He kills a "prince of the covenant" and erects the "Abomination of Desolation" and he is attacked by the "King of the South" at the end time.

All of this takes place within the same generation.

Furthermore Jesus says

9 “Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 10 AT THAT TIME many will [d]fall away and will [e]betray one another and hate one another. 11 Many false prophets will arise and will mislead many. 12 Because lawlessness is increased, [f]most people’s love will grow cold. 13 But the one who endures TO THE END , he will be saved.

He literally warned his disciples that at the time there persecution begins that they will make it to see the end.


Everything Jesus says matches perfectly with the description of the reign of the end times king in Daniel 11



Therefore "this generation" is the generation alive circa 30ish ad

Sir, this is a McDonald's drive-through.

 

[Captured Joe]

9 “Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and will kill you, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 10 AT THAT TIME many will [d]fall away and will [e]betray one another and hate one another. 11 Many false prophets will arise and will mislead many. 12 Because lawlessness is increased, [f]most people’s love will grow cold. 13 But the one who endures TO THE END , he will be saved.

How do you know for sure this is about the End of Times rather than about persecution of the Christians by, say, the Romans?